The Massa Sucks Thread *OF COURSE THERE ARE SPOILERS*

Massa scored points for the team today. That's good.

He didn't score any points WITH the team today. That's bad.

Massa basically said he knows better than the team -- or what's better for him vs the team.



If I were the team manager, I would really question Massa's loyalty to the team. You can argue that the team should not have given the order. But, once the order is given, it should have been followed.

If not you have anarchy.

 

A great driver can get away with disobeying team orders.
Phil is not in that league.

He has all of my sympathy but his grudge is with how he was treated by Ferrari, not how he's being treated by Williams.

 

Why on earth would he hold a grudge against Ferrari?

Seriously. They pampered him for years. They should have sacked him after his accident yet they kept him on year after year out of pure charity. What could he possibly hold against them other than eternal gratitude?

 

Grudges are not always rational.

 

Williams' mess entirely of their own making -http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/22058/9241953/conclusions-from-the-2014-malaysia-gp

--The peculiarity of Williams' justifiably-ignored request to Felipe Massa to let Valtteri Bottas through is that it was so unnecessary. No, make that completely and utterly unnecessary.

In the second race of the season, with two cars in the points, with their drivers racing hard but fair, and safely, and with Bottas still highly unlikely to pass Button given that his tyres were only fractionally fresher than his team-mate's and so few laps still left on the board, it was meddling for meddling's sake, bereft of good cause or reason. It has subsequently been claimed that Williams would have ordered Bottas to give Massa the place back if he couldn't pass Button - a botched job to follow a botched strategy - with the prevailing irony throughout that the only risk to Williams' first double points-scoring result in two years was the potentially-ruinous distraction of ill-considered meddling from radio gaga--

 

Well said Sky! Agree with everything there. A ridiculous, and potentially risky idea at best. IF it had been early in the race, or they were on vastly different tire strategies, *maybe*. But it wasn't and they weren't.

And then to claim he'd have been ordered to give it back is laughable. There weren't enough laps left!

Probably some engineer in a darkened room in Grove who's never been to a race 'ran some numbers' and managed to convince someone it was 'possible'. How the higher ups didn't ****can the whole idea from the get go is more worrying IMO. The *team* was on for its first double points finish in forever. Claire (or whoever) should have shut that idea down immediately given where they were.

They screwed up royally on this one.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Massa did the right thing, williams ****ed up badly, it´s as simple as that..of course williams where never known for knowing how to deal wit theyr drivers..in that department things haven´t changed.

 

A bad move by Williams, IMO, this order was not necessary and wouldn´t bring any benefit, as Bottas most probably wouldn´t be able to overtake Button anyway. But team orders where not so bad for Massa himself at the beginning of the race when he asked his engineer on the radio to make Bottas stay behind.

Orders are orders and are the same for everybody.

 

Wrong!! Drivers are paid not to race but to drive a car. The car is owned by the team, and the team is paying the driver´s mansion and boat. So they should STFU more often, not criticize the team on TV and make way when they´re asked for.

They don´t like it? No problem, they can create their own team.

 

Such quaint sensibilities.


Drivers are first and foremost out to advance their own careers. When that coincides with team interests great. But when it doesn't eff team orders.

This is a multimillion dollar business and everyone involved is out for themselves. Don't kid yourselves otherwise.

 

I completely agree with you. But if someone wants to play that game, then he also has to know its more essential rule: big fish eats small fish.

And who do you think that is the big fish here: a multimillion operation with hundreds of workers involved or certain "has been" at the end of his career? There are not many seats in F1, but there are lots of drivers.

 

Massa actually said something pretty bad in his interview with Buxton after the race.

He said his was looking to get points for the team AND his career.

His career?

 

The articles I read didn't mention him saying, "...and his career".

 

I remember him using the words me or my repeatedly.
Not the most politic thing to say but refreshingly candid.

Not a comfortable interview to watch.

 

"It was not so clear," he said. "I hear everything, but it was not clear. What I did was correct. I'm trying to do the best for the team, that's the most important thing. I'm sure the result will not change if I let him by, so it's the same. What I did, in my opinion was correct.

"I'm doing everything I can to help the team to do the best to improve the car and give as much experience as I can to the team. The team respect me 100% and they showed they respect me after the race as well. I have no problem at all, and what happened today was for sure not what I expect, but in the end it was correct."

Read more at Felipe Massa insists he was correct to disobey team orders | Williams | Formula 1 news, live F1 | ESPN F1

 

The interview I'm referring to was the one on NBCSC.

 

I know there are team orders but I say let them race, this isn't like its the last race and one driver needs 1 extra point to win the WDC…………..Unless they crash into each other, and since there is a rule against blocking now if you cannot pass your team mate then maybe you are not that much faster…….I side with massa on this how many time do you have to be told to move over, and again if he was that much slower pass him…..

 

I'm betting that the opinions on my comments are split between those that own and run a billion dollar company and those that work for them. 8>)

 

So he is being asked to pull over and let his team mate passed again. Really is time to hang up the helmet Massa.

Poor guy
Pete

 

This

 

Phil is diverting attention from Kimi's problems.

 

Yes maybe we should leave poor Massa alone especially after he pretty much had a WDC stolen from him and he took one in the head for the team. I am disappointed in Ferrari for not going the drivers a more competitive car…..

 

It's amazing that people will still excuse anything from Massa and never question it, even breaking team orders.

You can argue that the team should not have given the orders but that's irrelevant to what the issue is. What's relevant is that the team manager knew what was going on with both cars and could make strategic decisions on how better to bring the team points to the team. What Williams wants is the most team points possible so they can get more funding, particularly early in the year before the bigger teams start to make more progress in improvements from their mega budgets.

Massa saying he knows best is just slapping the team managers in the face. You do that in private after the race, not during the race.

It doesn't matter if he thought he was right. Ignoring the team cost them the chance for an additional point.

 

As a former owner of a business I couldn't agree with you more. When the inmates start running the asylum things get out of hand in short order.

Well managed disciplined teams will do better with their resources than unmanaged ones. Prima Donnas need to be controlled...and they will fight to the death (almost) to get their own way. If a person is not really a team player the best solution for the team is to say adios. I wonder what Phil's contract says. We had a personnel policy which spelled out the employee's job description...the responsiblities of the employee and the responsiblities of the employer. Employers who do not hold employees accountable do so at their own peril. the monkeys will be running the zoo. Enzo knew that.

Best

 

Well, he's just announced his retirement so I hope all you haters are happy now!!!