Australian Ferrari Concours, the present system and why it sucks!

There has been some discussion in recent posts on Concours judging in Australia.

I have submitted the following proposals, in various forms, to various FCA committees since 2008 to enhance the Concours experience for the FCA. I NEVER get a response and hence I have given up trying to push for a better system

I personally believe that the preservation of the Ferrari in its ORIGINAL form is the ultimate form of Ferrari ownership …. NOTE I didn’t say a ‘garage queen’.

To put GT cars onto a racetrack made sense to me for about 5 years, then I had a drive in a REAL race car and thought what is the point?? Ferrari road cars are magnificent GT touring cars.

So below is what I have submitted



The present AUSTRALIAN judging system.
At any National Concours there will be at least 40 cars who will present for Concours. This will take IF WELL ORGANIZED, from 9.30am until 3 or 4pm.

Between 1988 and 200I, together with up to 12 other judges, I have judged at virtually every Concours , including the Concours at Darling Harbour in 2006. It becomes VERY wearing and tiresome using the Australian system.

Therein lies the problem as to why the Australian system is unpopular with both judges and contestants. Our system produces a non-involvement with the outcome. It's all very well to look at 40 sets of suspensions, that is NOT looking at a Ferrari as a whole.

However the Australian system is OK for up to 15 Cars, Ie. Midway Rally at Cowra in 2004



I tried a different system for Thredbo 2007

2 sets of 4 judges. The Australian system was used in full. There were 2 “chief judges”

1 set judged - 246 (4 cars) V12 up to 73 (1) Flat 12 (3)V12 2+2 (up to 73) (2)V8 2+2 (4) 550/599 (4). A total of 18 cars

2nd set judged 308/328 (5) 348/355 (7) 360/430 (6) A total of 18 cars

The positives were that judging was finished by 12.30pm. However because of the weather and a breakdown in communication, further judging needed to be done. This could be put down to teething problems, however in my opinion it was far less stressful for the judges and entrants than the normal Australian way.

The MAJOR deficiency with the Australian system and the modified system is that the reults are NOT known until the ‘SORT in order’ button is pushed on the computer. In other words ANOMALIES in the system are NOT identified ‘as you go’



The USA system is used.
The overall mantra is that Ferraris are meant to be driven

The overall Concours philosophy, using their judging sheets, is that the cars are judged on Condition and Originality, rather than the “perfect” polish. ‘Newness’ is NOT a factor.

A group of 4 judges judge 1 car in full, then move onto the next car. Each judge judges a section, and gives his sheet to the chief judge who then tallies the score. Anomalies ARE identified and acted on if noted at the time.

The owner is expected to be with the car, and the FIRST question he is asked is “Is there anything on your car that is not original or that you are concerned about” … I have noticed how some owners look decidedly concerned at that question.

There are NO points for age/distance travelled, or lost for cars trailered to the venue.
This was put into the last Australian judging sheet to try and encourage the older cars to come to Concours because of the perception that older cars would lose to a car "put in a bubble at the factory gates and presented at the Concours venue". It has NOT worked, or it has produced anomalies.

The judges HAVE to understand the different models and what constitutes originality .. however the USA system has developed a system whereby there is actually a number ( quite a lot actually) of interested people who are on a panel. There are members who ‘specialise’ in certain models

With the internet and the Ferrari media it is actually easier in 2013 to get an ‘understanding’ of what is original and so on.

A platinum award is given to ANY car that scores 95 points or better
A Gold award is given to ANY car that scores 90 to 94.5 points (only 1 per class)
A Silver award is given to ANY car that scores 85 to 89.5 points (only 1 per class)
If anyone can tell me why a tatty 246/308, or whatever, should “win” a class in a Concours simply because it is the only half reasonable entry of several woeful entries I am open to convincing!!!

The ‘chief’ judges of each judging group then make a SUBJECIVE decision, based on several set criteria, on who wins ‘overall’ and so on.
There is therefore an element of "Subjectiveness" in the major awards in the USA system, however if that is not in the Australian system, as used at the moment, then I am a "Monkey's uncle", as the saying goes.

I have been involved in several US judging events until 2007. I have NEVER seen a dud chosen as a platinum winner, or as a ‘best in show’.

 

Phil, any system that lets a 308 converted to look like an F40 win a "Ferrari Competition Class" trophy at a state concours is wrong.

Full stop.

 

Having received my first concours trophy recently I found it odd the chassis number was not on the trophy but my name was.

 

Didn't you clean and enter the car?

 

So? If the trophy had the chassis # and not my name it would form part of the car's history abd would be passed on to the next owner

 

So what you are saying is that you are more interested in resale?


No one is getting my trophies!

Maybe they are "dead man" trophies?
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Greetings Jon ... 100% agreed. How many points did it score for 'originality'???.
What gets up my nose is when a car wins 'best in class' with two cars in it, and the winner is VERY tatty ... used to happen regularly in the 246 class.

Greetings Greg ... if you passed the trophies on to the next owner I suspect you would be the very first owner in the history of Concours or Track days to do so

The whole point of a Concours is that cars are judged against THEMSELVES, rather than against other cars.
The whole point of TRACKING is that drivers are judged against other drivers. Hence everyone gets their knickers in a knot when they suspect the 'other car' has been 'modded'.

 

NO, the glory belongs to the car IMO re concours. Not talking about track days

 

I was stupid enough to pass on the full set of books and tools for both the 246 and BB

 

Olio

 

The car cleans itself?

 

so the winner of the Melbourne cup is the owner/s?

 

Is that yaw masturbatorium?

 

Now you are talking about the wrong Horses.

And I don't think the Melbourne cup is judged on cleanliness and originality!

 

Olio

 

Ok, my trophy is staying!

 

Troy looks like he's knocked something off

 

What happens if 3 cars score 93 points - who receives a gold award?

 

they all do.

The idea is that each car is judged against a standard, not the other cars present.

For the Best in Class trophy, if 3 cars had the same score, all cars would be re-judged and the result determined by the senior judge. This also happens under the current system, although the problem usually occurs for best in show.

 

not according to the guidelines above

 

These may have changed since 2005, however I doubt it.

In practice what I have seen and been associated with at a few events in USA are:

Platinum awards go to ALL cars that score >95 points.

If 3 cars score exactly 93 points then 1 car would be awarded a gold, however I have seen >1 car in a class get a gold.

This is a subjective decision by that Class judge. In practice I have seen these close decisions decided whilst the judging is happening. This is because the scores are added as the cars are being judged in that class.

If 5 other cars in that class score 85 to 89.5 then no silvers are awarded ... 1 gold has been awarded already

If NO cars get a platinum and NO cars get a gold then 1 silver could be awarded to a car that gets 85 to 89.5. Silver cars are not terribly good IMHO.

If no cars in that class get >85, then NO awards.



These are the USA Guidelines and cover a lot of bases. Austral;ia does NOT have the older cars, however the flow can be seen:

1. Each Ferrari entered for judging is expected to be fully operational and driven onto the show field for placement in the designated class. Cars are to be shown fully assembled; all parts such as wheels, bumpers, tops, belly pans, etc., are to be attached to the vehicle in the original position. The owner is to be present with the vehicle during the judging. If, for good reason, the owner cannot be available, a single individual may be designated by the owner to show the car during the Class judging process. Owners are encouraged to bring a copy of the original Factory build sheets for their car if available.

2. Each vehicle will be judged by a three person team. Each Judge will evaluate one of the following categories: exterior, interior, engine/chassis. Each component in each category will be judged for both originality and condition. Factory options are considered original, after-market options are not. One of the Judges will be designated the Chief Class Judge, who will be responsible for introductions, final class decisions, submission of the results, and feedback to interested entrants. Judging conflicts of interest are to be avoided. A car may not change from display to judged after the deadline for applications.

3. At the start of judging, each car is assumed to have a perfect score of 100 points. As each component is judged, deductions of 0-5 points will be made as appropriate Each car in the class will be judged by the same team in the same manner. A minimum of 95 points is required for 1st place (Platinum), 90 points for the single 2nd place (Gold), and 85 points for the single 3rd place (Silver). Platinum winners are eligible for Major Awards consideration. The one exception is Pebble Beach where the first, second, and third place winners are all eligible for the Luigi Chinetti Trophy.

4. The Judges will not handle or operate the automobile. Owners or their designated representatives will be asked to demonstrate the proper functioning of components, such as doors, windows, hood, trunk lid, and lights. Such items will be checked on competition cars where applicable. Equipment such as horns, radios, and air conditioning will be briefly checked for operability. A Judge may ask to sit in the car with feet outside for the purpose of properly evaluating the interior of the vehicle.

5. Convertibles are to be judged with the soft top up and properly fastened. Cars with removable roof panels will be judged with the panels in place. Cars that were originally provided with tools and an owner’s manual should have such items available for inspection. Authorized reprints are acceptable. The glove box pouch should be available where applicable. Those entering multiple cars must have a separate tool kit and manual for each entry.

6. The person showing the car will be asked to start the car and run the engine at idle. Proper instrument operation will be evaluated, the engine compartment will be checked for leaks, and lights will be tested. Quartz clock movements with the proper original appearance will be acceptable as a replacement in older cars. If there is a malfunction of any kind, the owner or representative will be given a chance to correct the fault while the next car in the class is being judged.

7. Factory-provided pollution control equipment should be as originally installed and have a working appearance. Modifications to headlights and other lights to conform to federal law, and modifications of structural and exhaust components to allow registration of gray market cars, will be acceptable so long as the changes are consistent and do not seriously detract from the original appearance of the automobile.

8. Routine replacement items, such as spark plugs, filters, battery, window glass, and tires, need not be the exact original brand or type provided that replacements conform to the general appearance, characteristics, and size of the original. Tires with the correct profile should be fitted to original rims and any spare should match unless the spare is an original specially-equipped Factory item.

9. If a car has unique or unusual design characteristics that place originality in question, the entrant should be prepared to offer substantiating documentation to the Chief Class Judge. Safety-related items that are not original, but which were added for safety purposes, such as seat belts, fire extinguisher, side view mirror, or alarm system, will be acceptable provided the installation of such items is neat, unobtrusive, and does not detract from the original appearance of the automobile. This also applies to audio-visual and telecommunications equipment.

10. The key purpose of the Concorso is to promote the preservation of the Ferrari in its original state. Therefore, the primary focus of the judging will be on originality, authenticity and condition, with minor emphasis on cosmetics. Deductions will be made for over-restoration; extravagance detracts from originality. Applied patina is discouraged. Spyder conversions and unauthorized rebodies are ineligible for judging. Over-cleanliness is unnecessary; some slight road dust and wear is to be expected. Ferraris are meant to be driven.