What are everyone's thoughts on this? Personally, I saw this coming and called it last year after Hamilton announced he was leaving. I also said that Merc should end their deal with them, which has also happened. I really didn't expect it to happen so fast (especially since they had the fastest car at the end of 2012), but man, they are struggling. Force India is showing them the way. What do you think the reasons are? I don't think they have a truly top flight driver anymore and it's really hurting them. Jenson seems to have such a narrow window in which he can make the car work and he is really struggling to drive around the issues of the MP4-28 like Alonso or Hamilton could. Hell, look at his rough stretch last year in the MP4-27. Do you think the road car business is diverting too many resources away from the F1 team? I think McLaren will be back, they won't be another Williams, but it may take awhile, which I'm thoroughly enjoying.
I think a lot of it is because they completely redesigned the front end of their car, and are still learning it. but then again, WTF would I know!
True, but I find it hard to believe that is the only reason. Ferrari was able to come to grips with their radical design last year, I would think McLaren could do the same.
So let me see... In 2012 McLaren had a good car that only needed a bit of reliability. In 2014 there is a new Formula so the work you do in 2013 will be mostly useless next year. So for 2013 the smart thing would be to do an evolution of the 2012 car, like everybody else in the grid did, but instead of that McLaren started from scratch. Mmmmmm...
They are writing off this year; ouch!! Doesn't help to sell their road cars right now BBC Sport - Formula 1: McLaren turn their attentions to 2014
I think Ham leaving them hasn't helped, but not in any way the main reason they have slumped,a various combination of things, I do think Ron Dennis stepping down is one of the bigger reasons though IMO.
One of those things that makes you scratch your head and say WTF?? Fastest car on the grid at the end of 2012, and they go with the pullrod suspension that Ferrari obviously had problems with. If Ferrari, that has as many resources or more than McLaren, had that many issues with it.... I think their luck will change next year. Hopefully they're already working with Honda preparing for 2015.
who cares, them and their supporters can cry in their beer for all I care Always good news when they are doing badly
I did not see it coming and I don't think Hamilton did either. I think there's some internal problems in the team from Ron leaving and Whitmarsh taking over. The new suspension is giving them fits (it did to Ferrari also) and the testing ban makes it difficult to catch up once the season starts. I don't think Mercedes gives a flying leap about Mac either anymore which can't help. Hamilton could have drug that machine around the track better in the same way Alonso is helping push their POS to better points than it deserves. But, he would not be doing much better than Button (who appears to be totally deflated and upset with Perez). I think this season and next will be weak for them. But, they will get a head start with Honda and we all know how that worked out last time: Pretty darn well for the boys in Woking.
McLaren doesn't exactly have a strong driver line up. Lewis is worth half a second over Button. In Ross Brawn's words, Button isn't much of a technical driver like Rubens was in developing a car, dunno about Perez. Morale can't be good either, they've been bleeding key technical people for a couple years now, also driver. Pat Fry took a bunch of people to Ferrari, their aero head went to Caterham, now Paddy Lowe. They've always said they have strength in depth, let's see how deep.
Debatable IMO.... +1 to all points there. Have they actually been down the ****ter since Ron gave up his seat on the 'wall? I think they're big enough that "Mclaren Electronics" or the road car guys shouldn't impact the team (at least $ wise), but maybe they do miss Ron? Just idle ramblings...... Cheers, Ian
Lewis is faster than Jenson in raw speed, but at times, Jenson was just as fast, if not faster than Lewis. Many predicted that Hamilton would embarrass Button when he made the move to McLaren, but that wasn't the case. In fact, Jenson finished 2nd in 2011, 3 places ahead of Lewis. If McLaren even figure out their issues with that front suspension, I suspect both Button and Perez will be doing much better. Maybe not winning races, but definitely in the points, maybe top 5. Either way, WDC/WCC are not even remotely dreams for them this year.
I don't think it is one specific issue which is causing them to be slow. The biggest obstacle is probably the redesigned suspension. Look what happened to the F2012 until mid-season. The suspension issue combined with having only one veteran driver is mostly to blame. That and the street car business always seems to mess with McLaren's Formula 1 program. Just look at what they achieved during the F1 supercar years.
I worry for McLaren Any more seasons like this will put a permanent dent in there reputation Plus I think Mercedes are moving into McLaren's competitive spot in F1
Iirc, Lewis had one or two mechanical failures (at least one gearbox), and had iirc three crashes or incidents (two just with Massa) that season. Last year he had a four or five retirements and still finished ahead of Jenson. At least so far this season Lewis has managed tires well and has driven pretty consistently. A fast driver can get it together and become consistent, a driver without the raw speed will never get it. Unfortunately Jenson is akin to a Webber. He's a solid number two and lucky that Brawn/Honda had the jump on the field it did in 2009. The rest of you can write them off at your risk. Remember back in 09 when they were struggling worse than this the first half of the year, they won more races than anyone else the second half (or took more points, one of the two). They're very unpredictable, 2013 could be any which way.
+1 Only a fool would write 'em off. However, I think their issues run deeper than the pullrods. They've already said they know it's not generating enough D/F and are struggling with tunnel correlation. (Sound familiar? ) Every now & again they all do a dog, even (all too rarely these days ) Newey. Can they develop their way back towards the front? The many $MM question - Even the mighty Mclaren need that WCC money these days. Not as badly as, say, Sauber, but a good result still means the big bucks next year. I do guess they're getting close to throwing in the towel on the sucker though. Cheers, Ian
Isn't the Vodafone sponsorship ending soon as well? Thought I read that a while ago....not a good time to be performing like this
I do believe you're correct. Not sure when, possibly as soon as next year they'll be gone? As you say, not a great time to suck..... Cheers, Ian
I'll use a MS hater line and just add that Jenson scored more points than Hamilton during their three years together. Hamilton was quicker than Jense, but not .5 second. Well...they're screwed this season. That was a different scenario considering there had just been a major rule change and there was more to "figure out." I can't see them having a "eureka" moment with the MP4-28 since the cars are so much more highly developed now under the current regs than they were back then. The ceiling is much lower.
Mac will be back in the game eventually. The key issue, I think, are the tires and how the chassis reacts to these newer compounds. One item that should not be forgotten is how the driver likes their "set-up" and how it effects tire performance. The variables are endless.
