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Congratulations to..... ****SPOILERS*** [Ya think! ;)]

Discussion in 'F1' started by Fast_ian, Nov 19, 2012.

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  1. Fast_ian

    Fast_ian Two Time F1 World Champ

    Sep 25, 2006
    23,397
    Campbell, CA
    Full Name:
    Ian Anderson
    #1 Fast_ian, Nov 19, 2012
    The Cans!

    Winning 3 WCC's in a row has been shown to be incredibly difficult. [Only happened twice in the history of the sport.]

    Gotta doff the proverbial cap to the whole team - I'm not a particular fan, but credit where due - Well done guys!

    Now, we just need Newey to go off down some blind alley and do a "Clifford #2" for next year and all will be right with the world. Surely, they can't get 4 in a row, can they?......

    Cheers,
    Ian
     
  2. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 10, 2007
    30,125
    FRA - nice city with a really big airport :)
    #2 DF1, Nov 19, 2012
    They have done well. Next year we get? Basically the same packages etc. They have to be the favorite for the next as well Id say. I guess we will wait and see along with what drama the tires can create :)

    Well done Red Bull team on this constructors title!
     
  3. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    #3 VIZSLA, Nov 19, 2012
    Grumble grumble grumble

    ;)
     
  4. classic308

    classic308 F1 Veteran

    Jan 9, 2004
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    Westchester, NY
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    Paul
    #4 classic308, Nov 19, 2012
    Newey is currently the best designer in F1 and Seb is a top 3 driver-that is the winning formula. That said, I'm waiting to see what wind tunnel dilemma Ferrari will conjure up next year....
     
  5. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

    Feb 18, 2007
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    Florian
    #5 Far Out, Nov 19, 2012
    There aren't a lot of rule changes in 2013, right? 2014 is when it gets exciting...

    (Not that this hasn't been one of the best seasons ever ;))
     
  6. furmano

    furmano Three Time F1 World Champ

    Jul 22, 2004
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    #6 furmano, Nov 19, 2012
    The Red Bull's are so smooth and the Ferrari's are so twitchy, the contrast is huge.

    Specifically, why is this? What is so good about the Red Bull's and what is so bad about the Ferrari's? Is it just aero and if so, what specifically about the aero? Is Ferrari's suspension still a bad design? What is going on?

    I guess if everyone knew the answer, Ferrari would improve their design. Maybe in ten years from now we'll know for sure. Thoughts?

    -F
     
  7. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

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    #7 Far Out, Nov 19, 2012
    There's only so much you can improve with a given car - the RB simply has a different overall concept, and it's the package that works.
     
  8. furmano

    furmano Three Time F1 World Champ

    Jul 22, 2004
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    #8 furmano, Nov 19, 2012
    I haven't kept up with the technical details and differences. I get the overall package of the RB works and the overall package of the Ferrari doesn't.

    What specifically is so different between the Red Bull's and the Ferrari's?

    -F
     
  9. ARTNNYC

    ARTNNYC F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jul 8, 2005
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    #9 ARTNNYC, Nov 19, 2012
    gotta admire the "fizzy drinks company"
    All you UK F1 guys remember who said that?
     
  10. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Oct 3, 2002
    49,621
    @ the wheel
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    Andreas
    #10 tifosi12, Nov 19, 2012
    Kudos also to Renault for winning another F1 championship as engine manufacturer.
     
  11. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    #11 VIZSLA, Nov 19, 2012
    Despite those pesky altenators.
     
  12. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #12 tifosi12, Nov 19, 2012
    Well, hello, they were Magnetti Marelli. The same Magnetti Marelli, which was tied to the Scuderia for years. Coincidence?
     
  13. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    #13 VIZSLA, Nov 19, 2012
    Not you too!

    ;)
     
  14. freshmeat

    freshmeat F1 Veteran

    Aug 30, 2011
    7,284
    #14 freshmeat, Nov 19, 2012
    Very well-deserved for Adrian Newey & team; they have been able to consistently put together a powerful chassis year after year...their mastery of the exhaust blown diffuser technology alone was genius.
     
  15. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #15 tifosi12, Nov 19, 2012
    Any conspiracy theory I'm always first in line. I invented tinfoil. On the grassy knoll at the Idibus Martiis...
     
  16. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #16 VIZSLA, Nov 19, 2012
    Picnicking on the grassy knoll.
     
  17. SPEEDCORE

    SPEEDCORE Four Time F1 World Champ

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    #17 SPEEDCORE, Nov 19, 2012
    Congrats Red Bull Racing. They might be a "drinks team" but they are double the size of Ferrari. They spend 1.2billion on marketing alone. Just remember that next time you say its just a drinks team ;)

    What do you mean it's only happened twice before? :confused:

    Ferrari 1975-76-77
    McLaren 1988-89-90-91
    Williams 1992-93-94
    Ferrari 1999-2000-01-02-03-04

    I have to also disagree that it's been incredibly difficult. If you look at F1 history, one time constructors are less common. When you make it to the top you usually dominate for a few years.

    They really haven't had much competition for Constructors, each of the 3 seasons they have only competed against 1 driver from the team that came 2nd. Had Massa woken up earlier in the season it would of been a different ball game. Mclaren has also had a bad spat of races.

    2010 - RBR drivers 1st and 3rd, Ferrari 2nd and 6th.
    2011 - RBR 1st and 3rd, McLaren 2nd and 5th.
    2012 - RBR 1st* and 5th*, Ferrari 2nd* and 7th*

    * - current standings.
     
  18. Sellnit

    Sellnit Formula Junior

    Mar 22, 2010
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    #18 Sellnit, Nov 19, 2012
    I love an argument backed up by facts.....makes it one sided every time! Well played.
     
  19. Fast_ian

    Fast_ian Two Time F1 World Champ

    Sep 25, 2006
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    #19 Fast_ian, Nov 20, 2012
    Oops! :embaressed:

    You are, of course, absolutely right. My bad. I was thinking of 3 x consecutive WDC's.....

    Good point - However, even your (correct ;)) #'s above confirm 4 or more has only been done twice - It ain't easy.......

    Cheers,
    Ian
     
  20. TifosiUSA

    TifosiUSA F1 Veteran

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    #20 TifosiUSA, Nov 20, 2012
    The glory days...
     
  21. subirg

    subirg F1 Rookie

    Dec 19, 2003
    4,369
    Cheshire
    #21 subirg, Nov 20, 2012
    So in summary for 2012:-

    - Redbull had a better overall concept than Ferrari, did a great job of developing the package, and had a top 3 wheel man to bring home the trophies. Job well done.
    - Ferrari had an utterly pantaloons concept, did an ok job of developing the package, and had a miraculous driver to keep them in with a chance of a WDC that, with respect, they had no right to expect to be competing for
    - McLaren had the best package at the start of the season and completely dropped the ball on both car development, and overall race team performance thereby gifting away golden WCC and WDC opportunities. Go to the back of the class. No milk at bed time.
    - The rest - thanks for showing up, but a special mention goes to Renault and Kimster for outperforming expectations
     
  22. Fast_ian

    Fast_ian Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Ian Anderson
    #22 Fast_ian, Nov 20, 2012
    Seems a little "harsh". They're likely to get 2nd in the WCC, with only one driver for half the year, so Clifford can't be *that* bad.....

    If you knew the answer I'm sure Maranello would come a knockin'...... ;)

    Short answer - The Cans are quicker! :)

    Seriously, they're actually not - at least not in a straight line. I could be wrong, but believe they're consistently ~10mph down on most of the others. Amazingly, HRT were super quick going straight too for a few races - After I learnt that, I suggested they should crank on some D/F and give 'er a go.

    Same with the others IMO - Losing 10mph gains you a pretty significant amount of DF and may just make 'em quicker over a complete lap. I just don't get why (it seems?) they haven't tried. Should be pretty easy to balance it F to R given all their sensors & data.

    Damn, back in the dark ages all we had most times was someone on a radar gun - We'd try and match (up or down) the top speed of the fastest guy to see what difference it made to us - Sometimes good, others not so much - But at least we tried......

    Cheers,
    Ian
     
  23. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    #23 Bas, Nov 20, 2012
    I think that the thing that hurt Ferrari the most this season is single lap pace. Race pace has been pretty decent all season. As Ian says, Clifford might not be such a big dog after all. Except when judging on single lap pace ;).
     
  24. Far Out

    Far Out F1 Veteran

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    #24 Far Out, Nov 20, 2012
    +1

    I think the Ferrari is really underrated.
     

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