McLaren discontinues 12C, offers owners free upgrade

Ferrari owners weren't promised when they bought the 458 that a replacement car wouldn't show up for 5 years --and then in 3 it magically does.

Ferrari owners weren't told last week to buy a car and then the next week told their car is obsolete and discontinued immediately.

Ferrari owners weren't told that the Speciale was a upgrade car to the 458 and then the next day told the 458 is no longer being made.

FNA didn't make a conscious decision to not tell Ferrari dealers about a complete model change so they would keep selling existing stock under a false premise that the cars were continuing to be made and sold for the next 2 years.



The issue is the continuing way that McLaren screws over it's loyal buyers.

As to these upgrades, I don't see making windows work better and upgrading the already weak Iris system as much to shout about -- along with a "special price" (whatever that is but it ain't FREE) for a back up camera.

But fan bois will be fan bois even if they are getting screwed over.

"Thank you McLaren! May I have another?"

 

Seriously, I own a 458 Spyder and was considering a Mclaren MP12C spider but now I am considering the Huracan Spyder...

 

Seriously, Mayor? You're smarter than that.

Do you really see the 650S as anything other than a facelift? Will you go on record as proclaiming the 650S is a new car? That entire idea of it is hilarious. It's no different than any mid-life facelift -- new feature, new front end, slight bump in performance.

Are you honestly going to tell me the 12C -> 650S is the same as 430 -> 458?

Also, who didn't know there was a new car coming? They said every year there would be a new model and the mules were testing for a while. Everyone on the internet knew that. So they released a new look and it didn't turn out to be the 12C GT3. Oh well. Why does that make a difference? Would it matter if the 458 was discontinued and the Speciale was the only car in production? How does it compare to a 997 PDK, or a 2012 California?

Why do you have to look at the 650S different than you look at the Speciale? They put out a new version that's the same price and better. Since when is that a bad thing.

Ferrari will sell you a 458 right up until the last day. Does that make them look bad? Everyone knows new models are coming. Aventador coupe buyers knew the roadster was coming. Roadster buyers know the SV is coming. Huracan, SL. 458, Speciale.

Your point about updates is dumb. The new active aero is a new development. It's not fixing something that was broke. The new Iris is a new system, take it for what it is, but know that a ton of people didn't even pay for it. It was a free gesture due to some earlier teething problems.

The camera isn't free and shouldn't be. You didn't spec it before, hence you didn't pay for it. Why would you get it for free? I admit it should have been available back then, but oh well, it wasn't. It is now, and you can buy it if you want it.

You're make bad arguments.

 

I also fail to see how replacing a poor selling car, which most here seem to believe it was, is a bad thing.

What's better:

1. Keep selling 12Cs even though the market has too much supply and no one is buying them anymore.

2. Discontinue it and launch something new to help improve sales.

Early adopters are not getting screwed over. They bought their cars long ago and have had time to enjoy them. If they sold for a huge loss and bought a spider, only to lose again, whose fault is that?

I'd also like to point out that 2012 Aventadors can be had for $350K. With most having prices of like $425K + tax, they also lost about $100K in value. No one is complaining about them even though the 2014 is a much better car than the 2012s. They just didn't change the name or look. Whoopdydo.

 

you on the other hand have made some good arguments. enjoy your fantastic machine!

 

No wonder the city of LA and the State of California are bankrupt.

 

I don't get it.

 

It's not. Its a good thing

Lying to your customers though is a bad thing.

McLaren has done everything possible to disappoint early adopters

Iris not working for years after the cars went on sale with excuse after excuse that the problems would be solved.

Poor marketing in the beginning with reviews that were less than stellar after promising this car would be better than anything else on the market.

Promising to early adopters that their cars would not be replaced and made obsoleted the way Ferrari does in this mythical idea called "McLaren ethos".

Doggedly not looking at real sales and continuing to believe their own illusion that if they kept making cars that somehow the sales would pick up after people realized how good they were.

McLaren over producing cars and pushing them into dealers screwing resale values.

Doing a massive MSRP reduction in Australia -- but not the US or UK were sales were drying up like a raindrop in the Sahara.

Allowing the dealer in Philadelphia to go rouge and undercut every advertised price on the internet time after time.

Refusing to tell perspective buyers that they were shopping for and buying a car that was about to be discontinued.

And now the final insult --- announcing to owners that they are getting "upgrades" to their cars (yeah!) and then told the news (oh.. by the way) their car is now obsolete and being replaced with another better selling model -- pushing resale values lower and shocking owners who never guessed this would happen as late as yesterday.


The 650s is probably a good thing and the right thing for McLaren to do. The problem is in the WAY they went about getting to this message they sent today.

 

It is a forest for the trees kind of thing.

Best.

 

when they announce 650S i asked why they change the look why change the name and it's like a completely new car even though they say 650S will co-exist alongside 12C, doesn't make sense to me and now suddenly they say it's a replacement model

still anyone who bought a 12C not long ago would be pissed

 

To discontinue a car after just 3 years of life is not a nice gesture. To give some presents for free to loyal customers telling them at the same time that their car will not be anymore in production is not a nice gesture as many are thinking. Imagine for a second if they would have announced the same new without to offer these nice upgrades..Can you imagine the reactions?
so they are just trying to pay the silence of their customers. This is my opinion sorry.
When I will drive my Speciale for the first time at the end of this month, I will be conscious that the 458 will be discontinued in less than 2 years. But this is my choice and will not be due to an unexpected Ferrari's announcement of the last minute..It is a totally different prospective and I am even thinking what the potential new McLaren customer will feel now, already knowing that what they buy today could be discontinued tomorrow ..

 

Why does it matter if the car is discontinued or not? How does that change anything about your purchase?

When you buy a car, you know exactly what you're getting. They aren't taking your car away. Your car doesn't suddenly become obsolete and stop functioning. You aren't investing in some future product that's unconfirmed. The car you bought 2 years ago is the same car today.

Why does it matter what else is for sale? If you wanted a 12C last year, why would you suddenly not want it?

Unless of course you have self esteem problems and can't be seem with anything but the latest and greatest.

 

the need to make a statement about discontinuing the 12C is a stupid idea. Just discontinue it if that's what the demand dictates, why issue an statement like that and allow topics such as this one to pop up?

 

you know why? because people is not stupid and take care about their money and there are some nice competitors that work in different way .My 2 cents

 

Cuz Mac does not know what they are doing. Not equipped to play with the big boys...but they don't know it...yet.

Hubris has its price.

they may know how to build a car but the jury is out on business acumen. So far, not so good.

Best

 

Look, if you picked up your 12C with a huge smile on your face 2 years ago for $280-300K, you have no right to complain about anything unless it's broken. You got what you paid for. In fact, you got something better than what you paid for.

How is the owner of a 2012 12C coupe any worse off now than he was 2 years ago? He has the car he paid for and it's better than it was when he got it. It's still looks the same and it's still arguably one of the best cars in the world, objectively speaking.

Why so sad?

Keep your damn car for more than 2K miles and 8 months. Drive it for 20K miles over 5 years like a semi-normal person and you'll find your depreciation to be in line with just about every other car out there, including Ferrari.

Ferrari in the US lives in some magic bubble where they hold value. RR depreicate $100K in 2 years easily, Bentley at least $50-75K after two years. Aventador is probably down $75-100K and that's like the hottest exotic car on the planet.

So you couldn't drive you 12C for free for the first year. Cry me a river. The only people who got hurt on the purchases were the ones who felt the need to sell it less than a year later. News flash -- buying $300K cars and selling them 6 months later isn't a wise investment.

Is it fair to say Ferrari screwed its FF owners too? Those are even worse than 12Cs.

No brand tells customers about a new model. Ever. I have never seen any official info on a car until it debuts. If you're an enthusiast, you follow online and are well aware of it. Everyone knows about new cars and dates waaaay before they are for sale. Did Lamborghini screw its customers by selling Gallardos up until the Huracan was revealed? How about buying a 430 right before the 458 debut? They'll gladly sell you them.

The 12C is not obsolete. I don't know why you insist on calling it dead. The 650S is a 12C! It's a facelift. Just like the a 997.2 PDK, or a 2014 R8 V10.

You don't have to agree with me, but just answer me this:

Is the 650S a facelift or is it similar to 430 -> 458?

 

Being careful with money and buying an exotic car are mutually exclusive imo. Very few cars in history could ever have been called good investments. You'd be able to buy an LF if you would have bought IVV in 2009 instead of a 458.

 

Oh, I get it.

Yeah, I'm not from CA, nor is that my name. Just made up info.

 

This is clear and you are right. What I don't agree is the system that McLaren decided to use with their customers.
I prefer to burn my money "by myself" and I personally try to avoid manufacturers that "decide for me". But this is my attitude, and I understand that others can think very different.
You know there are already some rumors about a "race track focused 650S" that could arrive early next year. So what does this mean if true? to me this could simply show that they are really confused (I remember what they just wrote about the 650S few weeks ago) and perhaps who is ordering now a 650S will be again disappointed very soon. If true, is this acceptable in your opinion? it would be more honest that McLaren would ask to their loyal customers "to donate" directly their money instead to buy their cars, don't you think?

 

McLaren didn't decide, you did. Everyone who doesn't want a 12C did. The market decides the value. You can't put all the blame on McLaren for resale value. They aren't the ones selling used cars.

I'd also argue that there is no guarantee that depreciation is a death sentence for high-end cars. People lose insane amounts of money on lots of brands that survive just fine. People buy RR, Bentley, AM, AMG, and Porsches that have terrible depreciation, but there are enough that just don't care. Ferrari is one of the very, very few who have halfway decent depreciation in the US.

For example, by far the hottest car available right now is the Aventador. It had strong residuals for the first year or two. Now a 2012 car be had for $75K under MSRP. That's not exactly far off of a 12C.

12C depreciation sucks, but only if you sold. If you kept the car for 5 years and drove it 30k miles, I think you'd find depreciation to be not so bad. It's just not a car you could drive for free the first year. Oh well.

As for the 650S track focused car, how could you be disappointed by a track focused 650S and not a Speciale, LP570, SV, or GT3, or GT2, or anything? It's pretty much the gameplan for every exotic car manufacturer.

These days, depending on production life, it's one of the following:

Coupe -> Spider -> GT3
Coupe -> Spider -> GT3 -> GT3 Spyder
Coupe -> Spider -> GT3 -> GT3 Spyder -> Facelift -> repeat

If you are ever surprised when a new version comes out, you clearly aren't an enthusiast or you live under a rock. These variations are known well in advance, often 6 months to a year. There is no excuse for buying a car and being surprised by a new model.

I do agree it sucks for people who bought a 12C in the last few months, but pretty much everyone on the forums knew the smart thing to do was wait until Geneva. If you didn't, it's no one's fault but your own. It's like buying a 458 the day before the official Speciale reveal and being upset.

 

They just announced the 650s not even a month ago and unless you're like us keeping constant track of this I don't think anyone who had just bought a 12c in the last few months should be upset because they bought the car to enjoy it not over think all the politics, they couldnt get a 650s right now if they wanted to anyways something new is always coming, it's a toy just enjoy it in the moment, people get so upset about when owners of Halo cars like LaF resell for a quick buck at an unattainable price instead of enjoying it so why get upset when something you loved loses most of its money, no one should be buying to speculate, if you want a car that won't depreciate and is an instant classic order an Agera R.


Mclaren did screw up their image with the 12c with a backwards marketing formula...its like this isnt the company that made me lust for an F1, They should of released the P1 flagship first and then the 12c like most car companies do.

 

Bingo. Or p1 first, then 911 fighter than 12c/650s.

 

For me I am glad the 12C is not being produced anymore. Less of them around will make them more rare. Will it loose value and sink like rock? Remains to be seen. Only 3000 where made world wide. 1000 or so shipped to states. They made 4000 Ford GTs and we all know where prices are on them now. I am sure in short term 12c will sink. Maybe it will hold or not. The way I look at it they are cars. They all loose money except FGT.

 

Totally agree.

They should have done the p1, made a lower priced 911 fighter that I'm sure would have been a huge success and gotten them the volume to support a dealer network, and then mirrored some of that tech into the 12c.

Instead Ron just wanted to go toe to toe with Ferrari and create a 458 fighter. This with no dealer network, no marketing expertise, and very little brand exposure in the largest market, the United States.

 

Dream on....

Mac is almost pushing up daisies now.

They claim the P1 is sold out. I don't believe it (I think they have 375 "interested parties") but I'll give them that. Great. That's 375 cars they have on order.

The 12c is toast. They killed it yesterday. They made 3500 of them. Not what I would really call "rare" to be a collectible. True, the Ford GT made similar numbers and it's collectible. BUT, Ford literally stopped making it and anything to follow it. McLaren is just replacing it with another car. About the only thing you can say is collectible about it now is it's the first sports car they made after the F1.

The replacement 650s is the only car they have that can carry them and their dealers forward. It's better --- but also more expensive. Is it that much better than a low mileage 12c for $170K?

Who's fault is it that you can get one for this price? Owners or McLaren?

They claim to have 600 orders of the 650s. Really? Even one of your buddies on Mac life said he could order one today and get it in July. Where's the waiting list? More Mac spin. Sure, they all do it but this time it's serious. If 650s doesn't get orders, Mac has to survive only on the P1 because their 911 fighter is at least 2 years away, if they ever make it.

Do I want Mac to die? No. In fact, the opposite. But I see them dying by their own hands and I don't like it.

My issue has been with them their idiotic business practices that a trained monkey could do better. And, the Mac faithful and excusers are enabling them -- literally egging them on to failure and patting them on the back for upgrading their Iris that few like anyway ("Well, Ferrari would never do that!") Whoopie. Break out the champagne.

Until they replace the trained monkey with a trained cockatoo running their marketing programs, they are heading down a long death spiral.

And it didn't need to be this way.

Tell me, just what is McLaren's marketing plan for the 650s? Show it in Geneva, pass a car around the US to their 10 dealers, do the usual Youtube car tests that everyone else does, send out an email to current owners, and wait for those orders to flow in.

That's certainly going to turn things around when you start to shop on Cars.com and see this
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