Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

Is the system that accomplishes the P1 ride height change capable of continuous adjustment? I appreciate from previous posts it changes between discreet settings but is that just software controlled? If so if follows that it could be optimized for different sections of a track. (or THE track ;-)

 

No. but it would be awesome. akin to the old Williams F1 system - kept the ride height 'optimal' regardless of where you are on the track. didn't use springs and a 'regular' damper set up, but instead hydraulic actuators. Genius and they got it to work. Result? banned of course

 

The adjustable suspension technology in the P1 is not active to the point where it scans the road ahead and automatically adjusts vehicle ride height. That sort of thing is going to be on the drawing board for the future with cars like these.

>8^)
ER

 

Rather than a real time system you describe I was thinking it could be preset for different segments of a track. Alternatively a learning mode where it could optimize based on suspension travel over a series of completed laps. In either case though it would require a continuously variable ride height system.

 

Great illustration of how KERS works beginning at 6:04.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vIjJg0lXgc]Inside the 2014 Renault F1 engine with Scarbs - YouTube[/ame]

Now how can that be bad for brake feel Mclaren? Energy recovery from the turbo as illustrated above would've been another way to recover free energy for the P1 but they missed that too.

 

Well after seeing sutcliffes video he clearly prefers the p1 . Especially for driver involvement etc " from another solar system " he says !
This doesn't surprise me driving the cars in isolation and in the eyes of a reviewer not necessarily an owner , it makes it's power etc very dramatically . It's wilder where the 918 is more like a slightly unhinged veyron .

 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SGlN8xYZiw]McLaren P1 - exclusive on-track review of the world's ultimate hypercar - YouTube[/ame]

 

Considering the number of performance car insiders and the amount of knowledge involved in this thread, one thing baffles me so much that I had to register and lay it out - the overwhelming emphasis on the power to weight to downforce ratio.

To use that ratio to almost exclusively determine how a car should perform on a track such as NS is, well, not very insightful to say the least.

I figure that two F1 machines with two different pilots behind the wheel, on two different days, having basically the same power /weight/downforce numbers could span in up to 15,.maybe 20 seconds of time difference on a track with such basic layout and length !

This is the best starting point to get the idea of how much other things are in play regarding the track performance - the chassis control, usability of the power, driver skill being the most notable categories.

You all act as if it is an empirical certainty that a car a should outperform the car b just because it has more power and downforce and less weight.

While the truth is so much more complex.
Are you all forgetting the Nissan GTR?
Its ability to handily beat cars with far better p-w-d ratio is the best testament to this.
So why would Porsche's better time come across as so hard to understand?
Its 4WD, four-wheel steering, power delivery, handling and traction could very well be more than enough to offset any dissadvantages it has on paper.

 

So ready for an EVO comparo.

Assuming, of course, they keep McLaren's benevolence to them out of the assessment.

I think any of these cars are going to feel like "the fastest thing you've ever driven" in isolation.

 

That's exactly why I drove one side by side with a veyron ss

 

Definitely faster in a straight line with a claimed 0-300kph of 14.6s for the SS vs 16.5s for the P1. Though it's a totally different story when a bend comes into play.

 

No doubt on a track , no doubt at all . I've always said this .
On the road though the ss was faster , straights and corners . Ss Put power down much better , was a lot more stable .at speed and under braking .
To be completely fair ( which I always try to be mark ) the owner has had more time in the ss so was more comfortable and confident driving it . I hadn't driven either before mind you and it was the same story when I drove it .

The p1 was a more exciting fast and felt faster too but the big bug was a much better built thing . Top drawer quality .


All things considered I'd say mission accomplished p1.
Owners and fans should be very happy indeed .

 

On the street the P1 will likely not be on wastegate/overboost enough to keep the batteries charged. Also look at the lag those turbo's must have; those headers are quite long. Not a problem for an F1 car that's running full throttle most of the time. P1 is still as street car. the turbo's are mounted directly to the head to keep lag to a minimum.

 

In case anyone is wondering why the 3rd brake light is blinking in the video; that's a prototype car and it blinks the lights when TC is working.

 

Not sure what you're saying here. Lag is minimized by keeping the header length to a minimum as you acknowledge. I doubt the battery is ever depleted substantially enough on the street where a driver would even notice turbo lag, its duty cycle will be extremely low.

Despite internet engineering and careful youtube analysis of the ring times, its faster than anyone expects. It'll be interested once initial track-lap times start being published how the incredulous will stick to their guns of "ride height blah blah I watched youtube once".

I have to wonder whether McLaren's P1 strategy is brilliant at this point. Its cast its own huge doubt over the performance potential of the car - will be interesting to see when the 'hero' returns to the story, but it has all the making of a good twist. If nothing else, its kept lots of people talking whereas a ring release might end the discussion prematurely. Of course, if the hero never appears, it would be terrible marketing at its finest, but I don't think thats the case .

 

MIT I agree; to clarify-

If the P1 was to regen from turbo power alone (as was suggested previously), the turbos wouldn't be used enough on the street to keep the batteries charged. Every time you pull away from a stop light you are on battery, and probably not on overboost before the next light. So the battery would deplete in city driving which is not good for the battery.

I think McLaren are brilliant to use the petrol engine for regen because its adds little additional weight, is less costly and less complex to maintain. I'll bet that F1 turbo is *really* expensive and gets replaced often.

Will be interesting F1 season this year, if a turbo blows during the race your car would be done.

 

SS is an amazing car. but totally different from p1. IMO, the perfect garage is those two.
did the bug easily walk away from the p1 on the road?

 

first post? you must have just skimmed a few pages because several of us have already put forth the points you made. ie, the P1 is not set-in-stone faster simply based on its Hp, its higher vmax down the long straight, and its 1300lbs of downforce (achieved in lowest ride height...where on the NS it is waaaay too low). the 918 has superior balance over the bumpy corners...which is where it gains ground on competitors. Porsche is going back again, along with the 900+ hp customer cars being delivered. they say they've got a good 10 seconds worth over the already ridiculous 6:57.

 

what's 'faster than anyone expects'? P1? errr, everyone expected the P1 to blow EVERYTHING into the weeds. to be waaaaay faster than the competition! and by 'faster' it was meant as FASTER full stop...anytime, anywhere, anyone driving, not 'faster on a super smooth track without curbs or rumble strips' despite Mac's claims/boasts back in da day that it would destroy everything on the track, they've yet to prove a darn thing other than the ability to put together silly overproduced videos...and they have thus far proven to be the king of kings in the realm of PR disaster. don't kid yourself, there is no clever strategy going on here...it has been a disaster, period. why? they bit off more than they could chchch chew! they put forth a huge amount of effort, time, money at the NB NS, and they failed to annihilate the world. they were foolish to massively underestimate the 'underpowered, out of its league, heavy porker' and their bland and boring engineers.

 

if he's consistent in his mental unraveling, to him the LaFerrari should be 'from another GALAXY' however, it wouldn't surprise me if he finds it slightly less 'exciting' compared to P1, simply because in his mind the Mac NEEDED to be sensational, involvement wise. I misread all the time, but to me I've read it like this: he expected the car to be an awesome experience, so much so, that even if the car actually came up a bit short, it wouldn't matter. He needed it to be, in his mind it was already mind numbing prior to driving it, and it was merely confirmed after he drove it. this kind of psychology is rather common.

there's nothing wrong with him preferring P1 over 918. but when things like 'corners near 5g', 'not far off of F1 speed' and other things of similar outrageousness take such deep roots instantly in the mind, it reveals some very fundamental issues. that these believed-to-be true things easily trump common sense, well, that gives us a framework of where he's really at mentally (hello, dude, you are a long time journo with a lot of experience and knowledge so that such ridiculous claims as 5g cornering and near F1 pace should've instantly triggered a common-sense filter in your mind. I don't care what you were 'told' and, after getting called out for your silliness, you then became aware that you 'misheard' the Mac folks. Sir, just a TINY amount of common sense would've but the kibosh on your unhinged rambling.

 

Well said. Everyone expected the P1 to be ridiculously fast (which it is) but it's failed to live up to the hype. Ron Dennis really should have kept his big mouth shut.

 

the perfect garage for this latest era of hypercars:

LaFerrari (grigio titanio, gloss carbon roof, gunmetal wheels, lime green calipers, black interior),

P1 (brilliant silver and glossy carbon, gunmetal wheels, lime green calipers, black interior),

918 (Weissach Silver grey and glossy carbon, brilliant silver wheels, lime green calipers, black interior).

And I'm sure someone out there will have that garage in due time.

Yes, I have my gripes for each car, each brand, but ultimately they are still my top 3 as far as dreams go. they are all wicked in their own ways.

 

Hello, I read your message and I am a little surprised that the ss is faster in a straight line. Yes probably after 300 km / h but before I doubt. The timer 400 m shows, it is even better for P1. So your test, when the veyron passes, I'm sure up to 250 or even more, the P1 is before (especially as the clock of 300km / h seems optimistic as can be perhaps for 200km / h). And as you say, if you don't have the knowledge of P1 as the SS, it is certain that your test is false because certainly you do not accelerate as frankly (which is normal because it is really bestial , intimidating.) the fact that you said that ss is more stable and fast in corners also proves (because in the corners ss will not even close). Having tested the P1 I can tell you that nothing comes close the feeling of acceleration of P1 and I'm not talking about braking and corners.

 

Don't be so sure of you, do not be too impatient. We shall see at the appropriate moment. I know me as others here its time on the nurburgring. Have you had a chance to drive P1, I don't think so.

 

No it wasnt "easily pulling away " but it was faster . What surprised me was the long sweeping corners where one would expect the aero of the p1 to crush the bug the bug was still faster and noticeably more planted . However the P1 was not in the low mode ( thats illegal on the road and it doesnt work , too low apparently ).