The Alonso needs to go thread

Bottom line is this: Alonso is far from the ideal driver for Ferrari IMO, but he's the best available, period. End of thread .

 

I often agree with you but not fully this time:

Why is Alonso far from ideal?

And who would be an ideal Ferrari driver?

IMHO Alonso is as good as it gets. I can't think of anybody better (I can think of several equally ideal drivers from the past but nobody better). And yes, Alonso had a checkered past but so do all really greats (except Vettel so far but he isn't just as good as Alonso yet).

 

I meant 'the whole package' . I agree he's one of the top drivers. But he has a lot of negatives... which was the purpose of this thread. And yes, you'd be absolutely right if you point out there's no ideal driver then < he he>. Sorry for the confusion, but my conclusion was the most important part, and the one that matters: there's no better choice for Ferrari right now. In fact, the only better one would probably be Vettel, since he's younger, equal or better driver, and more likeable. Lewis is an even worse 'primadonna'.

 

Come on guys, let's stop with the troll / pointless thread comments, they're getting a little repetitive and tiresome.

We can either debate the point (which some have been doing) or ignore the thread and go do something else with your time.

All the best,
Andrew.

 

Sorry Andrew.

 

Jesus, no! He's embarassing the sacred name....

 

Aren't we allowed just one good bye as we exit the thread?

 

What negatives does he have from the point of view of Ferrari? They are 100% satisfied with him in all aspects of their field (engineering feedback, driving talent, communication, moral, team lead role etc). Nothing personal to you, but they probably don't care about what you think of him as a driver at all.

And skill set wise he is undoubtedly one of the top drivers on the grid today and the most complete driver in all conditions.

I completely disagree with Vettel being "more likeable". Statistically speaking, Alonso is much more popular than Vettel overall...Vettel has the predominantly German fan-base but beyond that it's hard to see him up there with either Alonso or Hamilton.

As Bernie put it, he lacks charisma...

 

The car sucked. The wind tunnel was out of calibration. Everyone knows this. Was "Fred" supposed to be the chief aerodynamisist engineer also?

The car was an also ran this year. All you have to do is look at Massa's average starting position and average practice times. Massa is not that average a driver -- the car just didn't have it in it.

 

I think it was pretty crappy to try to overturn the championship - and I never can shake the feeling that Luca picks up the phone and demands satisfaction from Jean or Bernie.

On the other hand, there is zero basis that Alonso instigated the demand for an investigation, isn't there? Even if he did, I can't really blame him - he's a competitor, he lives to compete and win.

As for firing him, I am no Alonso fan, but TifosiUSA said it well.... if you fire Alonso, who do you hire instead?

Hamilton would be faster D), but he's taken, so is Vettel. Anyone else would be a downgrade. Why downgrade?

 

An also ran that wound up 2nd in the WCC though!..... I know there's 10 teams out there that would have been *delighted* with that result.

OK, it's Ferrari, and they're held to a "higher standard", but to classify Clifford as an also ran seems a little harsh.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Hamilton would be faster?

Hamilton finished behind Alonso in the championship in what is widely believed to be a superior car.
How would he be faster in a slower car?

 

Exactly my point. The difference was Alonso and some clever team manipulation involving Massa.

 

+1

As I said countless times before, I feel that Clifford is considerably underrated. And by the positions Massa got at the end of the season, I can't help feeling that we have rated Alonso too highly.

 

Interesting take on this!!

 

Whether Alonso is rated highly by the public is really not that relevant.........

Alonso has been rated as the best current driver, by his peers......enough said.

 

True to a certain degree.

Clifford was crap at the beginning of the season, over 1s off the pace, but towards the middle and end of the season it was much better and consistently within 3-7 tenths of the pace of the front row. But it was never the outright fastest car, not even on Sunday.

One HUGE advantage Clifford clearly had over its rivals was its reliability, correct me if I'm wrong but it was the only car that did NOT have any mechanical-related DNFs.

That's pretty amazing.

As for Massa's return to form, every driver has his own style and the later wave of Clifford updates and new approach to setting up the car just gradually came back to Massa's style. We saw flashes of this as early as Montreal. Alonso's talent as a driver shows through clearly here; that he is capable of delivering consistent results with inferior equipment whereas Massa is not able to do the same when given the same inferior tools.

 

My opinion, I doubt there are many drivers who could have dragged the 2012 Ferrari to a near title winning position.

 

I aint taking the bait... lets just say a more reliable car..

 

And people want to see him leave SF.....silly poopy heads!

 

I agree with everything Michael, except, I think Alonso is the fastest on the grid. And I speak as someone that feels Ferrari (Luca) got in bed with the devil when they hired someone that knowingly cheated against Ferrari. To me their bad seasons are just karma rearing its ugly head. Until Alonso starts the caustic behaviour he showed at other teams, he is the only one that Ferrari can hire as I doubt that Vettel or Hamilton would have taken that seat. Ferrari is not the team of old that would cause quality drivers to jump at the chance.

 

Funnier comment than the entire movie "Airplane!"

 

Not the outright fastest, but certainly not the eponymous dog IMHO.

Absolutely. Something that isn't mentioned enough during the usual bashing of the Ferrari engineers.

If I'm not mistaken, Ferrari didn't dispute or even downright admit that they used Massa's car for essentially testing purposes for most of the season. That at least would explain a lot, from the big hole he was in to the sudden return to the front of the grid.

As said before, I think we all, me included, thought too bad of Clifford and Massa, and in consequence rated Alonso too highly.