Red Bull's new legal diffuser... | FerrariChat

Red Bull's new legal diffuser...

Discussion in 'F1' started by Wolfgang5150, Sep 24, 2013.

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  1. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    Only a fool would underestimate Newey.

    This is worth translating; basically it says that after Spa, Red Bull revised their diffuser to create the downforce effect that was outlawed after last year....


    Game over Ferrari
     
  2. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    #2 Ferraripilot, Sep 24, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2013
    they further raised the outermost verticle wall of the diffuser those allowing for a larger potential of exhaust driven plume-wall effect thus larger diffuser. it's just a hyperbole of what they had being doing before, they must have their exhaust angled perfectly for this work, and apparently they do
     
  3. LMPDesigner

    LMPDesigner F1 Rookie
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    echnical point : the Red Bull has managed to create the aerodynamic effect in a legal manner prohibited by the regulation. For opponents , the Ferrari down, no match

    The triumph of Vettel in Singapore reduced nearly to zro the hopes of Ferraari . In technical point of Paul Filisetti here is how does the Red Bull to go so strong , especially in circuits with high downforce .




    " After qualifying , we had noted what was the technical gap that separated Red Bull and Ferrari , analyzing RB9 the fact that you are in the course of the season proved to be an extremely long-lived cars , in terms of margins of development. We have alleged, among the causes who made this possible, the cast of technical regulations in recent years. Such opinion, after the race in Singapore, is even more strengthened, and at the same time the result , but also the way in which Vettel won , provide us confirmation that a clue on which we had based our ratings starting from Monza , proved exactly the key point of the competitiveness of RB9 . I am referring to the speaker that was changed between Spa and Monza , now presented in its final form . in particular, this element is deeply modified in the side channels , where , in particular in correspondence of the outer , its terminal part diverges strongly outward , creating a true venturi profile .



    Looking at the detail of this change on the starting grid at Monza and then here in Singapore , it was possible to note how its middle section is perfectly integrated to the position of the tailpipes , while the side sections correspond exactly to the position of " skirts heat " generated by the discharges themselves. In essence , it is clear that this element has been optimized to create that blow otherwise prevented by regulatory measures that tended specifically to avoid that produce this effect . In essence the RB9 are equipped with a diffuser fed to perfection by the air flow that is channeled into it using the heat of the exhaust gas .
     
  4. Drive550PFB

    Drive550PFB Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Who did the translation. Looks mechanical.
     
  5. Wolfgang5150

    Wolfgang5150 F1 Rookie

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    Looks like google translate; looked the same way for me
     
  6. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    Newey must have not liked being beaten by brawn gp's diffuser and has become obsessed.
     
  7. hairy_scotsman

    hairy_scotsman Formula 3

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    It was game over as soon as they changed the tires mid-season.
     
  8. Sellnit

    Sellnit Formula Junior

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    +1
     
  9. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

    Red Bull use the same tires. Their car is better as a package. Simply put Red Bull have developed a better car again.

    If Im not mistaken the tires are now what we had last year and Ferrari didnt get it right then either. Until Ferrari have qualy pace for the front row it wont matter.
     
  10. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
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    Everyone's on the same tires, but the specification of the tires changed halfway through the season - causing them to run slightly cooler in the rears. I think they moved from a kevlar belt to a steel belt... though it was possibly the other way around. Not able to look it up right now.

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
  11. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    "In a legal manner prohibited by the regulations"
    What, if anything, does that mean?
     
  12. classic308

    classic308 F1 Veteran

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    Ferrari and lotus were kind on the early spec tire but Pirelli changed construction mid season and it was game over.
     
  13. of2worlds

    of2worlds F1 World Champ
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    They harnessed the air flow in a legal way that gave them the same (or perhaps better?) effectiveness they had in performance before...
    Swapping the power source next year for something different won't hurt the dominance of RB.
    CH
     
  14. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I get what they did but am confused how it can be both legal and prohibited.
     
  15. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

    Its not about the tires completely.... BBC Sport - Sebastian Vettel and Red Bull are a perfect fit


    FERRARI NEED TO FIX QUALIFYING WOES

    Fernando Alonso drove another fantastic race to finish second after starting seventh on the grid.

    His pure racecraft is second to none, but there is a bit of a theory developing in F1 at the moment that there is more time in the car in qualifying.

    Some have concluded that means Alonso is not as quick in qualifying as he is in the race. I wouldn't go along with that, but I do think there must be a reason why the combination of him and Ferrari together is not doing better in qualifying.

    If you watched the BBC coverage over the weekend you may have seen the shots from an infra-red camera on the Ferrari showing the temperatures of the rear tyres, which were very high on the inside of the tread.

    All the teams are trying to exploit the exhausts gases for aerodynamic effect by blowing them on downforce-producing surfaces at the back of the car.

    But Ferrari don't seem to be getting as much out of that as they could do because they are losing a lot of the energy the exhausts create on the brake duct by making it hit the tyre.

    The effect of that in qualifying will be to heat the rear tyres up, but that's not good because generally teams struggle to get the front tyres up to temperature in qualifying.

    If you heat the rears up, then it makes it the problem of getting the front tyres up to temperature bigger.

    Alonso started seventh and was third after the first-corner complex. If he could start third, he could be leading at that point.

    He's exceptional in the race and there has to be something stopping him doing better in qualifying. **If I was Ferrari I'd be focusing on the exhausts.
     
  16. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Not sure about that leading on the first corner bit. Part of his advantage at the start comes from his amazing ability in traffic. Not as big a factor when starting from the first row.
     
  17. 4rePhill

    4rePhill F1 Veteran

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    Gary Anderson highlighted some footage from Singapore of the thermal image camera on the Ferrari that faced the rear tyre and noted that there is a hot spot on the trailing edge of the tyre where the exhaust gasses hit it.

    Basically this shows that not all of the hot exhaust gasses are being directed to the rear diffuser and that some are hitting the tyre which he claims to be part of their current issues, saying that it is inefficient and unbalances the cars mechanical grip balance by overheating the rear tyres.

    Whilst this could be true, without knowing all of the information about how Ferrari have designed their car, it cannot really be determined as being an issue. It could just as easily be the case that Ferrari deliberately allow some of the hot gasses to hit the rear tyre in order to improve the balance of the tyre grip. They may have found that, without using the exhaust gas, the rear tyres were actually staying too cool for optimum performance.
     
  18. ELP_JC

    ELP_JC Formula 3

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    Leading??? Didn't you see Vettel leave him for dead after a restart when he was 2nd?

    THAT makes more sense :D.
     
  19. Drive550PFB

    Drive550PFB Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Try this . . .

    "In a legal manner that would prohibited by the regulations if a movable diffuser were used or if a 'blown diffuser' were otherwise used."
     
  20. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

    Sorry but your quote are words from BBC....try there.
     
  21. DF1

    DF1 Three Time F1 World Champ

  22. TifosiUSA

    TifosiUSA F1 Veteran

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  23. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    +1 they deserve a penalty
     

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