MP4 prices are really plummeting on resale

PM Senna1994, or champagne612 on that "other" Ferrari site. both use theirs regularly, you know like it's a car

 

NSXLuvr here has one and drives it regularly (when it's not on a flat-bed.)

He can chime in on what they are like in the real world.

I've driven the other one here in town, and it is amazing.

 

Facelifted and more HP coming in 2014?

Spied: McLaren 12C Face-Lift - Teamspeed.com

Could make the 2012 cars even more of a bargain.

 

I have had one for a couple of months and about 2000 miles, and a little bit of track time. It does everything exceptionally well, I drive it daily in the rotation of my cars, actually the other sports cars have been neglected lately. The power is simply amazing, with traction control being necessary to prevent wheelspin in gears 1-3. In fact, 3rd gear often feels strongest since the car finally hooks up the best. The dual, independent controls for suspension and Powertrain make it easy to customize the feel you want. You can dial up more agressive power and shifts, but keep the suspension soft. If you grab a paddle in auto mode it immediately goes manual unless you don't shift again within something like 5-10'seconds, or you can just switch to manual. The car is comfortable and civilized in Normal mode to just cruise and talk to a passenger, but it becomes a monster when you want it so. The passenger climat control is on the pax door, so the pax can fiddle without intruding at all I the drivers workspace. The paddles rotate with the wheel.

My car has no problems so far

The doors are unnecessarily difficult to operate and make ingress and egress more difficult than traditional doors. I personally like the drama and "secret" swipe that pops the door, but understand why others don't. The Bluetooth audio quality is marginal, but I did not buy it to talk on phone. The front end clears dips better than my 355, F40, Z06 and Vipers.

I need to drive my buddy's 458 to compare, but I honestly am not that motivated as I really enjoy this car. I honestly think it is a superior car the the 458 in every objectively measurable way, and think the 458 sells better due to slightly better styling, more snarly sound and most importantly because it is a Ferrari and that brand is huge. McLaren is comparatively unknown and the same reason a Rolex goes for more than a Movado makes the Mac cheaper than a 458. They are both fashion accessories first and foremost for most buyers and more people will be impressed by the Ferrari.

As for depreciation, every car does it. You can either jump in and pay for the enjoyment or sit on the porch perennially waiting.

 

Excellent write up Keith, I am one of those that paid MSRP a year ago and although their is depreciation, you only get hurt when you sell it. I agree with all of your thoughts. My friend is dropping off his 458 with me for a week, so I want to drive them back to back. I have driven 458's and I must say both cars have their strength and weakness. Either car you can't go wrong.

As far as the facelift, it looks like it is getting more of a P1 headlights and a new bumper, with a HP boost to 650HP. Personally I think the cars is so strong, that any more HP is just a bonus.

 

Car is STRONG... I've had 2 TT gallardos and a TT R8..I've put 4000 miles
on mine and changed cats for extra 30 HP.

I've easily beaten my neighbors 458. I was embarrased for him,

 

The mayor made a great point. His last paragraph fits me perfect. Had my lambo and still own many other toy cars but I wanted something different so I got a Mclaren 12C. It is a very fast car but not as sexy as the lambo. I would argue the Mclaren a better and more exciting sports car than the Lambo. Although both cars are wonderful. My 458 ferrari is my third Ferrari. Hard not to fall in love with a F cars.

Lee

 

Wayne great to hear it, my wife drove my 12C and commented since the upgrade and the motor breaking in, that felt much stronger.

 

I recommend sport cats makes the car sound like the menace it really is!
Plus pick up 30HP.

 

Good point. This forum is great light, and fun entertainment.

Having said that there are also some guys on this forum that a top mechanics and others that restore cars for a living or fun. Others that have owned wonderful cars I know personnally several who post on this forum alot.

the trick is to know which comments are based on some experience. The profile helps usually it is seems to be an accurate protrayal of the person and what cars they own.

Also the forum bosses watch to be sure people keep civil and do not do things like trolling etc.

The best part is alot of posters on this site are quick to jump on a wrong comment. It has happened to me when I post a incorrect hp number or something else. I think it is a good thing.

To your point everyone can have an opinion but we can look at the profile to see if you nelieve or accept the comment.

You made a great point

Lee

 

I take delivery of a brand new 2013 12C Spider on Friday and I already have a 2013 458 Spider. I've got 2,600 miles on the 458 Spider since it arrived in January and I put a few thousand miles on my 458 Italia in the six months before I traded it in on that car. So I've got over 5,000 miles (including a little track time) driving my 458s between the Italia and the Spider. I plan to take the 12C and the 458 Spider to the track and do back-to-back comparisons there as well. But I don't consider myself a race driver so we're simply talking about driving it on a road corse with no speed limits as opposed to trying to set record lap times. I'll get them over 150 mph but I won't go crazy.

I plan to thoroughly access the strengths and weaknesses of both cars over time but I can tell you from the 2-hour test drive I took in my car last week that I think it is a pretty exciting car and I don't buy that whole "lack of emotion" tag that many journalists have labelled it with. I loved driving it and my initial response was that it drives beautifully.

The fact that McLaren is making something this good as only their second true road car (the SLR was more Mercedes than McLaren) is pretty astonishing especially when you consider how many road-going models Ferrari has built to get where they are with the 458.

 

Excellent point, I think you will love your 12C, again, the 458 is an absolutely fantastic car and has its strength and weakness as well as the 12C does. But something about sitting in a carbon tub with that view out and the explosiveness of the turbo's at 3,500 RPM's. What a Rush!

 

I think 12c prices have stabilized in the past 2 months. 220 to 195 seems about the point depending on MSRP and mileage.

 

I wish you would come out and try mine now that it is absolutely perfectly dialed in. Bob it flat flies, I still can't believe how fast it is.

 

I drove one at Exotic racing. It moves alright!

I saw one the other day in Santa Monica that was all black like yours. It's a terrific looking car that way. You made the right choice!

There's no question though that the big depreciation has come to a halt for the past couple of months. Maybe the panic sellers have stopped panicing?

 

No more Coupes Bob for 2013 only a few special ordered at Sticker. I don't know what the Exotic Racing one was like, but I have had mine tweaked to perfection by McLaren NB, that is why I want you to try it out.

 

The one at Exotic is serviced at NB. I drove it the day it came back. In fact, the day before they couldn't guarantee it would be available even though I reserved it. They only have one as far as I can see. It had the upgrade.

I think it had like 6K miles on it. Steel brakes of course but the brakes were great. I got into the ABS a couple of times.

They are doing the right thing about not sending over more coupes. Maybe that's causing the stabilization. No question someone misread the market. But, they are rookies at this so you can expect them to make some marketing mistakes.

I still hear people complaining about Iris. Did they fix yours?

What impressed me was no turbo lag -- at least what I could determine. I've never driven a turbo car that didn't have lag.

 

IRIS is still on and off, but I don't really care about the NAV, what sucks is the bluetooth with the upgrade, it was better before. But in this car, I would rather not yack on the phone anyway. Let me know when you are down this way and lets try to hook up for once.

 

Your last senteance perked my interest. I do not feel and turbo lag on my 12c Meclaren. I was told on this forum I would feel it as I get acquainted with the car. I can not feel any.
I have really been paying attention to feel any lag at all or something. I know how Porsche does it, what gives how does the 12C pull this off ?

I do know this car is wicked fast and I love it. Life is good

Best
Lee

 

Apparently they redesigned IRIS and the MY14 cars will have it. Apparently it's now using Android and everything about it is way better, including the screen. It will be a retrofit for older car to replace the current system if they want, though it will most likely be at the owners expense. Hopefully they will do upgrades at cost + labor rather than something expensive.

Well, all of this is according to someone who spoke to McLaren and used the new system at Pebble Beach.

Guess we'll wait and see.

 

Having driven about 500 miles on mine now I can say that I see why some people say it lacks excitement -- it's almost too damn quick To hit the high revs, you are absolutely hauling ass.

It's actually hard not to obliterate the speed limit within a couple seconds.

 

I've never noticed the lag either. You touch the pedal, you go like hell.

 

Question then, since you have an R8TT - do you think that there is value in turbocharging an R8 now if the MP4 is an option?

A new R8 + turbo has to be within $10-30k of an MP4?

 

I own the Audi R8 V10 and the MP4. I like both cars as they come stock. If you want a faster R8 the GT version has alot more HP. I sill think the MP4 would be faster.

I always am concerned about resale value on a modified cars. Most of my freinds who collect will not go near a modified car. having said that restomods sell well at mecum.

best

Lee

 

New? No, since the R8 is getting replace in a year or two I would rather wait for the next generation.

I had bought the R8 when it first came out, thus had the V8. $30K+V8 was like 630hp, thus it was more powerful than the stock V10/GT, and it was cheaper than selling and buying a V10/GT. To me the value proposition was there.

If you go the V10 route + TT today, you'll have a way faster car than an MP4, at least in a straight line. It would run you probably like $150K all-in if bought used. That is $40-50K less than a good used MP4.

Would I buy one now? Not unless I just wanted tons of power and cheaply and went with a used V10. Maybe a few years ago when the R8 was mid-life I'd do it, but I don't like buying outgoing models and the R8 is definitely on its last couple years.

To be honest, the performance of the MP4 is insane. It's absurdly quick to relatively high speeds. The only thing the R8 TT would do is give you quicker acceleration over 100mph. 0-60 would probably be just as quick in the 12C and probably hold it's own up to 90-100mph. The 800-1000hp in an R8 TT will take over from there, but you really have to ask yourself if it's worth having performance above those speeds and how often you can use it.

For me, it's not. Car performance is now so high that you can have stock cars that are just as quicker or quicker in all the most usable situations. And best of all, no potential headaches that might come with tuned cars.

That said, an R8 is still one of the best cars you can buy right now, and it's one of the last great exotics with a manual transmission. Can probably get a good used V10 with a manual from $110K.