starting and warming up

Definitely not good for the engine; by letting it run for a couple of minutes all you're doing is allowing condensation to form within the engine. It's also unlikely that you're generating enough of a charge to compensate for the juice that was required to start it in the first place.

IMHO, the best way to warm-up an engine is by driving her gently until everything gets up to temp.

Do get yourself a battery tender.

 

Joe- As long as you let the temperatures come up, it will not hurt her at all. Let the oil temperature get up to about 160 F or a little below and she will be fine. But picking up a battery maintainer is a good idea, something like the CTEK that came standard with later Ferraris, but with alligator clips. The non-Ferrari branded ones are inexpensive.
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I'd be inclined to agree. It takes a good length of driving time to get everything up to full operating. I feel it's better not to start and idle like that.

 

I have the CTEK MUS 4.3 and their Comfort Indicator. This is a great product as the Comfort Indicator stays in the car (mine is behind the drivers seat) and will give you an instant battery charge condition.
Alan
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I have the greatest of respect for you Terry, but cannot agree with this. The OP says he likes to let it run for a few minutes a few times a week. Getting the oil temp up to 160 degrees a few times a week on idle isn't, IMHO, the best way of treating any engine.

 

I agree, I firmly believe (but my wife says I am often wrong) that you should never just start a car. Let it sit, or take it for a drive and get it properly hot.

 

But will it HURT the engine? I don't think so. It might not be ideal.. but I don't htink you're going to actually hurt the engine if it idles until its warm.

Think about it. The oil is going to recirculate around the engine in either case. Provided the oil pressure isn't bottoming out, running at 1200RPM versus 3000RPM is immaterial. If you drive it and lug the engine.. THAT would hurt it.

 

When the engine just idles, the gas in the engine doesn't burn completely. The unburned fuel mixed with the oil inside the engine will cause the oil to lose its functions. Besides the motor, just idling can hurt your catalyst converters as well. These cars create a lot of water vapor in the exhaust system. The water usually just sits in the catalysts and can cause corrosion. If you're spending the time to idle, you might as well take it for a 15-20 mins spin to bring the motor, transmission and exhaust system up to full operating temp to burn off the moistures.

 

Yeah, okay, if we're having academic arguments, but what's the point? You'd let a >$100K car idle just to charge the battery, and you'd do it several times a week? It doesn't make any sense at all. If you let everything come up to temp I guess there might not be any damage to the engine, but I maintain that it's a nonsensical approach just to charge a battery.

BTW, does anybody have a handle on how long the car needs to idle for in order for the oil to come up to normal operating temps? I bet it's quite a long time.

 

Yes, it can hurt it, especially an aluminum engine with Ti rods. The combustion byproducts when cold have a lot of acid in them. This contaminates the oil and unless you get the oil hot enough to burn it off, it can pit the aluminum and Ti. You have to make sure the oil temp gets hot enough.

You can also cause a lot of carbon buildup just letting the engine sit and idle which can damage the engine if the buildup gets to be enough. Not as big an issue on a non DI engine as it would be on a DI engine (like the cali, FF, F12, 458).

 

And heating from an idle versus the slow rise from a careful drive? I doubt it. Oil temp on a 360 comes about slow enough as it is and is recirculating throughtout the engine via a pump either way. You're not going to rev the engine above 4k anyway until the engine is warm anyway. Carbon buildup... also like to see how it differs under 3k RPM warmup versus idle at 1800. I'll wager less than 10-15% variance unless someone provides numbers.

Don't get me wrong.. none of us do it.. I just don't see how its bad logically. I'm not saying its right. I just don't understand how its any worse than a slow drive. Agreed on DFI vs. Non-DFI.

 

That's the thing, just letting it sit and idle you never rev it up and get it hot. The op sounds like he's just letting it sit and idle once a week then shutting it off once hot to maintain the battery. That's not good for the engine imo for the above reasons. Letting it sit and idle to warm up and then taking it for a drive, probably not a big deal as long as you do drive it a decent distance (ie more than just a 5 minute jaunt around the block), but driving gently definitely warms it up faster and warms up the rest of the drivetrain along with the engine.

 

For the guys with the CTEKs or other types of batt. tenders, what function do you normally leave it in?

I know there are "normal", "quick charge", "trickle", and so on...

 

Warming up a car does not mean you have to just let it idle. Running her up to 3000 rpm occasionally while she is warming is not an issue. The real trick to doing a static warm-up is getting the oil temperature up high enough to burn off anything generated in the oil through the combustion process.

He asked if it hurt anything, and the answer is no if she is warmed thoroughly. It still makes much more sense to use a battery maintainer, of course. Mine gets driven enough that she has not been on the CTEK in over 4 years, but she has very little drain when sitting.

 

Yes I wired in the same thing to my 360. You just need the matching plug to suit attached to a charger/tender and you should be good to go.
It should be wired to the main positive terminal and to the main earth on the chassis. Easy to see with the floor panel behind the seat removed.
I trickle mine overnight with a cheap 2 amp charger if it sits for more than a week.

 

I say start the car and drive it. Don't let it idle. I have always believed extended idling is bad for a petrol engine. Oil temp comes up slowly even when driving. I imagine it would take forever just idling.

 

I would add that in addition to the engine, its important to actually move the car every now and then, other wise things like the differential gears just stay ½ bathed in oil.

My opinion is if you cant move the car due to weather or some other reason, you are better off not running it and keeping it on the tender.

 

Agree. Put a tender on the car and don't start it unless your gonna use it. If you want to avoid flat spots on the tires just roll her back by releasing the e brake and place in neutral


R

 

Just buy a charger that comes with a pig-lead (many do or offer as an accessory) and replace the existing one with the new. More simple than trying to reverse-purchase what might not even be a good charger.