David Piper restores the Talacrest P4

The headlights also seem to be wrong, in the "real" car they are lower, aligned with the inlets but on the frankenstein version the bottom is clearly above the inlets....

 

It's original to 0858 from what I understand, in the sense that it is a 350 Can Am engine that was first fitted to 0858 when it was converted to a Can Am car by the Factory, in period.

 

Your post could explain all the errors right here. To build a car from blueprints is the FIRST mistake. Blue prints are NOT accurate as each car has its own uniqueness, even the same car from race to race changed. Blueprints are protoypical unless made from a specific chassis. Using a REPLICA P4 (900) as a basis to build another P4 is mistake number 2. Who knows what Piper changed/created on 900. Even if original P4 body panels might have been used they could have been modified slightly to accomodate fit issues, solve driving issues (as he vintage races the car or did) who knows for sure. It happens on the real cars. To use that car as a basis could really make things inaccurate.

The only way they should have ever considered getting the body correct is to use period pictures. If they want inexpensive, correct information all they need to do is ask US!! The best consulting they could get is right here and its free. Now its all after the fact. Hopefully a new owner will have the insight to seek counsel from these threads and correct the mistakes.

 

Have a look at #0900, looks pretty good to me ... Unlike #0858. I personally think we can discount this being the failure point. If they had in fact copied #0900 properly, even the fiberglass version, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I think they copied a Mazda mx5 by mistake
Pete

 

Looking at the front of 0900 it has a vertical post in the center of the radiator opening. Also the lower lip is slightly curved down and the cooling ducts appear to be parallel to the road surface.This is quite different from 0860 at LeMans where the lower lip is quite straight across and the cooling ducts are parallel to. it.Of course that front end had some "changes" inflicted on it.How it looked by the time DP got it is another thing. tongascrew

 

The nose of 0860 was hastily rebuilt after a crash in practice at Le Mans, it is not a reference, it is a source of mistakes.

 

That is hilarious!

 

Bottom line is they stated in the Talacrest video that 0858 is a copy of 0900, that they had 0900 close by and use it for measurements etc.

We can all see that the execution was poor due to the obvious differences between the two.

Another thing to keep in mind is what in period photos are correct representations of correct P4 shapes, versus those that are temporary hastily done repairs to get the car to the race the next day.

Either way, if they were going for a certain look of a certain race this nose may make sense, but they clearly stated they were modeling this car from the 0900 measurements and it is clear that their vision did not translate.

 

Don't forget that they also had the P4 expert readily at hand in Piper to oversee the work. The same expert that didn't know exactly what he was selling to J.G and the same expert that didn't think to correct this nose.

Shame.

 

Things that make you go "WTF".

 

And as many of us have said earlier in this thread not the right person for a restoration, for example:
If I owned a 250LM and wanted to know how to get the best out of one for use/racing/track days I would talk to Piper. If I wanted to ask an originality question I would not talk to Piper. Look at his 250LM, originality is not a concern at all for him and good on him, he is having a blast in surely the fastest LM in the world.
So Piper is an expert on keeping a P4 running and has probably kept one running and on tracks for longer than anybody ... but I doubt #0900 would do well in a concours competition.
Pete

 

"When you're in Hollywood and you're a comedian, everybody wants you to do other things. All right, you're a stand-up comedian, can you write us a script? That's not fair. That's like if I worked hard to become a cook, and I'm a really good cook, they'd say, "OK, you're a cook. Can you farm?" Mitch Hedburg.

 

At Retromobile: Just a WONDERFUL Display !

Do we know who the new owner is,
and his relationship to the FERRARI world ?

 

An ambiguous answer has been given in this post to a thread on Retromobile '14: https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/vintage-thru-365-gtc4-sponsored-vintage-driving-machines/436815-retromobile-2014-a-2.html#post142925733: "Dealer/restorer Mario Linke from Germany in collaboration with Franco Meiners from Italy. They had the cars on display only. "

 

There's a good body shop in LA, maybe we could all chip in 5 bucks and have the nose fixed. With cash you get a discount, they can match the paint too, maybe put some better rims on it!

 

HMmmm......One footprint on a long road........

 

......a nose job in L.A.? oh-oh

 

2 drawings of the P3 (top) and P4 berlinettas where you can see the differences between the bodies.
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Those drawing are completely innaccurate

 

Please could you post some better ones.

 

Thanks for trying.

 

Here is a superb AutoCad drawing of 412 P #0848 by Staffan Berggren who very kindly sent it to me today.
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You're sniffing glue. Staffan is a very good draftsman but these drawings have nothing to do with CAD and stating that they are based on CAD or proper CAD scans is ludicrous. The only original P car that has proper CAD scans is Dino Competizione.

 

What about AutoCad? I edited my post before you replied.

 

What about it? An object scanned into CAD and that math used to replicate a form by a 3D printer or C&C 5 axis miller is a LOT different than using a computer drawing program to make a drawing based on what?