Yes but was really looking forward to getting the F12 . Have even decided on the colour and specs !!!! But was lucky to have brought 3 cars in the last 2 months so using that to console myself now ...
Well, you been blessed and I guess you might just be able to get the F-12... The Govt , hopefully would try and understand and change... Ever Hopeful
On the contrary, the latest measures finally show a closer understanding of reality by the government. The reality that if the ruling party does not take strong measures to address the anger felt by the masses, it will be in danger of losing many, many more seats in the next election. Apart from addressing the anger of the masses towards mass immigration, they are also tackling the big gap between the haves and the have nots in Singapore. The latest increase in ARF has nothing to do with collecting a few more dollars for the state coffers. (The state has plenty of money. Its budget surplus runs into billions every year.) It has little to do with the controlling the number of vehicles on the roads. This is done through the COE mechanism which allows a controlled growth in the number of cars every year. Growth - not reduction. (In this regard, your assumption that COE is a mechanism to REDUCE the number of cars on the roads is incorrect.) The latest increase in ARFs is to show the have nots that the government is taxing the rich more severely. To make them contribute more to society. Like the wealth tax in a lot of developed countries, this is to make the have nots feel better (if only slightly) by making them feel that the government is doing something to make the wealthy share more of their wealth with the nation. Together with the other measures implemented (and to be implemented in the near future), the government hopes to quell some of the anger of the masses. Why does the government not set a fixed value for COEs? This stems from the capitalistic and socialistic ideals of the government of the day. Why collect S$50k for a COE when you can collect S$90k? If you are collecting S$50k for something worth S$90k, aren't you subsidising the person who bought the COE by S$40k? Which is more equitable? Benefiting this one person or family by a S$40k subsidy - or using the additional S$40k collected for the benefit of the state (i.e. the people). Also, what negative impact to auto sales? The number of cars have been growing year on year. COEs have risen to sky high levels and looks set to continue this trend. Also, the increased ARF does not affect the lower end vehicles. It only affects the "rich" who buy high end cars. Finally, although we complain about COEs, we should think a little more about the problem. At its most basic, it is a simple one. Singapore is a small country. There's little space to build more roads. But as country gets more wealthy, more people can afford cars. What does one do to control unbridled growth from turning Singapore into a Bangkok where bumper to bumper traffic prevails through all hours? We can have little or no taxes on cars. But are you prepared to spend 1.5 or more hours crawling from Bukit Timah to Shenton Way? But if we control the number of cars, what is the criteria one uses to determine who gets to own and drive a car? The government has long decided that meritocracy shall be the guiding principle for the development of its people. If you work hard, or smart, and earn more, you shall (in the context of cars) have the privilege of paying for the right to own and drive a car. (Of course there are the trust fund kids but we can exclude them, as in the scheme of things they form but a very minute percentage of society as a whole). There are, of course, other models/mechanisms. We can try luck - i.e. we ballot for the COEs. Would you trust random luck? Or your own ability to work hard/smart? What about need? And what is "need"? A family with 2 kids and 2 grandparents should get priority over the singles or the married couple with no kids? Should the travelling salesman get priority over the doctor? Teacher over the soldier? Men over women? Your irritating neighbours with 5 kids over you? If anyone has a workable solution to the problem, maybe they would like to raise it for discussion here.
and they decimated the luxury condo sector already with this stamp duty nonsense. it was the foreigners who prop up that sector, now entry price for foreigners are 15% higher than locals, yet at exit (sale price) both groups are in parity. hence the elimination of the foreign buyer. What you have left are wealthy sinagpore buyers yet they are way tooooo savvy to buy at these rich premiums. Result being very little transactions. This was Foreign Direct Investments which trickle down to all supporting industries (agents, lawyers, decorators, contractors). Now the FDI has stopped. I was offer bishopgate today by agent, units are 2300-6000 sq ft. I asked how much a sq ft. She said $3400. That's $8-20mn a unit. Wow, that's 2007-8 pricing. This is not HK or London with limited developable land. SG in district 10-11 have an endless supply of sites to develop or redevelop. And there are many more high end units in the pipeline for launch. It's impossible for this country with a population of 5mn+ to support such a supply of high end units especially without any foreign puchasers. Bishopgate has 48 units on offer, none are sold to date. The mass sector is driven mainly by owner occupied investments. Free market economies are suppose to run on demand and supply. As long as you provide enough public housing for the masses the private sector should not be tamper with in such fashion. Sillypore resembles France these days, tax the crap outta the rich.
Show me clear proof that the COE policy for the past 18 months has caused a reduction of vehicles on the road or will in the near future. Show me proof that the current # of cars on the road causes intolerable traffic issues. What criteria is being used to determine acceptable level of traffic. Compare to other major cities in the world I had no issue with traffic conditions in the past few years. My point is they try to fix something that was not broken. This tinkering to reduce allocation of COE's decimated a sector of auto industry. This policy should be challenge by the WTO for unfair trade practices toward the lower price auto segment since the COE comprises of a higher % of its purchase price compare to luxury car. Who has ever heard of the top seller in any country being BMW? and not toyota. This exact goal you refer to about equalling the playing ground for the masses to enjoy auto ownership has no impact. Even though they reduce the ARF for less costly cars that only makes up a small fraction of the car cost. Typical arf for new jap cars run 20-30k, yet the coe is still $80k+, so the impact for that sector is nonsensical.
Hopefully , maybe will just have to wait for a couple of years and look for a used unit instead ... No way am i going to spend 1.5 m on a car ...
If you read what I said earlier again, you will see that I said that the COE is NOT a tool to REDUCE the number of cars on the road. It is a mechanism to determine who gets the right to own and drive a car on our roads. There is no plan to reduce the number of cars on the road. Only a plan to control the growth. I cannot remember the exact figures but in the days of cheap COEs a few years ago, the allowed growth was something like 3 or 4% p.a. but in recent times reduced to about 1.5% p.a. And no, I did not say that the government is trying to equal the ground for the masses to enjoy auto ownership. I said that the government is trying to appease the masses, to quell the anger, etc by taxing the rich more to make the masses think that the government is forcing the wealthy to share their wealth with the nation. A purely political reason. The only good news from the budget is that the government has not made it any cheaper or easier for the masses to own or drive the cars. Nothing has changed for them. But the growth in the number of cars on the road has indeed been quite apparent. Journey times at peak hours now are much longer. Anecdotal evidence indicates that travelling time has increased by about 50%. My own experience of driving into the CBD every morning from the Holland Road area is that this is about right. A journey that used to take about 15 mins just only 5-8 years ago now takes about 25 mins. "Intolerable"? Perhaps not yet. But still not pleasant. If they do not control the growth at 1.5% p.a., we will indicate see Bangkok like conditions in no time at all.
If you think about it carefully, this is not nonsensical from PAP's point of view. From the investor's point of view, yes. But certainly not from PAP's point of view. This is political survival for them. One of the main grouses of the masses is the runaway house prices. They are extremely unhappy that prices of apartments/houses in good areas (and even some not so good areas) are running away from them. They see that only the very rich or the foreigners are the ones who are able to afford that nice apartment in Districts 9, 10, 11 and in the Marina Bay and Sentosa. Your statement that "as long as you provide enough public housing for the masses the private sector should not be tamper with in such fashion" will ring hollow with the masses. They are thinking "Singapore is my country, why should all the nice apartments in the nice areas go to the very rich and the foreigners only?". They see the good life going beyond them. They see themselves as second class citizens in their own country. Que the mass xenophobia ... The policy of the government is now clear to me. It is to depress the prices of properties. You have seen round after round of measures intended to push property prices down. Not just to stabilise the prices. To push them down. Every time some measure fails, new ones are introduced. The huge increase in property taxes, especially on investment properties, is yet another measure. If this still does not work, there WILL be more measures in the future. the PAP is fighting for its survival. They need to bring the prices down to a more reasonable level by 2015-2016 before the next general elections. You are quite right that from a pure investment/growth standpoint, these measures do not make much economic sense. But from a purely political standpoint, it makes perfect sense. From the point of view of the wealthy, like most of the forummers here, it should make good sense too. After all, you want the PAP to remain in government don't you? And won't you support their drastic attempts to remain in power? As bad as their policies might seem to you now, would you rather the WP came into power? I shudder to think of that day!
Maybe when the dealers down you in alcoholic drinks.... you wont be thinking straight enough to hold the strings to your purse. Wahaba
Do any of these measures truly allow the masses to purchase luxury condos in district 10 and 11? They are called luxury for a reason, if all the masses can own them then it would no longer be luxurious. The dam has already broken in 2007-8 when the property prices ran up. How do you force prices down in a free market economy without destroying existing home owners asset values and bankrupting bullish developers who operated on existing policies at the time? How does a developer pay a premium for an auction land site from the govt then overnite have the govt implement new policies that puts his financial projections immediately in the red? This is behavior of banana countries, not a supposed world class city. I make it clear i am no friend of developers. I just find this way of governing with no proper planning and sticking to the plan as very unacceptable. Your conclusion is correct. These are political decisions catering to a certain segment of the population and not based on what is good for the country as a whole.
back to the topics of cars. did the luxury and exotic sport car sector just get screw overnite again? so that's an add'l 200-300k on a new ferrari or lambo
But people will still buy 'em... 200-300k is peanuts to some! Ever heard of businessmen spending 500k/month at 5 star nightclubs...witnessed a 60k bidding spree on garlands at one of the nightclubs myself personally..
It is, we called it the Black Monday for Singapore car industry. Loan term is now capped at 50-60%+5years max so the 2nd hand market will be affected too. Very drastic measures if you ask me, you cannot afford new cars but you also cannot afford to sell cos it'll cost a lot of cash to buy a used one too though the later can be overcome with creative accounting. Lets see the effect in the next 6 months.
so well put. succinct and precise. the masses don't see things as an investor. the masses don't relate to facts or logic. they rely on sentiments, which is why, now that many of them have united under the WP banner, WP can send in monkeys to run in the next election and still win another seat or two, all things else being constant. with 7 rounds of cooling measures in place already, the intent of the government to lower property prices is clear. if this 7th round doesn't bring down the medium prices, then there will be an 8th round and 9th round. i don't think there is any doubt, whatsoever, about this. i believe the root problem lies in the lack of finesse or interest in the redistribution of wealth by the government, an over-emphasis by the government to act more like a business than a government, and a sense of entitlement by the people (a failure of our education system and culture).
Hi Jon Do you know of a good and reasonable price workshop in Singapore that can respray and patch up old classic porker ?? Have a friend looking but he was quoted something like 15-20 k for the job . Thanks in advance .
bro, the reality is the govt does not understand and these actions do not solve the problem. The reality is it's going to lose more seats. No other govt in the world has such a high percentage of seats in the govt. So get use to it that PAP will lose more seats. It lets in more immigrants, keep the COE system the same. These new Sporeans need to buy cars take bus, mrt. It's call demand and supply. So the COE price is bound to go up so long as there is more demand than supply. If Singapore strives to be a global city, you must be joking if you don't expect traffic jams. Not all cities are like Bangkok, we are not stupid, we travel, we can see for ourselves. Take Hong Kong as an example, a better public transport system, yes traffic jam but not anything like Bangkok. If citizens grow in wealth they want to buy a car. If their hope of something like this disappears why work so hard. To make it worst, the govt invites more immigrants without increasing trains and bus services. It's just poor planning on the part of the PAP and now we all have to pay the price. in a capitalist society, resources are not allocated according to needs. On the subject of housing, it's very simple put more supply out there than demand and the price will fall. Why must there be a waiting time for a hdb flat. Built a ton of them, no wait required and let's see if hbd price goes down. Oh i forgot, that is not good for the income of the govt. More tax measures does not solve the problem. More immigrants and not enough real estate cause price to go up. I don't have a problem with immigrants, i welcome them. Unfortunately the poor handling of this by the govt has cause many fellow Sporeans to have a negative view of immigrants. How can the govt bring in more people and not built more flats. There will continue to be more tax measures but it will not work. The solution is up the supply to exceed the demand. Go read your economics book bro. Taxing people is not a good solution but unfortunately it's a fav tool of this govt. For your info, i close my restaurant business because i knew the govt will take measures to appease the voting public. It was already difficult to find employees. I am a business person, if conditions in Spore makes it difficult to make a profitable biz, i move my biz to another country and that is what i am doing now the bulk of my investments will not be in Spore and i am sad that i have to do so. Bro I am a Singaporean and i am sad that we are in such a sad state today and the govt is more concern about it's seats in the govt than taking the right steps to solve this problem.
On the matter of public housing, it is the citizen's entitlement to have a roof over their head. As a government, this matter is not dealt with properly. We have foreigners vying with the locals over basic necessities like a roof over our heads, jacking up the prices as the demand soars. The Government want more families to procreate, but without a home to call their own, how would that be possible? And with the ever increasing prices, people slog longer, dedicating much of their lives to work, with some even juggling 2 jobs at a go just to be able to meet the basic commodities. There are no fool-proof systems but does that mean that a system this bad is acceptable? HDBs are built for the average wage earners. Not people with million dollar businesses people with 3 cars under their names people whom hold on to their hdb after striking gold from rags to riches. When they dont move, where do newly weds go to find a roof over their heads? To wait 3 years for a BTO is bull****. Who knows what come may in 3 years? The average working class citizen takes a loan of 30-50 years to repay HDB... 50 years.... paying through our teeth even in old age. Outrageous imo... what country lets their citizen live without the security of owning a roof over their head? Their duty is to protect the citizens but what i see is a case of Hunger Games among the lower cast. A job which supposedly pays alright (eg, $1,600 for an admin) is easily taken away by foreigners plying themselves for $1200. They can survibe on minimal wage but we sinkies can't...
Its just demand and supply. Why wait 3 yrs for flat. That will drive prices up. Get a flat anytime you want, prices will be soft and lower. All govt need to do is to make a major announcement. WE WILL BUILT XXX NO OF FLATS AND IN X YR, THERE WILL BE ENOUGH NO WAIT LIST. Just one policy statement all will be solve. People will be happy and prices will soften. Same for condo in HDB area. Sell plenty of land at no reserve price, scare the daylights of the developers and prices will start going down. I learn this 33 years ago in my economics class. Not rocket science. Maybe i should be minister of national development.
