Miura, the original supercar | Page 510 | FerrariChat

Miura, the original supercar

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by joe sackey, Dec 5, 2006.

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  1. Ciro Izzo

    Ciro Izzo Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 18, 2005
    370
    We really debated on bringing the car out. And the remarks here are why . We always tell everyone that is an S with SV bodywork and a few other tricks . She is a beautiful car , incredible to drive and a dream come true . She is numbers matching in her original colors. And could be brought back to S spec easily . But why, when she is so beautiful and incredible to drive ? We like her just the way she is .
     
  2. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

    Nov 19, 2008
    10,744
    Cardiff, UK
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    Steven Robertson
    If you're going to make an SV copy best to do it right or not at all. At the moment the wonderbra looks too big, even for the beautiful ladies voluminous breasts.

    Personally, I'd take it back to S specification, but it's your car, not mine and yours to do with whatever you please.
     
  3. Ciro Izzo

    Ciro Izzo Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 18, 2005
    370
    Thanks for your input . I'll put some years on her before I decide. Keep in mind that I purchased the car this way and am very satisfied. Have a great day.
     
  4. Speedy2

    Speedy2 Karting

    Mar 4, 2007
    63
    When I first viewed the pictures of this Miura there were 2 things that gave it away (at least to me). The interior... this car still retains those beautiful Ducellier switches for the headlamp and window lifts and the stitching on the steering wheel for an early/mid VIN P400S. Rest assured I'm in no way being critical of this car. Damn beautiful restoration!!!
     
  5. Str8shooter

    Str8shooter Formula 3

    Jan 31, 2011
    1,731
    Orlando
    The blue Miura with white interior that came to the 2009? Celebration show was the first time I'd seen one and not knowing much about them I snapped a few pics and moved on. Since then I've gained a much greater appreciation so I was delighted to turn and see yours driving in and getting a second chance for a closer look at a Miura.

    I got the pictures I wanted and it was very cool to see and hear it being driven. Later I took a spot in the shade behind the car and marveled at the design. It really is beautiful and amazing to think in 1969 Lamborghini came out with that while Chevrolet was building Camaros :)

    I chatted with the guy that drove it in and he was very nice to answer the few simple questions I had like year and did it have AC. At the same time I watched as the crowd walked by. It certainly was a crowd pleaser and made many smile. Thank you for taking the time and effort to bring it out to the show and giving people like myself the opportunity to see in person such an amazing car.
     
  6. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    I think the remarks have been constructive for the most part. Mine are both observational & informative, nothing more or less.

    Ownership of any Miura deserves commendation, as I have said in this thread half-a-dozen times already. Accordingly, all due respect to you and the owner of any Miura, and its understood that its the owner right to keep it as they wish.

    However, when you own a Miura (as I found out!), there are many who feel that the car is an example of automotive art which the caretakers must respect. This is where you see some acquiring license to comment that it should exist as the artisans created it.

    When you purchased this car, surely the dilemma of a car existing in the guise of a different variant must have been considered. It is an important one for any Miura enthusiast or prospective owner.

    For my part, the only interest I have in this matter would be sharing how one can tell the difference between a genuine SV and one that is not. The only real grievance I personally have with this sort of modification would be the application of the "SV" badge (as has been seen applied to a number of other pseudo SV cars). I find that single act to be misleading to the uninitiated, although, again, it is up to the car's owner to keep it as they wish.

    Having gone through the restorative process myself multiple times, I'd like to say that because of the nature of a Miura's build, converting one back to original spec cannot be accomplished easily. Certainly not inexpensively!

    Meanwhile, enjoy the ride, lime green is an iconic Miura color!
     
  7. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Joe Sackey
    Miura SV 4870, ex-Shah of Iran.
     
  8. Ciro Izzo

    Ciro Izzo Formula Junior
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    Apr 18, 2005
    370
    Thanks for all of your comments . If you ever see the car, ask me for a ride if you've never been in a Miura. I have been lucky enough to own a few . And this is my favorite . All others were in original form . I hope all who dream about getting one listen to what feels right for you . You can spend years listening to the noise and watch the dream slip away as values skyrocket . If you can get one, do it now , drive it and enjoy it ...LIFE IS SHORT !
     
  9. Andrew R.

    Andrew R. Formula Junior

    Jun 27, 2005
    593
    Michigan
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    Andrew


    Thanks for chiming into the post.. and nice Miura!

    Strange how people worry more about the "converted miuras" than all of the poor restoration decisions being made on more of them!
     
  10. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

    Aug 18, 2007
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    #12735 Olivier NAMECHE, Apr 15, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here is #3516, an early model converted to SV spec in UK back in the 80's and now belonging to the "Renaud's collection Foundation" in Switzerland.
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  11. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

    Nov 19, 2008
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    Steven Robertson
    That's the car that was converted by Omicron Engineering that was featured in Supercar Classics. Was UK registered VAB 11G. This is a car that actually had its rear arches filled out too much by the wheels to my eyes.
     
  12. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    #12737 joe sackey, Apr 15, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    July 1988 issue, still got it in my collection!
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  13. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Not at all strange that people are worried about early Miuras converted into SV lookalikes! And not least because the trend to perform such conversions appears to be accelerating. The reasons to be concerned are obvious as such conversions seek to blur the lines between reality and perception for a number of reasons, almost always, monetary.

    As regards all the poor restoration decisions being made on Miuras that are being restored, pray tell us exactly what they are so the community can learn from your esteemed experience. Class is in session.
     
  14. triple-x

    triple-x Formula 3

    Jun 4, 2009
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    Mr.Platinum
    That green Miura was at the Lamborghini Festival in Houston last year.

    Nice car but quite a few people were turned off by that car having an SV badge when in fact it's not.
     
  15. I would giggle like a little school girl if it was in my garage.
     
  16. spadge1976

    spadge1976 Karting

    Nov 1, 2010
    87
    This is very interesting to me. I had no idea the front wheel arches and the nose shape/slope is different on an SV.
     
  17. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

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    #12742 joe sackey, Apr 16, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Add to that, the SV's nose is longer & flatter topside (as the image of the original orange SV I posted clearly shows).

    I first noticed this when I assembled all 4 variants of Miura (P400, P400S, SV & SVJ) for a T&CC magazine article 14 years ago. All 4 cars were original & unmodified with original paint still on them (at that point).

    At the Miura Reunion we organized later that year where 31 Miuras comprising all the different variants showed up, I observed the same attributes when comparing original cars.

    The differences are subtle, but they are there, and I see them consistently in all original SVs where the hood/s have not been modified or replaced.

    Best,
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  18. garybobileff

    garybobileff Formula 3
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    Feb 5, 2004
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    In measuring 6 Miura noses this morning, I've come up with the following: ( measured from the part closest to the windshield to the front center of the nose)
    SV #1 58 3/4"
    SV #2 58 5/8"
    SV#3 59 1/4"
    S 58 7/8"
    P400 #1 58 7/8
    P400 #2 58 5/8
    All hand crafted, all different, all the above SV's have never had any nose damage, where as the S and P400's have had minor previous damage.
    Gary Bobileff
     
  19. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    Dec 29, 2006
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    Tim Keseluk
    +/- 5/16" seems completely within an acceptable margin of error for something handmade.
     
  20. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    #12745 joe sackey, Apr 16, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    It will be interesting to measure a P400, S & SV that has had no previous damage.

    It will also be interesting to complete your analysis by providing pics of the aforementioned cars side-by-side with noses in a line for real comparison.

    The protrusion of the topside of a Miura SV's front hood relative to the underside, the shape and size of the air-vents and the bumper aperture are all completely different from those of the earlier cars (assuming undamaged original hoods). That much is visible to the naked eye. As production went along, subtle changes were made, as is the case with all cars of that era. This "they are all the same" notion just doesn't wash, unless of course one is trying to standardize replication of the cars! You don't need a measuring tape to see that the hoods made by the factory for the SV are a different 'shape' to those of the earlier cars. When making an SV copy, you'd have to be aware of this in the first place to be able to duplicate it faithfully. A P400 nose (to my eye) looks nothing like the nose of the SV below. The topside protrudes more versus the bottom-side, the bumper aperture is wider and shaped differently, the 2 air-vents below are wider & shaped differently. etc etc etc.
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  21. garybobileff

    garybobileff Formula 3
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    I only agree about the opening in the nose, as I am aware that the SV does in fact have a different bumper and lighting set up, and that portion is of a different dimension. . I think I've worked on these cars before, but thank you for attempting to point that out to me.
    Gary Bobileff
     
  22. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Please post pics of the 3 SVs, 1 S and 2 P400s that you have measured this morning, side-by-side with noses in a line for real comparison.

    If you do, I think you'll come around. Most importantly, the comparison will help the community, so why not, if the cars are there and have already been measured?

    This reminds me of a debate I started 15 years ago when I observed that to my eye the early Countach LP400S was in fact a "Lowbody" with smaller/lower dimensions in the cockpit area including the doors. I was met with "They're all the same"...
     
  23. garybobileff

    garybobileff Formula 3
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    Feb 5, 2004
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    Time is a valuable commodity, as I wish I had more. In order to shuffle all the cars, align all the noses,etc. takes considerable time. But I would love to, but only if time allows, as I am very busy, with Monterey being only 4 months away.
    Gary Bobileff
     
  24. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
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    Since you took the time to measure the 6 Miuras, surely, images taken from the same angle of all 6 Miuras in place (without moving them) can easily be delegated & accomplished in a few minutes. That would be very helpful as it is not often 6 Miuras covering all 3 variants are in one place.
     
  25. garybobileff

    garybobileff Formula 3
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    Feb 5, 2004
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    I'll try with the photos when time allows, and here at Bobileff Motorcar Company in San Diego, having 6 or so Miura's at the same time is routine for years and years. You know that Joe, as I've restored a number of Miura's and Countach's for you, and you've been here often during the restoration process and saw many Miura's at one time here. So, you shouldn't think this to be an unusual event.
    Gary Bobileff.
     

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