Ferrari LaFerrari - the next Special Limited Series

Well he would be.

As someone who has raced and will race Ferrari based machines there he has intimate knowledge and insight.
In fact his Ring parameters are the closest thing we have to a uniform standard for comparisons on Ferrari hyper-cars. And that's what the thread's about, not 458s.

It does cut down on the always fun wishful thinking and bench racing though.

 

Of course Mr Glickenhaus's contribution is invaluable. Thing is that he has a spite against Ferrari and it shows. Also, he thinks that all manufacturers and enthusiasts should care for Ring times alone and especially 24 hour racing there. As if there are no other metrics on earth. Well, Le Mans is more famous, Monza is faster, Monaco is more glamorous, Spa is more exciting. Moreover, these cars are built as speed machines, not endurance ones. An F1 car wouldn't last an hour round the Ring. Does that make it worthless?

 

Points taken.
I'd argue that Ferrari has abandoned Jim and other traditionalists more than they left Ferrari.
F1 has become so specialized and subject to its own peculiar set of rules that it bears no relationship nor relevance to road cars or even other racing series.

The point is that we're talking about a car that is still under development never mind turned a wheel in anger. It's all speculation viewed through our unique prejudices for and against. Nothing wrong with that but some folks are taking it way too seriously.

 

Mark,
You don't understand or you don't want to understand
Sport Auto lap ring time with Ferrari are in general weird. Hockenheim lap time too.
For Sport Auto the 458 perform on track as a Mercedes SLS AMG ... with the same driver behind the wheel.
Come on ...
AutoBild Sportscars - Supercomparo 2010 (458/LP570-4/GT-R/LFA/SLS/Turbo S/GT MF5) | Page 4 | German Car Forum
In the Autobild comparo, where a pro driver without any bias was asked to drive, the result was that 458 was the faster car and without wearing any semislicks.

Luque

 

I'm excited for Rings times from all three manufacturers. If you're not, that's peculiar. When these times eventually are set I don't want to see you 'ring times are dumb' people posting in that thread which will be difficult for you as I'm sure that thread will be at the top of this section for quite a while. It's not the end all be all but it is a metric that almost all enjoy and that almost all manufacturers test. I would also like to see time comparisons on other tracks. Whether or not these cars can endurance race out of the box is much less important.

I think we can all agree the moment the LaF is run around something other than Ferrari test track, that will be some amazing footage and discussion.


Anybody able to confirm the possible LaF that's supposedly on the east coast right now, per JasonSpidey's post?

 

And than ?
No Autobild is not biased , but when lap are taken in different days you can have big difference (see vairano MP4-12C spider laptime).
Why not Bedford, laps taken same day ?
458 Italia 1:19,3
MP4-12C (Pzero Corsa) 1:19,6
MP4-12C (Pzero) 1:20,6

Nice gaps without slicks ....

As I told you in all the comparison done the same day (EVO, Autoexpress, CAR, Road and Track, AMus) the 458 lapped faster except in Hockenheim (0,2s slower)

Anyway we are off topic.

Luque

 

You think???

 

The.... "458 vs 12c and Nring lap time thread"

 

Please stahp...

 

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/288gto-f40-f50-enzo-laferrari/410271-nurburgring-times-really-relevant.html

Please use it!

 

F1 cars used to race the NS. Personally I found F1 races there to be a Rush.

Ferrari, Porsche and McLaren all clearly said what La Ferrari, 918, and P1 will lap the Ring under. Why do you think they made those statements?

Because that is a metric that people care about.

None of them mentioned what they thought their cars would lap LeMans, Monza, Monaco, or Spa. Why? Because few care what those cars will lap those courses in.

Ferrari, Porsche, and McLaren should all stop bench racing La Ferrari, 918, and P1 in Press Releases and Specification Placards at Auto Shows and have a go.

 

Sounds right to me.

 

Dear James, if I may call you that, as you can see I really respect you. You are a great enthusiast with a collection of cars most of us would kill to have! That said, I have some serious objections.

Yes sure, F1 used to race there till some 37 years ago. Even then though, F1 cars were not really suited to that "rally stage". They had to run special settings, double the ground clearance and just pray that they would last the distance! The duration was roughly 2 hours. People in F1 were really happy when they left that quarry once and for good! Today's delicate F1 machines would be as adequate for that 1930's track as is an F22 fighter for a WW2 airport!

Indeed, all three marques have quoted Ring times. As a marketing man myself, I see that as a disaster. You have to differentiate your product and place it accordingly! Were I to be the force behind Ferrari's marketing, I would have quoted a crazy Monza lap time and I would have asked from the engineers to make it happen!

 

You'd prefer Ferrari to say it's the best without actually having to compete against anyone else and possibly be proven wrong? Quelle Surprise.

This is all babble. Who knows if Ferrari has actually "sold out" their allocation; they say they have, history suggests that to be highly likely, but does anyone think they'd say differently if they hadn't? No, that's not the way they work. That's not the brand or why it's highly profitable. Besides, anyone who knows Ferrari knows that they'll likely produce an extra 100-200 frames over the 499.

 

Ok - I'll bite. Let's say the P1 is the fastest; for sake of arguement; the only one under 7 minutes. Then what? The chest thumpers on the other forums go nuts; the king is dead etc. But do the LaFerrari owners cancel their deposits? Does Porsche cancel the 918 program?
Let's face it; these cars all all going to sell out anyways; some sooner than others. Some will produce more than others; some less. (McLaren cutting production from 500 to 375 has already happened)
Or if this is vice versa; doesn't really matter; the times are pretty irrelevant. It's just to sell magazines and bandwidth on forums.
These cars will never see 10/10ths anyways.
And until the factory enters them as true race cars - why stress out over this????
Kevin

 

I'm sure the factories stress out over it quite bit, because all that chest-thumping is what sells mousepads, T-shirts, video game image rights, etc... my wild guess is that merchandise revenue for these cars is significant.

I don't think genuine purchasers of these cars really give a hoot which one is marginally faster and just buy the one that they subjectively like best. They're all insanely quick anyway, so the marginal differences really don't matter very much. You might have the odd nutter cancel an order because of a "bad" lap time, but I'd bet they're in a tiny minority and there'll be 10 more buyers in line behind them clamouring over the vacated build slot.

All the best,
Andrew.

 

They may not care. But they care that others do.

 

We have a winner.

Ferrari makes a LOT of money licensing it's brand and those that buy Ferrari merchandise care about La Ferrari's Ring time vs 918's and P1's.

 

True.

 

No argument about licensing and revenue; yet in the past the ring time was never an issue with the Enzo, or any other f-car for that matter. It's not the 'be all and end all' though...
Ferrari's merchandise revenue has an awful lot to do with support of the F1 team, not just the road cars...or one specific car they produce

 

The Enzo was 10 years ago. Since then Ring Times have become much more important marketing/awareness/Gross Rating Point wise.

Those who were lucky enough to see F1 cars race THE RING vs the gp course at The Ring understand.

Sizzle sells and Ring Times today are sizzle.

You youngsters who think F1 began with Michael will understand the difference should you wander into "Rush", which by the way is very good. (It will be screened at Pebble on Thursday Night)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=QKAr42gxjhM

 

im sure they will when their cars are ready.

 

Well - for your reference - I saw my first GP at 8 years old; in 1976. So while I haven't seen them at the ring; I'm very well versed in F1's history...yes that's me below...
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Re; Rush...just some guy named James Hunt...
Thread hijack over.
Time to join my wife in the hot tub
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In its day the Enzo had the production hyper-car class to itself. That's no longer the case.