MP4 prices are really plummeting on resale

Right? It's a lot of car. The early year options...

2007 w/ 16k miles for $170k
2007 w/ 21k miles for $160k

 

Since its a daily have you considered a 991S, 991 GT3, maybe wait for the 991 Turbo ....reliable, brand new, warranty.

A 599 would certainly be tempting though!

 

I guess the real question is:

We know there's a lot fewer Mp4's in the US than 458's so-- why are there 53 2012 Macs for sale on Cars.com right now and only 27 2012 Italias?

Did the owners not like it or think it wasn't worth the money, or they've "been there and done that" and moved on, or are the trading them to buy something else, or are they trying to beat the depreciation fall, or all of above?

In any event, the 12c is a bargain for someone looking for one right now ---and also a problem for Mac dealers to try to sell new ones when low mileage one year old cars are on the market that already have had a good chunk of depreciation taken out already.

Personally... I think it was over supply. They made too many cars too quickly and should have pulled back to have longer waiting lists and no new cars for sale on dealer showroom floors.

 

Mayor it would appear that they are all coupes though. Is everyone trying to get the Spider? I think that only started shipping in January. Either way not good to have that many sitting, especially when McLaren (or dealers, not sure) will have to use incentives to move them. That will add up quick
Kevin

 

I should clarify; that was on DuPont registry where I saw all the coupes (43 cars)

 

I think the first spiders just started arriving in the US. My Fcar dealer said he had a customer who asked when he could get a 458 spider, when he was told it would be a year or more, the guy said he could get a Mac spider in 4 months.

I think my point is that I don't believe this depreciation has much, if anything, to do with the car itself. I believe it has much to do with oversupply in the market --- which was COMPLETELY under McLaren's control (or lack there of).

 

Intersting, not much of a waiting list for the spider? That's surprising

 

True, so what's your take on where MP4's will be 1 year from now?

 

I don't think this car (the spider) is properly marketed in the US. And, the lack of dealers may in a market the size of the US may also be holding it back. There's been interest in Vegas for the car but the nearest dealer is in LA.

 

They're cars I admire but don't necessarily want. I realize a test drive can easily change that..

 

Fascinating. Never underestimate brand awareness. If you are cross-shopping the Gallardo and R8 4.2 against the McLaren, then that is also part of the price pressure, as neither car is really in the same league performance wise, but both are great drivers. If your main emphasis is curb appeal and brand recognition and the lesser car from the better-known brand gets you there (and I suspect that may be true of a huge demographic), then it is a small miracle the McLaren can trade over $150K.

On the other hand, I think the 458 and McLaren are very equal performance-wise and the fomer is aspirational to you and the latter not even a consideration.

Finally, the long list exemplifies the HUGE number of choices in this price range - if every one of these manufacturers sells thousands of cars into the US market each year, that is a lot of collective downward price pressure acorss the board. Kudos to Ferrari for bearing up so well to it.

 

I honestly don't know but you can look at their future plans and get a clue.

I think there will be pressure for the dealers to keep selling new cars until their 911 fighter finally arrives (IMO, the car they should have made first). But, that's probably 2 years away and resale values have to hurt new car sales.

They can't just shut off the tap now or they will close. The P1 isn't a money maker for dealers but it may be for Woking. I think the US market is stuck unless they can figure a way to sell Mac's to more than their base.

Otherwise, prices will drift lower held up only by Ferrari's resale of the 458 -- which is also slowly sinking.

Here's the problem with the 911 fighter. If Mp4 prices drift down even lower -- say to the 150 range, that's going to make it much tougher to sell a new car that's almost the same price as good used Mp4's. Possible... but difficult.

The next 12 months will be critical for McLaren. Spiders have to hold them over in the US market for a while. And, if the new California is a real improvement, it could cut into the need for going to Mac spiders. CA resale values have surprizingly held up well over the years.

To me, if you get an MP4 for the same price as an F430 F1 coupe, that's the deal of the century. And, a Mac spider for the same price as an F430 spider would the best deal since buying Manhattan Island from the natives. I don't think that will happen though.

 

I posted in another forum, how long can these dealers stay financially healthy? I don't know of many standalone dealerships that can last long selling under 10 cars per month. 2,000 cars/35 dealers is an average of 57 cars per year. Divided by 12 months that's 5 cars a month......
That's a hard business model to comprehend; and most of these facilities are new & beautiful

 

I think none of them in the US are stand alone dealerships. Some are even Ferrari dealers -- like Newport Beach (a great dealer BTW).

I say the same thing about Fiat dealers. They need Alfa and another Fiat model badly or they will never make it.

 

Most these dealers have many other dealerships or other substantial business interests

 

I guess I meant standalone parts of a bigger group, but dedicated building staff etc.....meaning the McLaren sales & service only work on McL.

 

Yes, but the bottom line is the bottom line. It's a business, not a hobby.

 

It's reminiscent of Fisker; a "new" brand in todays marketplace. It's clearly different for heritage of the F1 but still... I'd be weary of acquiring any McLaren or Fisker as of today. For both, the staying power is very TBD.

 

I suspect McLaren will not be in the new car business 5-7 years down the road. The market is oversaturated with choices and people tend to gravitate to brands with a longer sales and service history

 

The 12c is a fantastic car and a bargain in the low 200s. I prefer it to my 458, but thats a great car too.

 

458: 2010 w/ 32k miles for $205k.

I love it!

 

It sounds like you can have what you want within reason. So get the one you want. It doesn't sound like you are looking for any long term attachment. I like my 599 and it could be a DD. I hear the 458 could be a DD also.

 

IMO, if they can't find the money (or justify the expense) for the 911 fighter and market it, they are done.

There is no way they can survive off of MP4 variations for the next 4 years and making 350 P1's at $1.5 million (I still think it's closer to 150). They will be Morgan with a giant overhead hanging over themselves.

 

The 911 market is scary. No one has been able to crack the price point and quality of car, that is also a daily driver, that Porsche has developed there. Not taking about the special variations, but the traditional 911 that has been bulletproof, and below $100k.

 

The 911 turbo has been my dd for many years. Its a solid car. The wait for the 991 tt has been long and they really need to get on with it. The 12c has been rapidly replacing the 997tt as the new DD. The only negative is the lack of storage for weekend trip+shopping, but there's always fedex.