Replicas, why bother ??

+1 and as we know an ERA is one of the best, if not the best. The only people who dont tlike these are car snobs who own fancy machineary for reasons other than how they drive, and those driving up investment grade cars.

If you are a car guy or gal and into the drive and the machine, not what it repersents as a wealth statement, then yoiu do want to drive a cobra and these offere that oppotunity. I bet if regulation did not prevent manufacturers from offering these new they would. In fact is that not what aston did with the santion 2 DB4 zagaoto. Or is It Ok because aston santioned it. You know they were built by a subcontractor off some scrap DB4's.

Not every replica destroys an old build car, and even those that use old builds, might be using acar sent to the scrapper.

 

Applause.

Futher a new build cobra is the same thing as a new rolex. Its the same product that was built 40 yeasr ago just built now. If some company were still doing a new build old car like Morgan, then copying it would be theft of their buisness prospects. Recreating something the manufacturer has babandoned producing is a compliment.

 

Seriously, uneducated?

So, if you owned a "whatever" car that you paid $1m for, you'd be just fine with someone running around town with one that cost him 50 grand and posing as if he had a real one?

And, if you designed the car that was worth $1m, you'd be OK with someone copying it and running around town without your permission?

And, if you produced a movie and someone went out and copied it and sold it on the street for $1.00 (a well made one!), you'd have no problem with that?


And I'm the uneducated one?

If you don't think that the large amount of replica's out there DRIVE DOWN the price and pride of ownership of real vehicles, then lets have kits out there for 360, 430, and 458 owners and ask THOSE REAL OWNERS if they have no issues with a 1000 fake Ferrari's running around the streets of their towns. You don't think the owners of the real cars would be upset? You don't think every Ferrari owner who hears "hey.. is that a FIERO" gets his blood boiling?

It's easy for people like you --- who don't actually mind driving around in a fake car (or apparently owning fake Rolex or DVD) that drives this problem. Fake is FAKE. I don't care how good it is or how well done it is.

If it's fake, it's fake. Just like some people.

I chose not to live in a world of knock offs and creating an illusion that I can afford something I can't.'


BTW: If I want to see one of these cars actually run, I'll go to the Monterey Historics or some other vintage show or event or auction. But, why should I when I can see a fake one going down the street? It's the same, right? Maybe I should go so I can say "Look, that car looks just like the fake one down the street!"

How exciting that will be.

 

I don't think I have ever seen a Cobra that was real. I alwasy assume it's a replica. To me they have credibility because most probably out perform the origional. They all sport Ford engines and sound and behave a lot like the origional. I have never seen a replica Ferrari with a Ferrari engine. It's usually a POS four cyl.

 

A copied DVD is the same as the original DVD.

Does that make copying DVD's Ok? Is it a compliment?


I think I'm going to go into the fake 512 boxer business..... More applause?

Lastly, what a SAD WORLD we live in when something that is such a good copy to the original is considered something to be congratulated.

"Hey, great FAKE you built there! I can't tell the difference to the original. Keep up the good work!"

 

Perhaps you are right. Jay Leno is seen driving some historic pieces and doesn't seem to care.

Then again, he doesn't just tool around in them. I'm sure his trips are well planned & he rotates cars to where any given model is only on the road once a year.

I guess the only real way for me to know is to get more money than God, then test out my hypotheses. Anyone want to lend me the cash? (as a consolation prize, I would also accept an invitation from Jay Leno to drive his cars around on the weekend).

 

+1

 

Can we please disagree without name-calling?

Sorry, I'm (for once) in agreement with Bob on this one. Real is real, even if the ****head driving it is a "poseur."

Fake is fake, and therefore anyone driving one is a "poseur."

 

That's what your missing. NOBODY who builds or drives a replica Shelby Daytona Coupe, Shelby Cobra or a GT-40 ever tries to pass it off as an original. Not on the road or at car shows. Like their competition bred forebears, they are built not only to be driven, but driven hard. That's something that owners of originals, even those with unlimited funds, rarely do. They become pampered show cars. Not only are they not driven on the street, most are not driven at all. The only driving they do is up the ramp to the enclosed trailer. And if I paid $1M for an original and saw a replica driving on the street, I'd only be interested in how close the design was to my original. Guess I don't have a self-esteem problem...

 

Hmmm, I see an impossible contractiction.

I'm pretty good on cars but if your car is virtually identical, how the heck am I going to recognise it is a replica and not be that car fool that you speak of earlier?

Can't have it both ways ... or is your number plate: REPLICA?
Pete

 

Nope, it's "REPLICAR".

 

I'm not missing anything. I wouldn't ride around in a fake car or own a fake watch or watch a fake DVD.

If you're OK with driving something fake because you can't afford the real thing, good for you. IMO, you're damaging the ownership experience of every other real owner out there.

I could not be happy with that. Apparently, you can.

Good for you.

The quicker people realize that fakes only cheat and cheapen the experience of ownership, the quicker makers of this stuff will stop due to low demand.

And we true enthusiasts will all be better off for it.

You may not have a self esteem problem. What you have is a moral problem.

Owning a fake Ferrari is like sticking a sock down your pants to make your "bulge" look bigger. When the truth is finally revealed, the disappointment starts -- followed shortly after by laughter.

 

Hats of to you for being so upfront about it.

As for you comment about replica owners driving their cars hard. Sorry just because you might do does not mean that many others are not poseurs. A guy my family lived closed to owned a replica Cobra and I only saw him drive it once, the rest of the time he was polishing it.

BUT I do want to say I don't have a problem with replicas that use mass produced cars as their donor.
Pete

 

What if we call them homages - would that help to ease the ego blow, or perhaps even boost the ego of real-deal owners?

 

Quite possibly the greatest statement ever made on the subject.

 

I originally considered "NOT A CSX" but figured not enough people would get it.

 

psssst... i think the replica cobras are better looking than the original..pssst, dont tell anyone

 

How in the world is me driving a Cobra replica in any way changing the ownership experience of anyone else?

As for the low demand statement, dream on, not going to happen. Shelby took Factory Five to court more than once to stop them making copies of his cars. He lost. Could have something to do with him taking a British car, putting a different engine in it, and then calling it HIS car and his design.

And who is the truer enthusiast, someone who admires a Cobra but that's as close as they get, or someone who admires it so much they want to know what it felt like to actually build one first-hand, see it come together, then be the first one to drive it. I would put up my "enthusiasm" for cars against anyone.

You don't like replicas. Fine. But this holier-than-thou attitude......well.....let he who is without sin......

Oh, the plate on my Cobra replica was ERSATZ. I'll be putting that on the one I'm building now.

 

PSA...

Ersatz (German pronunciation: [ɛrˈzats]) means "substituting for, and typically inferior in quality to", e.g. "chicory is ersatz coffee". It is a German word literally meaning substitute or replacement

 

Ok...I've been watching this thread and I can't bite my lip anymore. I agree, the Pontiac Fiero 328 doesn't even deserve the title "Ferrari Replica"......But there are some out there that deserve some "love and respect". I happen to live in Stuart FL and have had the opportunity to see some of Greg Jones "Recreations" up close and personal. Particularly his 166MM Red Barchetta and the 250 TR "Pontoon Fender" Testarossa. These cars are stunning. They are correct in every detail and in most cases share the same body and engine parts as the original and the body panels are right from Modena Italy made from aluminum from the same die and press that made the originals. I own a REAL 328, buit if I ever came into some fun money.....I would leap at the opportunity to commision a 166 or a 250 to be built at a FRACTION of the price of the real deal! These cars are built on a "Donor Car"...I believe a 330 V12 Chassis and again are correct in every way and every detail. Just my two cents!

 

"Love and respect"? Where was the "love and respect" for the donor car? Is it by having its non-usable parts sitting out back rusting away?

You take a perfectly good classic car and forever destroy it to replicate another car because someone can't afford the real one -- just so you can make a buck and the client can say "hey! I almost own the real one!"

No respect from me.

I don't care how nice it looks. It's a fake and another perfectly good car was destroyed doing it. Find another way to show your talent.

If we did this to human beings it would be called human harvesting. Kim Kardasian needs a new heart so lets take one from this ugly, unwanted person.

If a doctor did that we would call them "butcher".

 

You are dealing in false equivalencies here. Media properties as in movies and songs earn money over time as royalties, that is the nature of theircreation and sale, they are to put it another way in continuous production with an infinite amount of copies. Anyone can buy these coipies from the rights holder at anytime, its how the rights holder earns thier living. They never become obsolete unlss someone abamdons the copyright. Same for Coca cola or Rolex.

Ferrari and Shelby to name two dont make money from subsequent sales of their obsolete cars, well classiche does, but thats restoration, which will be totaly unaffected by recreations. Although classiche does recreations of old data plates so they have provenance.

A fake Rolex is not a real rolex in build or function. If someone made an exact and I mean exact copy of a rolex and sold it for half price without the Rolex name, any buyer would be buying it not for what it reperesents but what it is. Rolex though would suffer harm because it would effect new sales of the same product, and if someone put a rolx name on their exact copy this would be theft.

When someone makes an exact ferrari from the 50's ferarri new car sales are unaffected, it does not compete with ferrari or alter thier profits in any way, other than imitation is the sincerest formn of flattery, there is no theft. The old copies do not affect in any way new car sales or values. If there is an effect its slowing the wild rise of old builds, I dont belive car owners have a copyright, and so what, these are machines to be enjoyed.

The copyright part is the putting of a prancing horse on a recreation ie claiming it was built by ferrari. Although if you cut up an old ferrari its technicaly a rebody and still a ferrari.

Then again as someone here said pretty much no one with a recreation claims its "real". Actualy more than a few owners of authentic GTO's and D types have had copies made for historic racing so as to preserve the original from damage. I guess they find the machine to be exactly the same but without provenance. To them a recreation enhances the utility because they can use the object as intended.

SPF GT 40's are licensed by safir who holds the rights to GT40 car designs, so there is no even theoretical arguement about theft. Certain cobra relicas were licensed by shelby, and some of those are very inauthentic.

Leno if you go to his garage show makes a big push for Pursang copies of pre war alfas and Bugattis. He has orginal or better put old build ones, he finds the recreations great because you can really use them and there will be more devotees.

Lastly the Bugatti club sanctions recreations, in their view a bugatti is a bugatti because of how it was built and materials involved, not where or when.

As to fake rolexes. I would say that if you wear a Rolex you are particularily arriviste and intent on showing your sucess, a rolex is mostly worn to send a signal to others. So anyone buying afake is just copying vulgar displays of wealth, hard to say which is sadder the original or the copy. Same with many new ferari owners, its avalue thing for them more than an experience of what the thing is.

I guess if you are into what something represents or says about you then you are against recreations because you are somehow deriving personal self worth from owning something that represents "who you are".

Now if you are into the thing for what it is, in other words a car guy and a driver, you have no issue with a recreation as long as it recreates the actual ting closely, and many owners of old builds decide to preserve them and thier vlue while enjoying a recreation on the road. Car guys probably have no issue with near copies too, because its a car experience thing.

 

If you were told that, you were told a lie. No die and press were involved with the 166 or TR.
Pete

 

wasn't the cobra originally a kit car?
i thought shelby took a british ac and stuffed a ford engine into it.
i wonder if people denigrated carrol shelby for bastardizing the ac.

 

I agree taking a good car and chopping it up is saciledge. No self respecting car guy would do that. Thats why acceptance and sanction would get rid of the pirates. Pretty muchg every piece for an old ferrari is produced these days.