Drove the Mac 12c: so what's it like vs 458? | FerrariChat

Drove the Mac 12c: so what's it like vs 458?

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by TheMayor, Apr 21, 2013.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    106,027
    Vegas baby
    #1 TheMayor, Apr 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I drove the Mac yesterday with a group of Fchatters at Exotic Racing in Las Vegas. Now, in full disclosure -- sometimes Exotic racing isn't the best judge of the cars. You only get a few laps (I had 7), the tires can be worn, they keep it on "sport", and it's difficult to judge the condition of the car. Also, they run "plain jane" versions to save cost. And, of course... you're wearing a helmet so that takes away some of the experience.

    However, some interesting things I found both positive and negative.

    Overall look

    First impression having it sit next to a 458 was that the Mac looks smaller-- which is a good thing. It looks more lean and simple in a good way.

    Second impression was: Wow, the paint is terrible. The car came with the McLaren Orange (which is a metallic) and the application of the metal flake over the rear was all over the place. It looked "wavy". I was really surprised as I did not expect this. If it were my car, I would be upset.


    Getting in:

    I had a real tough time getting in and out of the car. I cannot see how you can do it gracefully. Maybe over time but I think most wives and girlfriends would find it rather bizarre and uncomfortable to travel in it or get out of one in front of a fancy restaurant. Others observing you might use the word "dork". :)

    The interior: Very nice with one exception -- the carpeting on the inside sills looks really matted and cheap to me. Maybe they have an upgrade for it but it did not speak of $250 grand sportscar to me.

    The interior also looks smaller than the 458. It's not bad, it's just not as airy. The steering wheel is smaller and the paddles TINY. Of course, the paddles move with the wheel and the good thing is that this arrangement never bothered me driving it and actually works well. I think they have the better mousetrap on this one.

    This car has stalks behind the paddles which at first glance, looked like they would get in the way. But, they never did and I had no issues with them.

    I did not like the TFT display graphics. Looks like a student project all in White Helvetica Bold type. Rather uninspiring. And, I did not like that the gear selector indicator was in the upper right corner instead of right in front of you. I have no idea why they did this aside from just being different.

    Driving

    First, the gearbox -- and something I really hated. The gearbox creeps like an old slush box torque converter. And, it creeps rather fast (or at least mine did). Then, the first shift (from low speeds) was really slow. Later, when driving aggressively, the gearbox seemed excellent but did not deliver any "kick in the pants" -- just smooth delivery. But my first impression was "wow, the 458 box is much better".

    Second, the steering: At low speeds, it's actually a bit heavier than I expected and certainly heavier than the 458. But, overall, the steering was excellent.

    Third, the brakes: They use steel (actually, Exotic racing use steel on the 458 and Scuds too) and they are excellent. No fade and I got into the ABS a couple of times. The pedal kicks back when you disengage the parking brake which gave me a feeling of "what's wrong with the brakes!" before we started. It felt like a bad master cylinder feels when the pedal moves on it's own. The 458 does not do this.

    Fourth: overall handling: This car is quite remarkable at high speed turns. It's just flat everywhere. The ride is smooth as silk on the track --- it's like you are playing a video game. I would view it as excellent. William H drove it and said the same but also said the tires were "terrible". I don't know the brand or condition. To me, they were fine.

    Fifth: Acceleration. This part surprised me a bit. I was expecting some turbo lag or a turbo rush. But, I felt neither. There is no question that if you have the car in too high a gear, the car lacks torque at low RPM from the 458. But, when driving it aggressively, you just get this seamless rush of power that seems remarkably linear. I was not expecting this. It does make the car easier to drive on the track.

    Sixth: Ambiance. The weakest part of the car is the exhaust note which does not put a chill up your spine. It's hard to describe but it never seems to be "crazy" or outrageous. I expected more "urgency". The interior -- although nice and well laid out -- does not shout "exotic". It does however shout good design.


    Overall impression: When I got out of the car the instructor asked me what I felt. I said, the car is really fast but it lacks emotion. It's a little too good. He agreed and told me something interesting. What he said is that when people drive the 458 and then the Mp4, their impression was that they were driving faster in the 458 when in fact, they were driving slower.

    I spent about 5 minutes with the instructor afterwards talking about the differences and he said the Mac were more reliable than the 458.

    Conclusion: This is one really fine machine. It's fast, seems to be reliable, and is an excellent machine to drive. But, it has a problem that the 458 also suffers from: A lack of "drama". However, the 458 makes up for some of it with the exhaust note and flashier interior/steering wheel.

    But, I cannot see how you cannot enjoy this car greatly whether driving it on a track or street. It's a terrific piece of engineering.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  2. S Brake

    S Brake F1 World Champ

    Aug 3, 2006
    17,182
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Great post. The hairnet/helmet combo is a good look.
     
  3. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    #3 PhilNotHill, Apr 21, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2013
    +1

    Great write-up.

    My grandmother had that same look. :cool:
     
  4. 2k7997tt

    2k7997tt Formula Junior

    Oct 23, 2007
    768
    Westlake Village, CA
    Full Name:
    John M.
    Great review. Thanks for sharing.
     
  5. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,189
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    Excellent review Bob, your more than welcome to drive my 12C if you are out here with the 2013 Upgrades, the biggest part is the DCT is much faster than than before, and the exhaust (mine has sport exhaust) is quite a bit louder.

    Anyway, great to see you had time to drive it.
     
  6. kverges

    kverges F1 Rookie

    Nov 18, 2003
    3,179
    Dallas
    Full Name:
    Keith Verges
    Nice write up. One small nit. The color is "Volcano Orange." The McLaren Orange is non-metallic and harkens back to Bruce's CanAm and F5000 cars.
     
  7. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,189
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    +1 Normal McLaren Orange is called Papaya. What color did you get on your car?
     
  8. spyderman

    spyderman Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2003
    1,622
    Toronto - Canada
    Full Name:
    Spyderman
    May need to own both to get the best of both worlds ;)
     
  9. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    106,027
    Vegas baby
    Ah interesting. The one I drove was metalflake if that helps.
     
  10. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    I am sure the Mac is a wonderful car.

    The Ferrari dealer is 180 miles away. 3.5 hours.

    As best I can determine the nearest Mac dealer is 900+ miles away. 16 hours. that's just way too far for me.

    On my 3rd Fcar. Better the devil you know than the devil you don't know I guess.
     
  11. Migas

    Migas Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2013
    658
    Lisboa - Portugal
    Full Name:
    Miguel
    Point is: We all know that there are more exotic, faster, powerful and expensive cars than Ferraris. But IMHO Ferrari is and always will be the top of the top. However it is always nice to get an experience on them all. Luck for those who can get it. But when we have to pay for them I only can choose one - Ferrari.
     
  12. mhh

    mhh F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2004
    5,894
    Australia
    Full Name:
    Mark
    I'm an owner of both (Mac Spider and 458 Coupe) and I thought Mayor's review was right on the money. I had the 458 for 2 years before I got the McLaren. Jumping from one to the other (on the road) the first things that strike you are the 12C's smooth ride and handy size and the Ferrari's great exhaust sound and sharper gearbox. Just 2 great cars.
     
  13. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,189
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    I agree, although I don't have a 458 (but have driven many), the gearbox (software) on the 458 is just amazing, however, with the 2013 Upgrade and Sports Exhaust the 12C sounds pretty good now.
     
  14. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    106,027
    Vegas baby
    I did ask the instructor who works on the Macs and he said they transport them all the way from Vegas to the Newport beach dealer. They weren't sure if the cars would be back in time for me to drive them.

    I noticed the check engine light was on in my car. :)
     
  15. kverges

    kverges F1 Rookie

    Nov 18, 2003
    3,179
    Dallas
    Full Name:
    Keith Verges
    My window stocker says "McLaren Orange" FWIW. It is not metallic and brighter than Volcano Orange. My good friend just got a 458 Coupe and we will trade cars ar some point so it will be interesting to compare from both of our perspectives.
     
  16. Noblesse Oblige

    Noblesse Oblige F1 Veteran

    Nov 7, 2011
    6,114
    Three Places
    FWIW I would also add that the ride quality in the McLaren is exemplary. On the negative side, in both examples I drove there was considerable lag in the engine response at pretty much all RPM values, and the shift paddles did not operate in a positive manner.

    My overall takeaway was:
    "Relish and enjoy your normally aspirated engine while you still have it."
     
  17. F1Guy

    F1Guy Formula Junior

    Jun 10, 2012
    270
    Alabama
    Full Name:
    Alan
    Very interesting and informative write-up, thank you.
     
  18. henryenzo

    henryenzo Karting

    Jan 16, 2012
    175
    I have a 2011 458 coupe and 2013 Mac Spider and would agree and disagree:

    1. I have Volcanic red and it is some of the best paint I have seen in any car. By contrast the 458 has some peel and there is some very obvious overspray.

    2. Lower the rear window on the 13 Mac and with the upgrade and sport exhaust it sounds better than my 458. Raise it and it is a quiet daily driver.

    3. I like the ergos of the interior of the Mac much better. I don't see much to the carpets on either.

    4. High end 458 stereo is better than high end Mac.

    5. Lift system better on 458 than Mac

    6. Larger, in place, paddles much better for me on 458.

    7. 458 shifting is very obviously better.

    8. sense of and real speed much more in mac IMO. Head jerking

    9. Gawk factor higher in Mac in my experience, partly because folks don't know what it is.

    10. I have 5000 miles on 458 and already 2000 on mac. F service is very good--Mac service is Lexus like. ) of course this will vary by dealer.

    11. I am a little over 6'4" and the mac is harder for me to get in and out of. My son is 6'7" and he actually got stuck in the Mac and I had to help him out.

    Bottom line--both great and both would be sold before either of my Ford GTs.
     
  19. dustman

    dustman F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 12, 2007
    11,400
    Thanks for the post, u rock.

     
  20. RufMD

    RufMD F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Jan 31, 2004
    3,246
    USA
    Full Name:
    Jas
    Saw a volcano red Mclaren a couple of weeks ago and it was the best paint I have ever seen on any car...had to walk back and look at it 5 times it was that stunning.

    I must say that someone criticizing another companys paint job over ferrari is more than a little amusing (everyone is entitled to an opinion of course).

    Seeing the paint as delivered on my scuderia coupe, 16M and 599GTO and seeing other new owners labour for a week correcting ferrari factory finishes, I thought this was quite funny.
     
  21. 4th_gear

    4th_gear F1 Rookie

    Jan 18, 2013
    4,425
    Full Name:
    Michael
    #21 4th_gear, Apr 22, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2013
    Thanks Bob, really enjoyed reading your informative review - seems like the 12C is a more cerebral driving experience. I like it better in black.
     
  22. Edward 96GTS

    Edward 96GTS F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    11,072
    i saw a black one two weeks ago. panel fit was irregular and the gaps were huge.
     
  23. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    106,027
    Vegas baby
    The panel gaps on the 458 aren't anything to shout home about either. :)
     
  24. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,189
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    #24 Senna1994, Apr 22, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    My gap panels seem fine, I like black too. Just a quick note, when the 12C was upgraded to 2013 Specs the Torque curve was brought down from 3,500 RPM to 2,500 RPM to address the lag issues, but the biggest change was the software for the DCT, in fact McLaren hired one of the head software designers from Ferrari, go figure.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. HK boy

    HK boy Formula Junior

    Sep 20, 2012
    955
    Del Mar, California
    Full Name:
    Jeff
    +1.

    The Mayor, I really enjoyed reading your real world descriptive review, thank you.

    I was expecting you to bash it for fun, but you did not :)
     

Share This Page