Forza F355 article

If a clutch for a 360 costs about the same as a 355 major--and a clutch for a 355 costs about the same a 360 major--aren't the maintenance costs virtually a wash? (I am excluding "known issues' such as 355 valve guides & headers and 360 precats & cam variators).

 

I understand this thoroughly since I just bought a '99 Diablo roadster, and the appreciation potential was in the back of my head, since they only made 150 of the '99 variant with the body, engine, brakes, and interior updates.

And yes, the required maintenance is just as intensive if not more. And the Diablo owners are fine with that, they understand the specialness of the car. The mindset is totally different.

Here is where alot of 355 owners hurt their own model, they deny the car has needs far and above alot of exotics.....so the F what? Its a special car, start treating it as such.

 

I have been lurking for at least 4-5 years, for one reason or another I really like the 355. At 61 yrs, what would you wait for?? Also in the stable is a nice 930 cab (G50), nice near original rust free 356 sc coupe and a nice rust free original 911s.

The market will always be dictated by supply and demand.

For years I have wondered why 930's could be obtained at "low prices", within the last several months it seems to be changing.

It is of my opinion high performance sporting vehicles will at minimum hold their current prices, and probably increase as our general economy strengthens.

Currently I am looking very close at a 355, the car is 400 miles from home, if I can get my wife on board we will be there next weekend for an inspection. The owner claims everything works, but will need a belt service this year. Wish me/us luck.

 

360 clutch and a 355 major are not even close.

360 precats failures have been limited to car that have had an ignored running issue. 2nd generation variators have been reliable and Ferrari replace all of the 1st gen for free for anyone who showed up at the door.

 

A 360 clutch isn't that much, and I haven't seen a 360 needing guides and manifolds or the motor to come out every 3-5 years for a $7-10k service.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm actually in the market for a 355, I love them for some sadistic reason, but I can work on them so my position is a bit different than that of your typical buyer. Working on these cars is part of the hobby for me so what better car to get into lol.

 

Really? Would both not be in the $6-8K range, typically?

 

I've been quoted when I priced things out if I ever need one in the future to between $3-6k. Depending on what's needed by my indy. If you need a flywheel and new bearings it's a bit more.

So you guys would recommend a 355 to somebody WITHOUT putting a disclaimer on the end of the sentence? In other words, if you knew a guy that drove a Camry that didn't know a cam belt from a leather belt.. that changed his spark plugs only because the guy at the Toyota dealership told him to at the 140,000 mile mark. You would recommend the 355 to a guy like that without a disclaimer sentence immediately following the recommendation?

 

I would recommend a 355 to anyone, but would tell them about potential issues that they may encounter. I think this goes with any exotic car. I have a couple of Detomaso's and they can have their own issues, although not any with the motor. Tough to beat an American V8. I think this goes with any high end marque (Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Mercedes Benz, Audi). Any of these brands are going to have higher parts and maintenance prices than your Toyota Camry owner is used to, not even the price of admission.

One of my friends who also owns a Pantera, had a 1986 TR for a period of 5-6 years. He felt Ferrari's in general were only good to drive at 8/10's. He felt that they were more delicate in general. His TR ended up needing an engine rebuild, so he ended up selling it. It wasn't worth for him to have the engine rebuilt for half the value of the car with fair performance. It was a very nice car though, black/tan.

If the Camry owner is worried that much about maintenance costs, than he probably should stay with his Camry.

 

I wouldn't recommend that person buy a Ferrari, period. They are not a Camry, even a 458 is not zero maintenance. I would offer anyone buying a Ferrari a disclaimer that they need to be aware of model specific issues, and the 355 in particular needs to be gone over well before purchase by someone who knows the car and it's issues.

Fwiw, I think the article was fair.

 

Meh.

Dino's were written off as a POS year ago too.

The "experts" can have their say. Many end up wrong in the end.

Yes, a 360 is a bit easier to work on. It is also ugly as hell. Want easy? buy a Honda.

the 355 aint for pansies...and I like it that way.

 

Well damn, the Forza 360 Buyer's Guide stated that while the engine did not need to be dropped for a 30K Major, it did have to be dropped for a clutch replacement. I was surprised due to the similar engine orientation to the F355. But,..... I stand corrected.

 

The engine and trans do have to separated, unlike the 355 where you just remove the bumper and muffler and the clutch comes out...

 

Funny, I just reread the entire article and didn't see that anywhere.

 

Well, it was in some Forza article about the 360. Come on Brian, my poor brain is getting old and incompetent. I can only remember so much BS about cars I don't even own. But, I distinctly remember reading that information somewhere in Forza.

While Forza has not yet published an Index, I have all the issues and I'll look through my stack and see if I can find it. BTW, what issue was that 360 Buyer's Guide?

 

After 25k miles and eight years of ownership, I would ABSOLUTELY recommend a 355 to a friend... BUT they would have to be a friend with disposable income, single or with a story book wife, a true passion for special Italian cars, and an understanding/forgiveness of Ferrari shenanigans, which are traits none of my friends possess unfortunately. When these cars run well, OMG what a ride!!! Feels like a land-bound F-16 fighter jet, not that I know what that really feels like. Forza should have interviewed me!! I have a TON of maintenance money into my car (quite a bit more than the car's value), and I love it more and more every day. Cars are why I work, and the 355 makes me happy to go to work.

360's are probably a more sound financial decision, but Ferrari's aren't bought with brains, they're bought with hearts and balls! I won't buy another Ferrari until they top the 355's look and feel, which is unlikely IMO.

 

Everything in the article seemed ok to me, except as mentioned above they could have had a more representative sampling of owners.

F355Bob mentioned a list of problems - "headers, valve guides, alternators, plugs, oil leaks, radiators, sticky parts, dash shrinkage, a/c problems, door handles breaking,etc." These are definitely issues, but many of them are (or should be if repaired properly) one-time issues - once you've sorted the headers, valve guides, sticky parts, dash shrinkage, etc. they are done. If you've bought a car where they were already sorted, even better.

We appear to be a bit blessed in the UK as the cost for the major services and cambelt changes look to be much cheaper (and we don't need to worry about things like a/c in our climate), which may explain why attitudes towards the 355 are a bit more positive over here. Personally, I'm just happy to have my dream car and I'd rather have a 355 than to have a newer car that I either think doesn't look or sound nearly as good (360 or 430), or which looks awesome and nearly as good on the sound front (458), but which is still expensive to maintain (and much more expensive to tax and insure) and has years of depreciation ahead of it that will cost me more than if I completely rebuilt my 355 from the wheels up.

 

Its funny....

the "Market Watch" section of the new EVO Magazine is dedicated to the F355/360 as well.... it actually says that F355s are in major demand over seas....and prices have risen steadily to the point where a good F355 manual is worth considerably more then the 360 that replaced it.

I think we are our own worst enemies when it comes to this cars reputation....
It IS a maintenance heavy nightmare... anyone, owners, mechanics, Tifosi, that says otherwise is either kidding themselves or have not had to do a major service on a 20 year old car yet. If you want an F355 to run like it was meant to, and to do so reliably... someone, somewhere throughout the cars ownership history has spent major coin to make it that way...

I have owned mine for over 5 years.... and I will not even begin to list the things i have replaced, repaired, restored, or upgraded on the car.

The one thing I think people do not come to grips with is that a bumper respray, clear bra, carbon fiber, etc....are not maintenance items... they are the owners personal touches.

Once the car is sorted and running correctly, its as reliable as a Honda...if not more so...
BUT... getting it to that state is a long road that many people will choose not to travel.

 

I'd say that is about right here in the UK, all other things (mileage, condition, service history) being equal. CS's excluded of course (although there is a low-mileage challenge car on sale here for near-CS money). And the 355 prices you see are definitely trending upward in the UK after bottoming out a few years ago, as are 348's to a slightly lesser extent, and 360s are still depreciating here. IMO 355 prices will hit a natural plateau soon though if they haven't already, there are too many of them to "do a Dino" and truly skyrocket, and they are creeping towards 430 territory.

 

See what I don't understand.. is if 355's are so in demand and have such a high price overseas... why isn' there a massive outflow of 355's from the US?

Unless of course with import duties and required mods for the car would push it into that six figure territory.. in which case the cars are priced as they should when factoring this in globally. E.g. Australia import duties and shipping.

 

I think you hit it with import taxes, duties, etc....

Its like the R33 Skyline when it came out in japan...
Everyone in the US wanted one but to get it through US regs was just to expensive and time consuming to be worth it...

 

Every single chapter of the article is space limited so including ten owners impressions is just not possible. A number of people were interviewed and those that made it to print were representative of the total. I received a call from the editor the day the interviews were finished and was told that for the first time in the history of the series not one single owner interviewed would recommend the car to a friend. He was very surprised. It was not an intended outcome. A balance is tried for. If one had said yes and 9 had said no the yes would have been included to hear their side. No such response was available.

 

I'd bet if we did a poll here the results would be much different.

 

Push polling is always possible but what does it prove?

 

That, and the steering wheel being on the "wrong" side of the car You can knock £5-10k off the value of a 355 if it is LHD here. Australia, Hong Kong, Singapore and Japan are all strong markets as well, and are all RHD markets. I think the continental European market is a bit softer but am not sure. You'd also need to make some modifications to the car for it to pass MOT/local roadworthiness requirements.

 

Seriously? That's kinda what you did in the Forza article.

You couldn't find a single owner that would recommend the car to friend? Didn't look very hard then.

I have to ask Brian, Why such a hate for this car?