Why do the Ghiblis worth 4 times less than Daytona, Iso Grifo, and Bizzarini ?

You are correct looking at the list about 2/3 had PS many of the early cars up until around 150 did not.


My Ghibli sounded every bit as good as a Ferrari

 

if remember correctly one of the lele's was 317 or 321. the other not far off. no ps no a/c both had highperf 350 cid chevs (no 327). all cleveland lele's i saw had ps.
the grifo had a 396 chev and 4 speed muncie. when i bought it it had broken a valve stem which created havoc, so rebuilt everything. it ran phantastically after that with a true hammering v8 sound. better roadholding and similar braking than the ghibli.
the steering really came into its own at speed on these cars.never bothered me.

 

The 2 Marlboro cars had 351 Cobra Jet engines and did not have PS, of course they were different than any other Leles in a number of ways.

 

they were basically the same as the lele sport and i seem to remember at least 5 marlboros were built. the 351 engines were ported and produced a gross 360 hp like the sport. bumpers were plastic as was the interior with different layout altogether. the lele was a heavy car and the aim was to make it lighter.in 1979 in brussels i met a gentleman who had an Ennezeta built sport (his second or third lele) who said they were the best of the lot. iam going to check if i stil have copies of my old chassis numbers etc.

 

Think of all the ISO & Bizzarini guys missing out on this discussion.

 

They actually only built 2 Marlboro cars for their F1 drivers, Bizzarrini was a consultant on the cars, one for Howden Ganley (#184) and the other for Nani Galli (#185). Galli retired soon after receiving #185 and returned it to Phillip Morris. New Iso Marlboro driver Arturo Merzario was given access to #185 during his time with the team. After the team disbanded, Phillip Morris gave #185 to Emerson Fittapaldi for winning the World Championship in a Marlboro sponsored car.

The 2 Marlboro cars served as the prototypes for the Lele Sport, however the Sports were softened up for use by the general public. (different dash, thicker padding, sound deadening, power steering etc.) Phillip Morris had Marlboro badges added to 2 or 3 Sport Leles to create replicas of the Marlboro cars given to the F1 drivers for promotional purposes.

Below is a comparison photos of the interiors of the Marlboro built for Ganley (#184) and one of the replicas (#204). It should also be noted that only #184 & #185 are stamped as Marlboro on the build sheets.
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thank you for letting me know. explains why i still had this number 5 in myhead after such a long time. weird to leave the electric windows when you want to save weight but there you are. iknow both howden and nani quite well so will ask them when i see them next what they thought of these cars. i always liked mine they were roomy, comfortable and reliable. and fast enough for europe in the early eighties.

 

Have you looked at Mangusta prices lately?

De Tomaso Mangusta For Sale, (Car: advert number 214375) | ClassicCarsForSale.co.uk

http://www.classicdriver.com/en/car/de-tomaso/mangusta/1969/193277

 

+1 LOL

Actually I just bought a Grifo (can't wait to get it) therefore I'm enjoying the discussion.

Ivan

 

Ivan,
Sounds like you are going for the same collection I am, Ghibli, Daytona, Grifo, and Islero. The 60s front engine Italian GT cars. It is amazing that cars that seem so similar can be so different.

BTW I am finishing up the latest edition of the Iso Bizzarrini Owners Club Newsletter - Griffon. It will be a special double issue.

 

No Islero on the horizon for me, although I do like those cars. A friend bought the Islero that recently sold in Monterrey (Ferrucio's personal car), which is very unique and with an excellent restoration. Still hoping to get the Daytona, have one selected, just need to work out the numbers.

Looks like I will be getting a Lancia Aurelia B24S convertible and a Flaminia convertible (2.8 liter, triple carb), from another friend. The cars need to be finished before we can complete the sale. I've never had a vintage Lancia and I am fascinated by their engineering ... very advance for its time.

In my older age I need to keep things interesting, so it is time to rotate the inventory

Ivan

 

Ivan,

I can't wait to see your fist post after you drive that car, it has loads of power.


Left to right Piero Rivolta, Howden Ganley and Mike the new driver of the iso Marlboro FI car
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Two that I have seen are over 200K but asking price is not a sale price, however that said I think both of these cars the lime green one and the 3000 mile car will break that mark.

 

The Lamnos have V-12's and are mechanically more sophisticated.
Aston Martin: All Astons from DBS (1967) have a DeDion rear suspension. DB6 soldiert on with live axle. Alas, no cart springs.

Mangusta's will be next to go up IMO. Super exotic, relatively rare, very sporty/aggressive looking. Never mind about the handling, it all looks great on paper.

Next to include: Monteverdi? (I really want a Palm Beach)

Best,

Jack.

 

That's quite a range of torsos! It's been a while since I last saw Piero "in the flesh".
Ah well like I should talk anyway. I'm certainly not towards the right of that photo. It's "middle of the road" for me ... LOL

Which forum is this again? Iso confusing if not Rivolting I kid.

 

Ah Maserati had De Dions even before Celine though she had pretty good arse herself.

I own both an old Maserati V8 and Lamborghini V12. The high rpm 4.0L V12s make for some wondrous tunnel music but not nearly as much grunt as the 4.9L V8. In the end I think my Bora is quicker than my Espada, equally sophisticated, but I didn't buy the Espada for that. I've driven a Miura as well. All are eclipsed in quickness by my Biturbos. I know SACRILIGE!

I'd take the Espada's chassis over the Ghibli's on any day though. One is more like a truck. Bora bests them Both!

 

It is ironic that the AC 428 (which many thought was a direct copy of the Ghibli styling) is now probably also worth 4x the dollar count.

 

Actually it is not the Ghibli, but the Mistral that Frua used for the AC 428.

 

I think Aston Martin looked very hard at the Ghibli before they ended up with the DBS

 

Sorry, but look at all three cars - the Ghibli and the 428 are sisters, but the Mistral is an older cousin.

But yes, a reference book I have claims what you say. I just cannot see it after looking at the three. Since the 428 came about in 1966 (production) could it be that it actually came in advance of the Ghibli?

 

Bob come Espadas are great as we know but to even suggest any part of Celine dion is attractive come on!,,,,,she's a hag


And I am a proud Canadian


Gary
Espada
8394

 

It has been said that she sings better on the Radio or the Phonograph Record than on the Videotape.

Pretty voice - mouth like a bottom dwelling fish.

 

You need to take a better look at the cars. Mistral was a Frua design debuting in 1964 1st photo. Then came the AC 428 also a Frua design 2nd photo.

The Ghibli debuted in 1966 designed by Ghia (Guigaro) 3rd photo. After Ghia was acquired by DeTomaso the DeTomaso Zonda was shown as a Ghia design (Tjaarda). 4th photo
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Tom Tjaarda was quoted as saying "when you worked for De Tomaso you did what he told you to do" I've seen a 428 in person, its a bit of a brutal design. not as delicate as the Mistral.

 

LOL Oh you had to bring that into the fold!