Paul Walker from Fast and Furious died in a wreck...

Now dont quote me on this but I am sure I read somewhere the car was quite recently serviced . Apparently there was a thread on a forum that then got taken down ?
It's madness for a reputable shop to let a car like the carrera gt go out on clearly expired rubber .

 

Question: If the car is not tracked or driven recklessly (above the speed limit - within the laws of the road) how are 9 year old tires a problem when properly maintained and the car garage stored...?

 

The rubber itself " drys out " so to speak, becomes hard and slippery, the sensation is alot like driving on ice ( extreme case ) from age alone, regardless of storage conditions.

I personally have driven Ferrari's with aged tires, where the rear wheels will lose traction at top of the gear just before shifting..

And this was driving normally and respectfully , well within the legal limits.

S

 

While I understand your statement, a shop has no control over a client chosing to pick up their car and what they to do with it.

Now, if said shop failed to document the condition of the tires and/or where the client declined the replacement, that's another story.

S

 

What we let out or not let out is not our decision. It is the owners.

It may or may not be madness but it is the owners responsibility alone.

 

In theory they shouldn't be a problem if the speed limits of the roadways are adhered to and if it wasn't getting tracked or driven hard. There are a good number of normal and collector cars out there that have older tires on them with reasons ranging from historical/period significance to sheer ignorance. Either way- its just not safe.
I'd venture to guess that this was not the first time this car was put through its paces and what I don't understand is with 'that level' of gearheads and racers around it and in care of it I'd really think they would identify the importance of having at least somewhat fresher rubber on that car. One of the first things to go after for improving handling and drive characteristics & general safety is the tires.

 

Only speculation on why not replace but I bet the car had ridiculously low miles on it. And I bet no one cared to look because the tires probably looked new.

Yes it is called Vulcanization. All rubber breaks down over time depending on the compound some rubber faster than other. Eventually it becomes plastic. A fantastic reason to change all of the High Pressure FUEL Injection rubber lines in your car....(no seriously get this done asap)

This process on 8 year old performance tires means you need exponentially longer warm up times to get the tires up to operation temp. And I think the smoking gun in this entire unfortunate series of events is the quote " I will be back in 5 minutes"

My old 328 took more than 5 minutes just to warm up the engine oil to the right temp. Cant imagine going out and not having those tires warmed up.

I experienced cold tires in a Mondial with an on ramp and she almost got away from me... The Mondials are scary with cold tires.

This CGT took only 118 seconds from the Pit to experience what appears as slight lift off oversteer. The tires really need to be a lot hotter to grip.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRwGA10U6xE]Porsche Carrera GT Spins Out on Track - YouTube[/ame]

 

Too many assumptions. Who says that the driver wanted grip? Perhaps they wanted to drift.

You don't know which they wanted. Grip? Drift?

Then you compound your baseless assumption about "grip" (baseless because the answer is currently unknown) by criticizing "old" tires.

You can win races on old tires. Grip. You can win gymkhanas on old tires. Drift.

If old tires are a factor in the crash, then that needs to be explained technically.

What was the condition of the tires post-crash? Shredded? Intact? Melted? Flat? Punctured? Disintegrated? On cords? On rim or dismounted?

Is a crash report even in yet to know if tires were a factor?

If not, then there is useless speculating going on.

 

That's silly. Those tire temps were likely identical to the filming car coming out of the pit at the same time behind the CGT, and it didn't spin.

Logic, people!

What was Freakin' **DIFFERENT** about the cars that didn't spin out in that video from the one that did?

Answer that one question.

 

Its funny that you attack all the assumptions with assumptions... But to answer this question ................The two obvious differences are those are not CGTs and those are different drivers with different levels of experience (assumptions and Conjecture) Just like my assumption that the tires were too cold. But it is easy to assume that if the CGT has twice the power and goes out of the pit and spins on the first big lap it must be either the Car, The tires, the experience level or like most accidents some combo of those....


Now back to your drift assumption theory.. REALLY? Whats next? A mystery Banana?

 

It's really simple, the CGT is the car you do not want to have bad tires on when you go for a drive.(We know what that means..).

I still cant believe these people, out of all people, would have bad tires on their car considering all the knowledge, experience and $$$/material they had available by snapping their fingers.

 

If you go to 1 minute 16 seconds in that video, both the Porsche 911 and the CGT are on their brakes entering the turn.

At 1:17 the CGT lifts off of the brakes (no more brake lights), and at 1:18 the CGT has spun out.

Tire temps had nothing to do with either vehicle making or missing that turn.

Being on the brakes made no difference.

What was the difference??

 

One difference I see is you're are being unnecessarily rude in your comments. Why is that?

 

Old tires = Bad. That's why the have sell by dates.

 

Sorry about that, but help me out...where was the rude part?

 

Missed the apex on the turn. Turned in too early, tried to correct, the rest is history?

D

 

In this particular video the difference is the driver .

He turns in at the wrong time and at the wrong angle , then brakes still turning and finally he lifts off the brake and with no gas applied ( combined with momentum and too tight a steering angle ) at that time and the rear will come round . Absolutely no effort was made to correct the slide , just sheer panic .
With respect that driver needs a lesser car or some tuition .

That is what was different , freaking or otherwise .

Going back to the old tyres , I certainly wouldnt drive my Carrera GT on expired rubber ( legal speeds or otherwise ) . It is absolutely a terrible idea .

 

Thank you for the clarification , knowing how litigious the USA is I thought perhaps that was not possible ( or at the very least unwise ) to release a car on expired tyres .

At least there must be a record of them warning the owners about the tyre condition/age right ?

 

He might need to have his tires rotated....If you know what I mean................

Most likely he knows I have thick skin and it doesnt bother me much... It may be a sign we are all getting older as we like to argue a point even if it is pointless....




Bottom line. Old Tires, Lots of Power, A few minutes short drive, Equals running out of Talent fast.... Keep it on the track... Merry Christmas gang Im off line for a few days...

 

Classic case of driver "lift" on throttle, rear end loses weight bias and spins around.

Gotta hand it to the 911 for keeping it cool and driving into the dirt to avoid the CGT.

 

See police thread.

 

Watch the brake lights. The spin was after the CGT lifted the brakes.

Brakes != throttle

 

I'm not convinced he was on the throttle , he panicked and lifted .
The angle was too wrong and he was carrying too much speed anyway .

Driver error all day long , the damage was already done .

 

I thought the Rodas / Walker Carrera GT was owned by them and had been recently sold? The stalling trying to move it by the other employee may have prompted them to take it for a drive to let it warm up the car, charge the battery / clean the plugs. It was said earlier in the thread the car had many owners over a short time, had low miles, and the original tires from when it was sold new.

 

The stalling in reverse sounds to me like not knowing how to use the clutch .