Acceleration: F40, F50, Enzo, CGT & Veyron | Page 31 | FerrariChat

Acceleration: F40, F50, Enzo, CGT & Veyron

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari/F80' started by Bill S, Aug 30, 2009.

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  1. Living4life

    Living4life Formula Junior

    Jun 29, 2008
    263
    Reliability has been great, no issues. I drove 1000miles across the east coast after I picked the car up from the tuner just stopping for gas. Check out Underground Racing - Twin Turbo Lamborghini Gallardo Performance to see more info on the cars.

    It is not really much boost, its about 1 BAR at this 1000HP to the wheels setting. They push these cars to 1800HP to the wheels without any engine issues. They build the heck out of the platform now. It has to do with the modern technology of controlling the cars engine management, tuning and running relatively bigger turbos on a high reving 5.0liter engine.
     
  2. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    Autocar.co.uk has recently tested the F12. It seems slower than the Enzo and the early F40 from 60 mph.
     
  3. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    I find that very hard to believe. Autocar doesn't have my respect when it comes to numbers and that has been the case for decades. According to this: Ferrari Enzo vs Ferrari F12 Berlinetta [10084211], the F12 is on average 1.1s faster than the Enzo from 100 to 200 kph and a staggering 3.1s from 100 to 250 kph! I admit though that these figures seem exaggerated to me. On the other hand, according to this: Ferrari Enzo vs Ferrari F12 Berlinetta - FastestLaps.com the Enzo is just 0.1s slower from 100 to 200 kph which seems more likely, but the difference opens to 1.6s from 100 to 250 kph. In all cases, it seems that the F12 is the faster car (partly down to the 7 speed, double clutch, F1 tranny I would venture), at least till they reach very high speeds. At speeds above 300 kph the Enzo might still be faster. As much as I love the old master, it seems that the youngster has age and power on its side...
     
  4. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    I think the F12 need to be tested again. Too variance between Quattroruote and Autocar test. We must know the real performance which is for a customer car.
     
  5. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    #755 F40 LeMans, Nov 7, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2013
    All depends on how Factory engineers were honest about power claims choice. It seemed they claimed 40 more hp at the end of the development just as soon as the Aventador was delivered. It's a common thing. It's not the first time that a factory claimed an untrusted figure.. often happens.

    Look at my F40's power or the Enzo's torque. They claimed 478 hp, then 540. The Enzo's torque was claimed very high but it seemed to be only slightly greater than the Carrera GT as the engine was delivered.
     
  6. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    The figures suggest that the F12 is as powerful as Ferrari claims. 0-250 kph in 13.9s is mighty impressive! All tests show that the F12 is faster than the Aventador anyway.
     
  7. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    #757 F40 LeMans, Nov 7, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2013
    Remember that 0-250 kph in 13"9 comes from a "reparto esperienze" car that means it was a factory car and even good for development testing. This does not means a customer car should be as fast as this.

    Realzeus, the fact is that there is engine and engine. An engine can be choice to be built with higher tolerances than the production units. This way is usually choice for development research.
     
  8. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    It also doesn't mean that it won't. All manufacturers send factory cars to the tests anyway.
     
  9. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    Sure, all manufacturers send factory cars to the press, this is the reason why I said that the F12 must be tested again, better if it will be a customer car.
     
  10. Bill S

    Bill S Formula 3

    Oct 2, 2004
    1,995
    #760 Bill S, Nov 7, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Motor Trend magazine in the US tested the F12 and the Enzo. That magazine is known for fairly conservative acceleration tests, unlike C&D and R&T magazine. Their test results for the F12 and Enzo are shown below.

    The F12 weighs nearly 1,000 lbs more than the Enzo (4003 lbs vs 3086 lbs) and it has 71 more HP (731 hp vs 660 hp). So the power-to-weight on the Enzo is better (4.67 vs 5.47).

    Granted the F12's engine and gearbox are much better than the Enzo, but it's going to take a bit more to overcome this significant power-to-weight difference.

    60 to 131.7 mph in the F12 is 7.7 sec. I'll need to check that for the Enzo.

    Regardless, 11.3 @ 131.7 mph for a 4003 lb car is pretty impressive.
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  11. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    These performance are there confirming Autocar launch.
     
  12. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    MTs numbers are abysmal. They have also said that the car had massive traction issues. This has been discussed in the F12 forum.
     
  13. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    Well, Quattroruote tested at 13 degrees C, Autocar at 15 degrees C.

    Quattroruote did 160-280 kph 13"0
    Autocar did 100-170 mph (161-273 kph) 13"2

    It seems a lack of power of the second example, to me. Or too much power for the first.
     
  14. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    What about altitude or engine mileage? I think these numbers are withing the statistical error margin.
     
  15. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    Engine mileage surely wasn't. QR's car was tested at 1150 kms. This mileage do not explain to be particulary fast. Air pressure was the only unknown info, but temperature was appox. the same. Honestly this difference is not negligible.
     
  16. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    I bought an other F40 for my son. I think it need to be Vboxed to know how fast is this car. :):):) I think this F40 will be superfast.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. JH

    JH F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 14, 2002
    5,080
    Odense, Denmark
    Full Name:
    Jonas H.
    Do you own Auto Spinetti? :d
     
  18. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    Yes we are. I'm the son.
     
  19. Bill S

    Bill S Formula 3

    Oct 2, 2004
    1,995
    Agreed, especially 0-5 mph. Very cute!
     
  20. Bill S

    Bill S Formula 3

    Oct 2, 2004
    1,995
    #770 Bill S, Nov 11, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Enzo 60 to 131.7 is 6.95 sec (F12 is 7.7). Hopefully we can measure an F12 soon!

    Enzo is pretty fast when built carefully. Like the F40, not sure how many were built carefully!
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  21. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    #771 F40 LeMans, Nov 12, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
    This happens when engines come out from a hasty productive line, this can not happens when production is slowed down for the purposes of care in engine assembly (comprensible by the result after your Enzo's engine reassembly). Usually factory cars made for press testing are produced voluntarily with high care engines (and I think early F40's engines were built with more care too, the F40's production was twice speeded after 1990).
     
  22. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    If I had the situation at hand I will not hesitate to test it.
     
  23. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    8,435
    Bournemouth, UK
    The special assembly line of Ferrari engines is as special and thorough as they come. No mass production there!
     
  24. F40 LeMans

    F40 LeMans Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2009
    826
    #774 F40 LeMans, Nov 12, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2013
    No one said mass production here. But engines comes out with differences in tolerance or delivery production choice as well.

    Early customers F12s are showing less than 600 whp on dynojet dyno. The car on the video showed something like 585 whp. That's almost 50 hp less than Aventadors dyno tested.

    Ferrari F12berlinetta on the dyno at Portland Speed Industries on Vimeo

    All I have to claim here, is not lack of power?
     
  25. MaxMcQueen

    MaxMcQueen Karting

    Jun 23, 2010
    124
    Full Name:
    Max
    LP670 SV was 585 whp.

    Stock 2010 Lamborghini Murcielago LP670-4 SV Dyno Sheet Details - DragTimes.com
     

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