360 new to me

First time F-owner, got a 360 spider F1, 2003 model with about 25K miles.

Two questions:

(1) what can be the cause of a slight whine behind my right shoulder around 2K - 4K RPM, I was thinking maybe one of the belt-driven accessories?

(2) my oil is full of foam, up to the point that it's all foam to the top of the cap; obviously this can't be very useful when trying to check the level with the engine running. Any suggestions? I read that Shell Helix may be the culprit?

 

I wouldn't drive the car until you figure out the foam thing...mine shows not a bubble ever...Not sure about the whine....can you hear it stationary...top down and up? There are some issues with the oil/coolant heat transfer unit that could be adding coolant to the oil...be sure to check it out or have it looked at. HTh

 

Did you have a good PPI done prior to purchase? It would have hopefully identified these things.

Also, with regard to the whine, does it change with ambient temperature or engine temperature? Or is it constant across all temperatures?

Oil foam? I have never seen this on my Ferrari or any of my other cars.

Congrats on your new Ferrari! Good luck!

 

I get a little foaming in mine but can still see the level. They call it a Diserator for good reason, to dis -- aerate the oil. Make sure that you check the coolant in the tank (when cool) to see if there is any trace of oily film which could indicate that your transmission oil cooler is leaking.
Alan

 

Also check the power steering fluid level. Is the forward cap in the engine bay. Low level might cause the power steering pump to whine.. Which is on front of engine.

 

Checked this and it's between the required marks on the cap. I had this issue on a daily driver a while back and was hoping it would be this easy of a fix on the 360 (top off the PS fluid).

 

Checked the coolant, it's not oily or discolored at all; looks green-ish and feels watery to the touch (rubbing between two fingers).

However - this is not a reliable method of checking trace oil in the coolant so would there be another recommended method? I would have assumed that oil would have sat at the top of the coolant overflow tank and I would have felt it but it wasn't the case.

 

Yes a PPI passed with flying colors at the F-dealer.

The whine is not at idle and possibly not when the car is cold; I think it is mostly when driving between 2K and 4K RPM and the engine is warm.

I was able to search and found that the foaming can be typical if using the original Shell oil. However the level that I'm seeing is quite a bit (not just some bubbles, but basically foam up the dipstick all the way up to the cap).

 

What you've done is reliable enough in my experience. If you have oil in the coolant it is immediately obvious on visual inspection and finger-rub test also.

I've had occasional foaming of the oil preventing accurate measurement but it's generally not an issue.

Might be worth getting the oil changed (or doing it yourself).

Can't help you with the whine. Could be nothing, could be something. Maybe go to a local cars and coffee meeting and see if there are other owners who can put your mind at ease or help you identify the cause, if there is one.

 

My indie uses AGIP so maybe some brands are more susceptible than others. Still curious as to why Ferrari needed a diserator -- something must be causing foaming and that cannot be good. I wonder if it's because it's a dry sump system.
Alan

 

Of course it is.

Think about it. A conventional wet sump engine has all the oil sitting in the oil pan and the pump intake is submerged near the bottom of this reservoir of oil. It should suck nothing but oil and never suck air. But wet sump engines under high lateral g loads (think racing) suffer when the oil is slung to one side or the other and the pump sucks in some air, starving the engine components of lubrication; not a good thing. Larger sumps, "windage trays", sump baffles, flapper valves, and other approaches work to some degree to cope with this problem, but are not always entirely successful.

That's why real race bred engines have a dry sump lubrication system. In general terms, they work like this: A large capacity scavenge pump removes as much oil as possible from the small sump and it does it as quickly as possible. The job of this pump is clearing the sump, NOT lubricating the engine. This nearly empty sump reduces oil-to-crankshaft drag but, as you might imagine, involves sucking in air as well as oil. This foamy oil is returned to an oil storage tank, often via some sort of collector where the air is separated from the oil, like on a typical Ferrari. Then, a second lubricating pump takes oil from the storage tank and delivers it to various parts of the engine. This wet sump system is not bothered by g forces and will, in theory at least, deliver non-foamy oil to the engine under all conditions. Plus the small sump allows the engine to be mounted lower and the size of the oil storage tank is not limited by factors effecting a wet sump design.

Apparently some oil brands are indeed more susceptible to foaming than others. If foam is interfering with getting a reliable check on the oil level in your Ferrari, try warming the oil and then turn off the engine for a few minutes while things calm down in the oil system. Restart the engine while the oil is still warm and check the level at idle. The foam should have subsided enough to get a good reading.

 

You may have too much oil. The oil needs to be over 170degrees, and the car idling to be accurate when checking. Try running the car up to operating temp, then shut it off. Start it up, and check it about 10 minutes later, and see if the foaming improves. If not, try siphoning some out, and then retest.

 

Some brands of oil obviously foam more than others. I had unknown brand of oil in my FROM the dealer when I purchased it and you could not read the oil level it was so foamy. Whatever oil FastCars put in does not foam at all, so some brands must be more susceptible to it.

What I was told by the dealer was get the car good and hot, shut it down, wait 3-4 minutes and check the oil, that will stop the foam and the level will not have changed enough to be wrong in that short time. I prefer doing it by the book with the new oil my shop put in.

 

What color is the foam? My concern is that it is coolant or water in the oil and that would not be good.

The whine... does the sound change as the rpms go up and down. If so, starts with the accessory belts, equipment, etc... Also may want to probe with a stethoscope (automotive) to pinpoint the noise while running. Be careful as stuff is moving around.

Good Luck