Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

The back off thing is bull****. There's no telling how much a driver would slow down or how much it effected the lap until it was way too late to plan anything, nor could the driver do it accurately without being totally obvious.

"You're on pace for 6:55. There is only 1 minute left in the lap, so slow down approximately 2%. Yeah, you heard us right, we need you to accurately drop your speed 2.4mph from what you theoretically think you would do if we didn't tell you to slow down."

 

The last paragraph in my scanned attachment (at least that is what I think you are referring to) is only part of the article. The team then spent the rest of the time (one week) on normal roads, and report that over many pages. They had already timed the laps with the 'stig' at that point and the conclusion they came to was what I had mentioned in my first post on this matter. They just did not publish the times at the track in Spain as these will be revealed in the TV programme. I suspect that TG also wanted to get the lap times at the Dunsfold track but only Porsche provided their 918, Mclaren would seem to have declined, so the nigh identical lap times at the Spanish track will be used instead in the TV show, me thinks, whenever that airs. I hope this makes more sense now.

 

Wow!

Thanks Mario.

So McLaren submitted a car for the track in Spain. However, they didn't submit one for their home track in England?

Which one did they do first?? Can you imagine if they had a slower time in Spain, then declined to submit a car to Dunsfold (to presumably avoid going 0-2, or at least winning one, if they did in Spain)?

I don't know what happened. You would know better than most of us, since you have the article.

Interesting......

 

Gordon Murray is not a fan of the P1/918/LaF apparently. But has he ever been a fan of anything else other than the F1 and his own shirts?

 

thanks for the clarification. I suppose it is possible that he is just posting photos now that were infact taken a couple of weeks back. I can't wait to read the full article. I also think that mclaren will show up at the top gear track. they have until the episode airs if they haven't already set a time. if they don't then I for one will be extremely disappointed.

 

I am pretty sure Spain came first, looks like it was a scheduling/logistics choice, certainly it is not mentioned why this track over Dunsfold. The Spanish track was only created in 2009 but dry weather may be much more predictable than at Dunsfold. Fittingly, as the Spanish track is not well documented as a test track due to it's age, the table that lists the track times is subtitled "It's not quite Dunsfold but..."...again, slightly off-topic, they tested a Bentley Continental GT W12, a bit of a portly vehicle, that lapped said track in 2:08.4, and they tested the 918 in E-mode only, and it lapped this track in 2:19.7. The P1 did not set an electric mode only lap.

And it is restated a couple of times in the article, that the lap times at the Spanish track were nigh identical around the 1:50-1:49 minutes mark, though no times were listed.

 

As a P1 fan (and still am) I am hugely disappointed that the P1 is slower. With that said, I would like to see what the test may be like with the P1 on those new option tires. Don't even give me that b.s. that I am a fanboy crying foul crap either. I will reserve my opinion on what Porsche has done since they started delivering customer cars. Of the Porsche can continually keep working at their car and then run it against the P1 and try to make it seem like it was that fast to start with, then the P1 deserves a go on the new rubber. But I guess that is never going to happen is it? I can't wait to see what the times were. By the way. I didn't have the time to read all post so I won't be surprised of someone gets upset at something but that's OK. I guess this is what McLaren were trying to avoid when they wouldn't release a time anywhere. We'll just keep going at it with no end.

 

I will be honest, as silly as it is, I took Harris's opinion on the 918's performance as fact and I pretty much took the 918 out of the equation when it came to track times and 0 to xxx times.. and I did that without even looking deeper into what Porsche have done with the 918...

I've changed my mind based on recent news/facts about it's performance, in fact, if the car is on par/faster than the P1, its very likely that its faster than the LaF as well.. not that it matters in LaF's case, at least for me... even if the LaF was at 458 levels in terms of performance I would still prefer it over the other two.

This kind of reminds of when the Nissan GTR came out.. it was heavier and all, but thanks to its clever 4 wheel drive it drove circles around the M3 and the likes.

 

Gordon Murray about modern Hypercars and more. Very interesting!

Q&A: Gordon Murray wants to prove hybrid hypercars wrong | Goodwood Road and Racing

 

predictable . didn't take long.

1. Porsche had taken a bit longer to deliver cars for other reasons, mainly around systems integration (ie, brake linearity, optimal charging, 10/10ths drivability, etc). They knew the technical performance of their car quite a while ago. And FYI, Porsche will 'keep working' on their car throughout its product cycle...Optimisation will continue along with advances in technology.

2. Mac not releasing a time is simply a result of them underestimating the 918. P1 was/is based on nothing but numbers (er, 600kg of downforce anyone?). The about face has to do with biting off more than they could chew. P1 not only failed to be 'waaaay faster', it's that 918 has actually turned out to be the faster car. PR hard to spin this one.

3. Tires. Don't worry, we're going down that rabbit hole soon enough. P1 will have track bias Trofeo's , and 918 will have new generation of 'Cup tire. You think there's going to be a big change in pecking order? New 'Cup for 918 worth something on the order of 10 seconds on the Ring.

We can keep going on and on...wait till P1 gets this, wait till it gets that, wait till 918 gets next gen lighter battery pack, wait till a pro gets behind the wheel...etc. Please, just stop. The P1 is an incredible machine, however, if you've got it in your mind that it is the holy grail, the last word in performance and technology, well...


When will folks just accept that Porsche has built one heck of a machine? They set out to build a technical showcase of their idea of the future, not necessarily to build a direct competitor to P1 or LaF, but the result is no less stunning.

 

Never buy a car because it's faster at least that's my opinion.

I look for much than that if I want comfort ill buy a Rolls.

I just had some amazing time with a 918 with W/P nice all around car fast but couldn't hit it hard due to traffic, it's more friendly and comfortable compared to my P1.

I can drive the car more and be happy about it and sure I wasn't afraid of blind spots compared to my P1.

Then went home unhooked the charger fired my P1 took her for a ride and I knew I made the right choice the car atmosphere totally different I felt everything around me the cockpit tailored exactly for you its really a driver car.

you feel every single input or error it's more of a race car for the roads.

Porsche just wanted to build fast comfortable sueprcar and it did it right but for someone like me I felt board after sometime.

I'm sure my cousin loves it and I'm so happy for him.

May I think about a 918 no and my Laferrari deal is done and also there is something coming will make all our cars looks slow.

Will get more info soon.

And I know look is subjective but the P1 looks way more beautiful to me than the 918.

Btw. I drove the hall out of the P1 to check the battery it was a hot day registering 35C (95F) max went to 37C (99F) battery temperature stayed at the middle.

I've done everything possible for over 45min to over heat the batteries.

So can't be happier.


Mbn

 

don't get so worked up, he made a reasonable comment. I only agree with you on your last paragraph. you do realise they haven't released the times yet. you don't think that maybe they're waiting for the tv show and that they want it to be close and exciting. the 0-100 and 0-200 times were more or less what we were expecting. lets wait on the 0-300 numbers before saying which is quicker. the braking times are what I find most interesting and unexpected though. still with the stig driving them both I'm willing to bet the p1 will still beat it round a track

 

Congrats on the P1! yours is silver correct? completely understand your point of view. while we can all bench race/magazine race forever and ever (which is pretty much all of us non-owners can do), in the end it's always been about which car connects with you personally. all the lucky owners in the world know what they've got, dream machines. BTW, even though the 918 is much more benign from the factory, it's setup can be changed to offer more 'directness'...but of course it will never mimic 100% a P1 or LaF due to design and its mission from the get go. We need more pics of your P1.

 

though not 100% directly cross reference indicative, AMS 0-300kmh time for 918 is quicker than Autocar test for P1. So trend is slanted towards 918 as quicker or just as quick. Seems like most loyal and passionate P1 fans keep holding their breath for reality to change... the reality that 918 is much much quicker than they imagined. btw, how much you wiling to bet that Stig is the 'cure-all'? If we're going down that rabbit hole again, why not have Lieb drive the 918 and Stig drive P1? It's not necessary, the picture has emerged, they are neck and neck with small +/- depending on the track.

 

you are not alone, for a huge number of people, whatever Harris and Sutts say is gospel. and you are right, it matters absolutely zilch whether or not it's faster than LaF....LaF is a most desirable car. looks amazing, sounds amazing, and ridiculously fast. like nothing else.

 

well I will happily admit that the 918 is faster than we imagined/thought. and I wasn't holding my breath but the reality has changed in that that the 918 has upped its power and is now a lot faster then it was. They've obviously done a great job in developing the car since the first reviews of the prototypes. at the end of the day though we're still waiting on lap times. and to see customer cars line up on a drag strip (we'd probably still argue then). The 918 is obviously a great car but I still think that most car journalists will side with the p1 when they get to do back to back comparisons, purely because the p1 is more of a drivers car. when you see chris harris sliding it around it just looks more fun than the 918. also yes I do think it'll beat the 918 around the track

 

Thanks for posting! I like his approach toward weight... great work on that Yamaha.

Overall I think more powerful batteries, torque vectoring (the electric SLS), and weight reduction is the future.

Indeed it is..

As far as Harris... I learned my lesson.

 

Hmm..."Nothing in modern F1 translates to the road."

Makes me wonder what the name of his new car will be called. Also makes me wonder how thrilling F1 must have been in the late '80s / early '90s.

 

Gordon doesn't like ANYTHING these days

 

P1 will beat 918 around which track? THE track? every track? What you 'think' is not being reflected by what has been measured/recorded. It WAS meant to be the faster track car by a wide margin while driven by joe schmoe or the Stig, but reality is just not the case. In TG instance, they are clearly very close, with +/- here or there. As far as drag racing...What do we need to wait on? AMS, Motor Trend, Autocar, Top Gear, the trend is clear...918 is just as quick or quicker in certain aspects. In Motor Trend, AMS and Top Gear test, what is emphatic is that 918 hugely out-brakes P1. In TG, from 100mph-0, the difference is 5 meters! Yikes! what the TG test shows is what many of us have long believed...that the P1 is the much more 'hyper' and edgy car, less filtered in seat-of-your -pants feel...different standard in NVH, different handling and power, the 918 being the more linear in how it delivers power and with the 'calmer' handling characteristics (as confirmed by Doom and every single mag test)...but that doesn't mean less feedback or boring as per TG and those who have driven it, and obviously it doesn't mean slower. Which car the journo's 'side with' would depend on subjective preferences wouldn't it? If they agree more with what you/or I personally believe, would it make it more 'true'? Would it make 918 or P1 less of a car? Factual vs subjectivity, it's just a reference of sort. Perhaps more Journo's will prefer the 'rawness' of P1. Harris sliding P1 around does look like tons of fun, as does 918 being slid around by others. What is beyond doubt is that those having driven, and will drive, those cars are lucky as heck.

 

Clarkson comparing the Porsche 918 Spyder (Weissach pack) to the McLaren P1 he drove earlier:

Jeremy Clarkson drives the Porsche 918 Spyder for The Sunday Times Driving | Driving.co.uk

 

I wish Tiff Needell ever gets hold of the cars. He's the only one I really trust. Most of the others are just muppets trying to look cool, to be talked about or just plain corrupt fanboys.

 

Thanks !

The only downside when it comes to some owners and fans which I understand that they believe whatever they own or like it's the best.

I'm for one will be open if the 918 been faster than my P1 if one day we went to track.

Or if I'm facing issues...etc

No shame and that should make Mclaren or any factory works harder next time.

Writing this post I think the 918 did it's job pretty well and more than well and it made me smile since I'm planing now to send my 964 3.3 Turbo with Factory X33 upgrade (355hp) to Porsche Classic.

The only issue porsche dealer he is my friend so I could go planing a factory restoration aragreement and ends with a 918 order lol.

Thinking back yes I felt bored driving the 918 but to be fair maybe because I couldn't do what I wanted to do due to traffic and i couldn't abuse someone else car.

Anyway we lucky to have all this cars around so better some here be cool about it take it easy and build friends who we can share our like and dislike with respect but not putting other people choices down.

Mbn

 

Congrats on your P1, and thanks for your various comments and input.

Just curious. When you drove the 918, did you [get to] drive it with the top off??

I would think that quite exciting, especially with that 9200 RPM race bred engine revving up right behind you (I know you said, you didn't get a chance to open it up in traffic).

Enjoy!!

 

Thats what I figure. These testers cant get used to driving, trusting a downforce car in the short time that they have to test it. The 918s limits are easier to reach quickly Thanks to the torque vectoring, awd and 4ws. It doesnt make you rethink your approach to driving. Suddenly you have to go beyond what you've considered your comfort zone to reach the full potential of the P1. The 918 magnifies Whats been drilled into your head. It doesn't mean that 1 is better balanced than the other, it just means that the 918 is more of a car for everyone. Your grandmother could drive it fast in a month and Thats not a bad thing at all. Thats what they were going for. The p1 is a car that will grow with you and open your mind to a whole new level of trusting downforce. Neither car is better or worse. One will just reward you in ways you've never experienced in downforce and trust if you can get by the mental block. Clarkson is one of the people who cant get past it. And Im sure many others wont either in the limited time that they have.