David Piper restores the Talacrest P4 | Page 112 | FerrariChat

David Piper restores the Talacrest P4

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Streetrod, Sep 6, 2012.

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  1. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    Compare the period pictures to the current finished car. Look at the rear wheel arch, and how it is filled in the period pics. Back bodywork definitely looks too long on the present day replica bodywork...
     
    merstheman, Feb 6, 2014
    #2776
  2. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    See post 2749. And let's remember someone has the incorrerct tail on one of his cars. So there is room for some imperfections. Let's try to keep an open mind. There is no such thing as a perfect restoration of the original. tongascrew
     
    tongascrew, Feb 6, 2014
    #2777
  3. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    I wonder if they realize what the WB of a P4 is VS a P3/412P WB. The P 3/4 and P4's have the same WB and that's why 0858's P4 spyder tail fits P 3/4 0846 properly. There is also the issue of the proper tire size for a P4. You can't buy the exact right P4 sized tire today. You have to hand cut them.
     
    Napolis, Feb 6, 2014
    #2778
  4. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    Early discussions on this body believe that the rear arch is too high, but re looking at the pictures the rear tyre profile looks too low. How the rear arch was made wrong (if it is) when they supposedly used #0900 as the template I don't understand?, even producing a body buck from it.

    #0900 is a P4 as is now #0858 so should match chassis wise, etc.
    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 6, 2014
    #2779
  5. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Did you weld pieces of aluminium to the bottom of the front sides of the 0858 tail so that it followed the bottom door line as it did (and still does) on 0846, the P3s and 412Ps?
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    miurasv, Feb 6, 2014
    #2780
  6. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    If you go through the 0846 and 0854 threads you'll see. The WB difference is the tricky part and how you get the tail to center properly and to be able to hinge up without hitting the proper size tire. It's all in the thread. Remember the WB of 0846 and 0854 are different but on both the bottom of the side lines up with rather than steps up from the door shut line.

    If you read the threads very carefully you'll understand the very cleaver thing Ferrari did to enable a P4 tail to fit our P 3/4, our 412P and The P4's specifically P4 0858.
     
    Napolis, Feb 6, 2014
    #2781
  7. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Thanks for your reply. Yes, I know about the 12cm difference in WB. I was wondering how you got the 0858 P4 rear clam to line up with the bottom of the door line as it did (and still does) on P3, P3/4 and 412Ps as it steps up on the P4s? I'll read the 0846 thread.
     
    miurasv, Feb 6, 2014
    #2782
  8. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    I have to assume the P4 has a lower door sill line than a 412P or P3/4 but Ferrari chose to step up the sill at the rear and not change the rear bodywork. Surely the rear bodywork does not sit higher on a P4?
    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 6, 2014
    #2783
  9. velocetwo

    velocetwo F1 World Champ

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    velocetwo, Feb 6, 2014
    #2784
  10. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    I wonder if Ferrari ever swapped the chassis plates back? Therefore it was actually #0856, or the chassis that was once tagged #0856, that became the CanAm car and the car we are now talking about :)
    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 6, 2014
    #2785
  11. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    They did but claim after Le Mans they swapped back.
     
    Napolis, Feb 7, 2014
    #2786
  12. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    miurasv, Feb 7, 2014
    #2787
  13. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    miurasv, Feb 7, 2014
    #2788
  14. tongascrew

    tongascrew F1 Rookie

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    Looking at the pictures of the new body on 0858 replicating Ferrari #21 there are two small rear facing vents on the roof at the joint of cockpit roof and the engine cover. As best as I can tell from the pictures I have of the two cars at Le Mans in 1967 only car #24 has these vents. I will let you experts comment what the s/ns of the two LeMans cars at both the trials and the actual race but it would appear that this 0858 restoration could actually be 0856.What we do know is that both the engines and the chassis plates of these two were exchanged several times by S.F. for which there are no recorded records. This may also complicate the numbering of the S.F CanAm rebuild and, as David Mackay in his book makes no mention of engine or s/n of the car he imported into New Zealand, this offers no help.Finally we also don't know[?] the s/n for the Ecurie Francorchamp P4 which ran at LeMans Was 0850 scheduled but not prepared and so what s/n did E.F. run? Help! tongascrew
     
    tongascrew, Feb 7, 2014
    #2789
  15. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    I think the "Ferrari" history would be in the classiche 350 Can Am 0858 book?

    Strange that he'd go with #21. I have the original Le Mans scrutinizing documents from 67 and if Ferrari swapped chassis plates for that race they also restamped engine number which is possible.
     
    Napolis, Feb 7, 2014
    #2790
  16. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    The pic is from the 0858 350 Can Am Classiche Red Book.

    Yes, it is very strange he went with 21.
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    miurasv, Feb 7, 2014
    #2791
  17. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Car number 21 at Le Mans 1967 did have the roof vents.
     
    miurasv, Feb 7, 2014
    #2792
  18. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    Pete
     
    PSk, Feb 7, 2014
    #2793
  19. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Has anyone here yet found out who carried out the work for the Berlinetta configuration?
     
    miurasv, Feb 7, 2014
    #2794
  20. velocetwo

    velocetwo F1 World Champ

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    Hmm do they have Mike Hailwood's name spelled incorrectly?
     
    velocetwo, Feb 7, 2014
    #2795
  21. 180 Out

    180 Out Formula 3

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    I hope they used a skim coat of Bondo so it will match the rest of the car.
     
    180 Out, Feb 7, 2014
    #2796
  22. Sire Bruno de Losckley

    Sire Bruno de Losckley Formula 3

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    Sire Bruno de Losckley, Feb 8, 2014
    #2797
  23. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    miurasv, Feb 8, 2014
    #2798
  24. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ Honorary Owner

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    Nose inlet remains really poorly done.
     
    Napolis, Feb 8, 2014
    #2799
  25. GIOTTO

    GIOTTO F1 Rookie Consultant

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    Yes, and difficult to understand why they did it this way.
     
    GIOTTO, Feb 8, 2014
    #2800
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