A C4 is a Gentleman's GT car, not some boy racer machine. However Trevor B does boot his around pretty quick. Have you been on the track with him? (Serious question. Just interested how a 308 would go against him. Obviously depends on the tyres, driver, engine tune, state of the suspension etc)
I would never presume to tell the Aussies how to run their state of affairs. I remember reading how Aussies, nz ers ,canadiens, British and us yanks got together for a party some 60 odd years ago and all went well then. I'm guessing that was because all of the attendees had played with party favors before coming to the show. Not living on the other side but hearing how things go there can and will give us a different perspective in how we can make changes here that will improve our lives and I'm thankful for that. I figure that if help was needed in the future then the we could have " another go at it ". Still I can't help but wonder what our grandfathers were thinking sitting in the foxhole together when the Bosch and Nipponese were storm in the wire.
I would never presume to tell the Aussies how to run their state of affairs. I remember reading how Aussies, nz ers ,canadiens, British and us yanks got together for a party some 60 odd years ago and all went well then. I'm guessing that was because all of the attendees had played with party favors before coming to the show. Not living on the other side but hearing how things go there can and will give us a different perspective in how we can make changes here that will improve our lives and I'm thankful for that. I figure that if help was needed in the future then the we could have " another go at it ". Still I can't help but wonder what our grandfathers were thinking sitting in the foxhole together when the Bosch and Nipponese were storm in the wire.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/dan-ehrlich/uk-gun-ownership-up-deaths-down_b_1209967.html Gun deaths last year in the UK at 51 were down by 18 percent , yet private gun ownership continues to grow with 1.8 million legally held. Obviously there's no way of telling how many illegal guns are in circulation. But, before you begin yelling for even tighter gun laws, compare this to the annual American bloodbath.http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/mar/25/gun-ownership-firearms-certificates?INTCMP=SRCH In 2010 there were 12,996 murders in the US. Of those, 8,775 were caused by firearms. But, that figure is small compared to accidental shooting deaths which brings the annual total to more than 30,000.http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state The fact is gun ownership to millions of Americans has become sort of an obsessive-compulsive disorder, almost a reason to be alive...or dead. The offensive defensive posture of the gun lobby and right wing politicians in the wake of the Tucson bloodbath, in which six people died, points out how sensitive and militant these hardy frontier characters are in their pick-ups and RVs. Just give them a gun rack and a "proud to be an American" sticker for the rear bumper of their Japanese car and its almost like being in heaven...a destination some may annually reach. Now, I have nothing against people owning guns for sport or self-defense. I once owned one. What I find about as hard to swallow as a slug from a Colt .45 is their almost sensuous love for these weapons and the need to buy more and more of them, from automatic hand guns to assault rifles. To me, some of these people seem less than civilized morons...morons who feel they have a God given right to buy guns. They feel these weapons will act as a safeguard against tyranny and protector of liberty. Or perhaps they are just powers symbols, similar to owning a pit bull in council flat. They apparently haven't been paying too much attention to national and world events to not notice that the liberties they so cherish are gradually being eroded, and without a shot from their guns being fired in their defense. The US Constitutions guarantees citizens the right to bear arms. But bearing arms doesn't specifically mean owning arms. It means we have the right to carry guns. So, the mere mention of gun control after incidents such as Tucson and its panic stations for the gun lobby. Yet, I have to ask myself are more than 32,000 gun deaths, 9,000 by criminal acts, the mark of a civilized society? Because, as an American I would like to think I'm part of an advanced civilized nation that puts the welfare of its citizens above all other concerns. Firearm injury in the United States averaged 32,300 deaths annually between 1980 and 2006. It's the second leading cause of death from injury after motor vehicle crashes. Firearms are involved in 68% of homicides, 52% of suicides, 43% of robberies, and 21% of aggravated assaults. In the last twenty-four years, an average of 32,300 Americans died each year from firearm Injuries. Firearm death rates in the United States vary by state and may show a correlation between urban wealth and education vs. rural poverty and unsophistication. The states with the highest firearm death rates are California, Louisiana, Alaska, Nevada, Mississippi and Alabama. The states with the lowest rates include Hawaii, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut and New York. Compared to high-income Asian countries (Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong and Japan), the firearm mortality rate in the U.S. is more than 70 times higher (14.24 per 100,000 in the U.S. compared to 0.1925 per 100,000 in Asia). The correlation between firearm availability and rates of homicide is consistent across high-income industrialized nations: where there are more firearms, there are higher rates of homicide overall. The U.S. has among the highest rates of both firearm homicide and private firearm ownership. In 2001 an estimated 35% of U.S. households. Compared to other developed countries, no one can come near the US. The following are gun deaths for 2008: Germany - 381, France - 255, Canada - 165, UK - 68, Australia - 65 and Japan - 39. On the other hand, even the US figures are dwarfed by South Africa where gun murders annually often total more than 30,000 in a nation with one-sixth the US population. Aside from that, you can't escape the conclusion: There's something terribly wrong with America...because these aren't one-off stats...they happen every year. And as economic conditions continue to be depressed and the impoverished numbers grow, so will gun violence. Granted, we are not the most violent nation in the world, but as I said, for developed and so-called civilized societies, we seem to be way out in front.
my uncles use to tell me they though your guys were nuts making all that noise with the Japs just down the road
Sorry about the double post. Big fingers, little keyboard. Maybe a genetic mutation. Oh and for the record. I have never owned a gun,rifle,pistol etc. Well, that's not exactly true. I did have a Daisy Red Ryder BB gun when I was 12. I only got one because Ralphie had one even though everyone said that he would shoot his eye out.
What a tragedy That said gun control in the US is just practically impossible due to the sheer numbers already "out in the wild". They couldn't do a John Howard buy back, even if hte population supported it the cost would bankrupt the country. They need another solution... and they need to figure it out themselves. What I find it particularly sad is that noone has the balls to man up and say just that. Instead there is just the rhetoric of "guns don't kill people - people kill people" and the pushing out of statistics to show that actually it is a minor issue really... unless of course you or one of your loved ones happens to be one of those statistics... While you are right the horse has truly bolted on this... in fact the horse bolted over 200 years ago, ran off with the daughter of the Governor, and their numerous offspring are now the mainstream. I'm sure that the families of the dead children take great comfort in the fact that they are only a very small statistic Relevance? Lake Moondarra is actually a private dam... so the owner can fence it in if they want... just like they would be able to do in the US. Yeah.. that keeps us awake at night... Not Great points
Tony, while you're here, is it true about shootings on the freeways ? [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoazkUVZW9k[/ame] Steve Martin always makes me laugh
These are the correct figures, the Guardian seems to be counting suicides as "accidental shooting deaths" "In the U.S. for 2010, there were 31,513 deaths from firearms, distributed as follows by mode of death: Suicide 19,308; Homicide 11,015; Accident 600." http://library.med.utah.edu/WebPath/TUTORIAL/GUNS/GUNSTAT.html M
'I will never, nor will I try to, understand why the US, a country of undoubted greatness and tremendous contribution to the world, is unable to have an adult debate on the limits to freedom.....freedom to kill innocents'
In 2009: - There were 10,839 fatalities in crashes involving a driver with a BAC of .08 or higher. - There were 11,493 firearm homicides. And these weren't even within the top 15 causes of death in the US. Unless we're going to start ranking life value/importance I think we need to look at mortality overall. There's no doubt that this was a very tragic incident. But so were the 181 children under the age of 14 included in 10,839 fatalities above.
John is there a path to the you tube you are referring to ? I like Steve martin too, he is funny, I remember meeting him at a charity event in Los Angeles years ago. I remember seeing him for the first time on the " Not ready for prime time players ". Janne , those freedoms you were talking about, remember in the movie " The Great Escape " where Danny wanted to put on a show for the goons and sedgwick suggested knuckles ? I think he said something like " What are you doing with my coat you Aussie swine! " Ya, we can't say something like that because that would be slander. I'm sure there is swine there as there is swine here and just because there is does'nt give us,,I don't know about you,,but it doesn't give us the freedom to slander anyone without some sort of repercussions and if you watch that clip then you will how the receiving party felt about being called that. Debate, not really sure if that is the right way. Debates are more me or you, them or us, you or i. Discussions are more constructive, don't you agree ? It seems of late more " English" shows have appeared on American TV. Such as BBC, Top Gear, Ramsey's Kitchen Nightmares. When do you think we will be seeing some of the shows here that they do down under ? Tony
1. Vehicular deaths are rarely intentional. 2. If you adjust for number of hours spent in cars per capita vs. number of hours spent fiddling with guns, you will see that cars are VASTLY safer than guns. 3. We are constantly adjusting the legislation to try and lower vehicular deaths. It seems the NRA and misguided 2nd Amendment supporters are militantly opposed to ANY. 4. Vehicles are made with the primary purpose of providing transport. Like hammers, if their usage results in death, it is not the primary reason for their existence but a sad side-effect. Guns, however, are made for one thing and one thing only, to kill whatever their bullets are fired at. 5. What's the harm in trying it out like the rest of the world. If the numbers don't change in 20 years, fine, let's go back to present-day laws. But, for 20 years, let's give it an honest shot and see if we really can become "civilized" and not have such carnage.
You just have to love the predictably holier-than-though, apoplectic bloviating and pontificating. Keep going, because I need a chuckle on a Sunday morning. As if Australians' (or anyone else's, for that matter) opinions on whether America should ban gun ownership has any bearing whatsoever on the issue. Hilarious! Thanks, CW
well someone has to care about the innocents and point out the childish behaviour and idiotic arguments being made by the pro gun protagonists. I saw a picture of one of those babies killed and she is very similar to my 7 yo grand-daughter with the same bubbly smile and angelic look .... makes me very angry
Yep. Been there, done that. Based upon entrance [passenger rear] and where it hit [driver side sunvisor pivot], at best, it missed my head by less than 3 cm. Coin is 26.5 mm. Upon recovery of bullet fragments, adrenalin got pumping again. Bit of backstory here - along with other gunplay incidents. http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?p=154062#post154062 Image Unavailable, Please Login
