Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

I think if TopGear does a head to head vs these 3 cars, it could be one of the highest rated shows ever. That would be truly epic.....

 

The pictured blue plate "8111WW MC" is, to my knowledge, a Monaco dealer plate (french dealer plates are like that), so indeed no factory car!

 

I think the 918 has a great classic look and will age well but doesn't wow me - it's kind of like seeing a Carrera GT today - it's nice but just doesn't excite me like an F50 does. In fact I'd take a F50 before any of these 3 as I feel it was the true pinnacle of Ferrari and supercars in general - it was simply the PUREST of all - a lightweight, mid-engined V12 with Manual transmission - nothing more and nothing less - today's supercars are all high-tech with 'cutting edge' designs and features that stir no emotion whatsoever for me. I don't need to go faster than a F50.

The P1 I expect will look much better in person (the F50 btw looks WAY better in person than pics due to the fact some cars proportions just can't be appreciated well via images). I quite like it but it's a bit cold to me - just like the factory they build them in, it's just too clean and clinical for my tastes - I'm sure it's the highest-tech in the bunch but I'm just not a techie so I respect and appreciate it but will never lust over it.

The LaFerrari critics and I disagree on why it doesnt look amazing - they all cite the front and back while for me the issue is the SIDE air intake shape. I actually find the front view and rear to be amazing but I just dont like the shape of that side intake. That said, if given the opportunity to drive either of the new big 3, I'd definitely choose the LaF as having a mid-engined high-revving racing V12 appeals the most to me.

All I wish was Ferrari used the Attached F70 Concept instead of the one they ultimately chose as when I saw the attached Concept (I dont believe its one of the original 10 factory concepts but the pics have been on the web for awhile) as this F70 Concept to me is the most incredible design ever that I would've been forced to sell my soul to purchase. As it stands, I'll just take a slow little F50 and be happy
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Another aspect I forgot to mention regarding the P1 is that for me anyway, it simply fails to ultimately meet the magical element of "desirability" - it seems it's supporters continually cite all sorts of facts and figures in essence to try to "prove" to people it's a "better" car - yet ultimately cars in this league aren't about "better" - there's no way to quantify "better" as even if it's "faster," that in itself does NOT make it "better" to potential owners.

It kind of reminds me of 1990's Corvettes - at that time I was part of the new Import movement and heavily modifying my Honda Civic, keeping it a sleeper on the outside while modifying the engine in every way possible (all-motor) and LOVED driving that car and street racing all sorts of cars. Back then, Corvettes were the most common fast car and while it was faster and "better" in every known metric to my car, you couldn't have GIVEN me one for free and had me take it - I simply didn't DESIRE it in any way, shape or form.

(As an aside, I feel low-mileage Honda Civics etc will be a potentially lucrative investment as I'm finally at the age where I can afford nice cars and want nothing more than the experience of driving my old '94 Coupe again. Think about it - collectibles are often things that were mass produced but no one thought to keep or collect at the time - when's the last time you saw a 1994 Honda Civic with under 5k original miles??)

Back to the P1, it's kind of the same way as the Corvette - although I'd certainly take a P1 for free, I'd still WAY rather have an F50 and while McClaren fans would tell me I'm an idiot for wanting a 20-yr old slower car, I would tell them, they simply don't understand there's more to life and driving enjoyment than facts and figures - they can convince me their car is "better" yet they'll never convince me that their car is more "desirable" as I know what my heart desires and it's not a P1 or 918 or even LaF for that matter, it's an F50.

 

Okay matey, you are an F50 fanatic. It was a great car 20 years ago... and it still is. Hell, an RX-7 MK3 is still a great car. This thread is about the next big thing though.

 

They say you should never buy your dream car. I owned an f50 for a few years and sorry to say it was one the most disappointing cars I've ever owned. It was fun to look at but had no personality whatsoever.

 

Wow I am beyond shocked to hear that and will do everything in my power, including taking mind-control/brainwashing drugs, to forget I ever read your post

I'll truly never forget seeing my first one at Penske's Ferrari dealership in south scottsdale back in 1995 - I swear I could sit and stare at the lines of that car for hours and always dreamed I would own 2 - one to drive daily and the other to sit in my living room in lieu of a TV lol.

The nice thing for me was they stayed close to original MSRP for 15 years but of course now in the past 3 years or so, values have skyrocketed, meaning my dream will likely remain just that - which I suppose according to your view my friend, is a good thing.

 

well if its of any help (and bringing it back to the 918/P1/LaFerrari discussion), is this story. The previous owner told me before I bought the car, that he didn't like driving it [reasons explained]. I thought about that for a while, and decided that I want to know and experience these things for MYSELF. Not just take someone's word for it, or read about it on the Internet, that I needed first hand knowledge of these things. Perhaps he was wrong? I mean, everyone is different. So I went ahead anyway and bought the car from him, and now I know for myself.

I say the same thing with these 3 cars -- if they speak to you in some way, then forget what other people think and go with your dreams. If it works out then great, if not then at least you have the first-hand knowledge and memories to know for yourself. You won't know unless you try. SO if its the F50 you seek, then you should keep trying regardless of whatever I (or anyone else) has to say about it.

That's why I don't get wrapped up in all these juvenile 'looks like crap' comments. Looks are the most subjective opinion of all, and are the least useful IMO. Don't like it? Great, thats your prerogative. But that in itself would not change my opinion of anything. What we all seek is a driving experience, and until we drive/own them we just DON'T KNOW.

 

Interesting. Most people I take for a ride in the F50 says it's their favorite of all my cars. The new Cayman I drove the other day is the definition of no personality. I found myself playing with the paddle shifters to see when I could feel it shift.

Can't wait to drive a P1, 918 and LaFerrari. But none will be an F50 (or F40 or Enzo...).

 

i've spoken to other f50 owners and have never heard anyone say this

 

Well I suppose, as he says, it's HIS opinion and rightfully so. It just really goes to show how personal taste in art, cars etc is so subjective. For example, people LOVE Napolis P4/5 and I like the back of it but overall am not a big fan of it - to me the greenhouse looks kind of lame but I can attribute that's likely mostly due to the fact that it was inspired from a car that was BEFORE my time. If I grew up watching those style/era cars racing, I'm sure I'd probably love the P4/5 design as it would harken back to a time I fondly remembered.

And that's the crux about the cars we argue so passionately about - what matters most is the emotions they elicit and emotion often goes hand in hand with memory so people who were alive during a certain time will always love cars that tap into their emotions/memories. Today's P1/918/LaF will undoubtedly be the poster cars of a new generation but the Manufacturers of them clearly added some elements of design to make potential owners recall the poster cars of their day (P1 to the F1, 918 Martini livery, LaF side line to the F40/F50).

For me I'll never forget the moment and feelings I had when I saw my first F50 in 1995 and as such, it will always be my "favorite" no matter what Frefan or any others say - it reminds me of a certain time of my life when I dreamed big and it was the pinnacle of its day and that nostalgia is what matters - after all, we could always just build a box on wheels that's reliable and get from A to B. Yet we don't.

 

Yeah but what do YOU think? I suppose you're the one driving, right?

Personally I think the car had huge understeer and lacks low-end torque. It feels back end heavy. It just doesn't drive like a 1m car should.

 

Yep, it has all that. But driving fast with the revs over 6k is a real thrill. It makes my CGT feel luxurious. Definitely not my first choice for going very fast safely.

Lots of $1M cars (and $20M cars) that don't drive like they should.

 

The blue Monaco plates are temporary plates for someone who just bought a car (new or used)

 

????

I take it this is said for effect as there can be no way an f50 can be described as having "no personality whatsoever." Looks etc are open ended , fair enough but the drive ? The personality ? I am very confused .

 

Aha, thanks for properly explaining!

 

I understand looks and opinions but the driving leaves me utterly bemused .

The f50 is a beautiful driving , pure analogue Supercar . Surpassed only by the Cgt in my opinion .
If you are at least a certain level of driver I am shocked that it can be experienced and leave one anything but exultant .

 

I'd mirror those thoughts. The F50 looks like it should be a terrifying drive but by today's standards the power to weight ratio is very close to a 430 Scuderia.

When you drive it, it sounds crazy inside at all speeds, yet the car doesn't wake up until you are over 5000rpm. I guess that is why it may not meet expectations. In normal driving you don't get to high rpms much so it feels very docile. I know I've wondered how anyone can lose control when driving one. It doesn't seem possible. It's like coming face to face with Hyde but finding Jekyll.

The CGT is the opposite. The styling is less in your face however you have power everywhere and the car will bite you if you don't respect it at any speed. It is, by far, the more exciting car to drive. Plus the sound, especially with a proper exhaust, is spine tingling. Jekyll turns to Hyde.

 

F50 power band is very narrow. 6,000-7,500. If we were talking about a turbo car, that would be considered HUGE lag and a HUGE failure. even the F40, which *is* a turbo car, has less lag than that.

Go into a turn too fast, you'll be rewarded with front tires squeeling and the back end coming to the front. Go in too slow, and you'll wonder where the other 4 cylinders went.

IIRC Jeremery Clarkson named it one of the worst cars of all time (a bit extreme IMO) but I largely agree. Watch Chris Harris' (not so positive) review, and I totally agree there as well. Once you get past the 'OMG I'M DRIVING A FERRARI F50", there's nothing to back it up. Maybe I'm just spoiled by the F40 and some other very nice cars in my stable. I think the only thing keeping the F50 alive is it was a limited production. If it was mass produced they'd be falling big time.

BTW, my old car (low mileage mint condition) is again for sale in case anyone is looking. Buyer had it a year or so and flipped it for probably good money. I guess he'd rather have the money than the car. I'd buy it back for close to what I paid for it (I did enjoy looking at it) but not for what the market is asking today which is crazy money.

 

I think there was something wrong with your car or perhaps or it was not being driven correctly or in the correct environment ? It handles brilliantly , you use the rear weight , its screamer engine etc
Its a high revving NA supercar , thats its raison detre not a flaw surely ?

Jeremy Clarckson is an entertainer ( self confessed ass ) and the Harris vid was about sliding more than anything ( cars werent even used on the road ) and it was never going to fare well against an f40 which is one of his all time faves . Even so , it was hardly " not so positive ".

It was recently joint analogue supercar winner to boot

I think we will agree to completely and utterly disagree on this one .

 

The things Frefan describes is what I expect - a low-torque, high power at high revs car whose character changes drastically from the low end of the power band to the high - which I'd expect makes it more predictable/controllable and easier to daily drive. And the quirks he describes to me sounds like "personality" - after all I'd think a car that's "perfect" like a P1 would lack personality. And of course the F50 is rear heavy - seeing it in person I couldn't believe just how short the front is - the hood is literally about 2 feet to the windshield so the whole car IS the rear! That said, his prior supercar experience shapes his view of the F50 for the negative while my inexperience will shape mine for the positive.

So I'm glad to hear the opposite side of this coin from you but I guess it doesn't really matter much either way as I'm so in love with just the looks as well as the simplistic (analog as you aptly called it) and pure idea of the car that I would imagine I'd find a way to love the way the car drives regardless of its actual driving dynamics. The only analogy I can offer would be falling in love with a girl you met online without a picture (Manti Teo style, having months of deep conversations not ever knowing what she looks like, then finally meeting her one day - even if her looks weren't your typical "type" you might find the fact that you love the IDEA of her so much that you find a way to not just accept but love her looks/flaws. Obv its not a perfect analogy as I know what the F50 LOOKS like but have no idea how she drives but I'm sure you get the point.

 

I don't care if Jim wants to take some credit for this or not...

I think it's really good looking

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEG_DVgcnD8]Ferrari LaFerrari on the road! + Sound! - YouTube[/ame]

I like the Porsche's purity though. And, I like the Mac's boldness and desire to do something different.

All three have plenty to offer.

 

It looks mean as hell.

 

After many drives (at some ridiculous speeds, on wonderful roads roof off, reaching 260km/h and regularly hitting 8000rpm, and even through towns etc), I am at a loss to understand your opinion.
I rate the F50 as the purest, most engaging, thrilling and exciting Ferraris of all time and place it above the Enzo, the F40 and even the 288GTO as a driving experience.
Wow.
Each to their own I suppose. I couldn't disagree more.

 

Guys, this thread is a discussion on the 918, P1 and LF and how the compare.

If you want to talk about the F50 will you please do so in this thread: http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/288gto-f40-f50-enzo-laferrari/308666-f50-thread.html