The Massa Sucks Thread *OF COURSE THERE ARE SPOILERS*

what abt 16th to 8th

 

today RB seb 1st web 4th Merc ham 3rd and nico 5th
Ferrari Alonso 2nd massa 8th. clearly outperforming Ferrari was redbull and Merc.

Monaco Merc Nico 1st Ham 4th RB Seb 2nd web 3rd Ferrari Alonso 7th massa out.
Merc And redbull out perform as a team and as independent drivers.

it's pretty clear cut.

no one can argue that RB and Merc have out performed Ferrari as a team in the last 2 races. And Merc is not falling off like everyone was saying. There not going anywhere and they will just improve. And yes the bottom line is massa is doing in Ferrari and Alonzo is doing decent but that's not going win Drivers of constructors.

Well see at silverstone but if the same trend continues that points margin will keep getting closer and closer.

 

RBand Seb are in a class of their own.
MB is still in deep trouble tirewise. Only an undemanding track and/or Hamilton's talent can give them results.
A bit of (overdue) bad luck for Seb and Alonso's on top.

 

are you saying Ferrari outperformed RB and Merc in the last 2 Races? poles the last 2 races have Ferrari outperformed Merc And RB? and diresta out performed massa in a force India and made a more impressive run from his starting position.

Merc is 10 points off Ferrari and Merc is connsistant and at this rate I think Merc will pass Ferrari in constructors.

I'm a Ferrari owner and Ferrari F1 fan, I'm just trying to look at results in realistic way and hope that Ferrari gets the point and gets a strategy to end up winning Drivers.

And lets be honest are we all really saying were hoping that seb gets bad luck? Its unrealistic to say that seb is due for bad luck. it's just as possible that Alonzo gets bad luck. It's not like F1 gods spread bad luck out evenly.

Seb just keeps getting better and better. lets see after silverstone but if this trend continues I feel that sebs got it.

 

Ferrari is a vastly better car than the MB which needs a forgiving track, but not as quick as the RB.
The gap between Ferrai and MB will only grow even though MB has two drivers who can consistently earn points.

 

was a good run but diresta made a more impressive run in an Inferior car.
Really I'm not a Ferrari basher at all. but it's getting a bit frustrating the last 4 years. And we all know Ferrari is pissed about the last four years

 

well I respect your view 100% and honestly hope your right. We can only wait and see what happens next.

And to me kobi is not the answer to ferraris massa problems.Ferraris in this for 1st not 2nd and they publicly emphasize this over and over each year. They want more than anything to throw those little badges on the inside of our ferraris that say 2013 winner of driver and construtors

And who doesn't agree that if you put seb In the Ferrari he would be in the same spot points wise.

 

We shall see.
What troubles me most about Phil is his difficulty in the wet. Silverstone was not the anomaly that we might have hoped it was.

 

Lets face it guys the guy Ferrari needs to win is Adrian Newey.....

 

Your saying Ferrari as a team or individual has outperformed Merc in the last 2 races?
Monaco
Merc a 1st and a 4th
Ferrari a 7th and a wreck

Montreal
Merc a 3rd and a 5th
Ferrari a 2nd and a 8th

The numbers speak for themself and blind alleagence to Ferrari wont change the facts.

And to count lotus out this season is just being foolish.

And as I said"eventually" maclaren will come back. maybe it will be in 2014 or 2015 but if you think Mclaren are the new Williams you are 100% wrong. they have the most money and a insane history.

and I realize that there are more to look at than the last 2 races. But take a look at the overall drivers points. when you average out each teams drivers its plain as day Merc and Ferrari are neck and neck. Hamilton isn't going to fall off he is on or slightly off the top 3 in almost all the races. if he comes back and wins 2 races he will overtake Alonso in points.

 

With Massa in the number two seat Ferrari is competeing with one arm tied behind their back compared to RB, Macca, Lotus et al.
If that's what you mean by an inferior team I'll grant you the point, but the car and Alonso are streets ahead of their competition, save Seb.

 

This is one of the worst posts I've ever read. Not only does it hurt my eyes - it's all nonsense.
You said:

The only team "beating up" on Ferrari is Red Bull. Alonso is 2nd in the WDC and Ferrari is 2nd in the WCC. The fact that you think McLaren is beating up on Ferrari makes me wonder if you have watched any of this season at all.

By the way, where did I count Lotus out?

 

I agree 100% and your totally right the issue here is massa in the way I am looking at these teams. And I think we all agree that Ferrari top brass are interested in 1st in drivers and constructors. I'm just trying to look at the situation different than I have in past years and try and look at in a way that I hope Ferrari is looking at the whole situation and figure out changes that will change the tide for Ferrari in the long run.

Easy fix to me right now if they could grab webber they would 100% win constructors. and with the age of Alonzo and webber they could run 2 years and Ferrari could put together Seb for 2016. I can't see webber saying no to Ferrari to run porsche in some lack luster GT or whatever series he would be running if not anything Ferrari would pay him more in F1.

 

really your saying I said that Mclaren was beating up on Ferrari? you cut my quote off. I said eventually Mclaren would get out of there slump.

And you said I was wrong saying lotus (kimi) was beating on alonzo? lets not forget who was 2 in points prior today. and grosean is right there with massa. and with massa's results lately Grosean will pass massa next. so we are off one race that kimi does better than Alonzo and 1 race that grosean does better than massa and lotus is in front of Ferrari.

And I'm going to laugh when Merc overtakes Ferrari. every race everyone says they are going to fall off. that they are only fast in qualifying but they prove everyone wrong each week being steady and consistent and keep racking up points. Ferrari is the rollercoaster lay out this years results and look at the swings.

take your blinders off and your eyes won't hurt so much.

The numbers don't lie and counting on bad luck for seb is the same as being in the casino and loosing hand after hand and you think I have to win because I have lost too many times. those are not odd's they are implied odds and only a fool would bank on implied odds to argue a point in F1.

 

The bad luck comment was paraphrasing Alonso.

 

Nothing you said made any since. I'm going by numbers I can't twist those. your going on an opinion and totally ignoring the numbers and the trends.

 

Huh?
You're quoting yourself saying that you're not making any sense?

 

Your right. and I was saying that to the other post not yoursWhat you have said has been correct as far as I'm concerned . Only difference is I maybe being to cynical. and I realize I'm getting flamed right and left but I think we see the value of each others assessments. and both of us are ultimately after the same thing. Ferrari getting wins.

I just don't understand others slamming massa but then saying Ferrari is so strong.

 

sorry about that. I'm trying to type this from an IPhone and I tried to edit that post and it came out like that. I need to get to my Mac

 

Many would like to seperate the Massa question from the Ferrari equation.

Got it. Still its not nice to confuse the elderly.

 

You said that RB, Merc, Lotus and McLaren are beating up on Ferrari. This makes no sense. The only team Ferrari is being beaten by is Red Bull.

So what? Alonso is second in the points now. He also beat Kimi last year, and he got a podium today when Kimi barely got into the points. What's with the criticism?

Why? Thought you were a Ferrari fan? Nah, I never believed that. You're just a troll.

If Ferrari got a free 1000km test with the 2013 car I bet they would start doing better too.

The only incident-free race where Ferrari hasn't been fast was Monaco. Far from a rollercoaster, Fernando got some bad luck in Malaysia and Bahrain.

That's right, so say that Merc, Lotus and McLaren are beating up on Ferrari makes absolutely zero sense in any capacity.

 

if you insist on just reading parts of my posts then there is no use arguing.

And to say I'm not a ferrari fan could not be farther from the truth. I own a 430 and have watched Ferrari in F1 for years. I'm looking at the whole picture objectively after years a d years of watching Ferrari loose year after year. It's a bit frustrating being the red soxs of f1 but having the prestige and money of the yannkees. I just want Ferrari to do something drastic instead of just coasting. They could have cleaned the slate last year and get Seb and let Alonzo and massa go. all the buzz last year about Ferrari and seb were not just rumors.

anyways I see everyone's point of veiw on this subject and I admit I am extra critical of Ferrari this year but it's just out of frustration with Ferrari not trying a new strategy.

 

You think getting rid of Alonso is a good idea or the solution to winning titles?

I think we're done here

 

I admire your stamina

 

+1, tough to argue against this statement.