I'm going for beauty as I can no longer afford "great cars", which, like beauty, is a matter of opinion !! I am fortunate enough to have one, maybe two "great cars" (300 GW/RO) among some "lesser" mbz, f-cars et. al., so my Ghibli pursuit puts me square in the bulls-eye of a "bubble-baby"....great cars no longer obtainable, shift gears and buy into a rising (frantic!) market as I (we) think "better while I can", picking cars that WERE second or third tier from technological, racing, pedigree and so on, then crashing on the off-chamber hairpin when market collapses....guess the Fiat dino spider falls in here too....but at least they're pretty ! I will have to leave the great cars to the RL, PK and JG of the world, yet at least I can drive their "kissing cousins" and maybe, on the way down, pick-up the 'now forlorn daytona' as a 250 SWB is forever out of reach!!! (tongue kinda in cheek), Jack
Proof the world has gone nuts. http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/cats-exotics/438846-1967-fiat-dino-lynnwood-washington.html#post142945905
this coming from a guy that's owned a Testarossa and Mondial???? makes sense. Not to mention the Daytona...your collection sure has a universal appeal.
Sorry old boy I don't understand your meaning. Are you in agreement with me regarding Porsche or do you disagree? Are you dissing my previous cars versus Porsche but approve of the Daytona? Please explain.
Well, I fit in a 330GT - I do not in a 308. so that beautiful car is off limits as a driver car. Cheers Warren
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t31.0-8/1912027_10153920575505284_1504820863_o.jpg For $99,600.
It has been two years since the bubble claims have been tossed around and while it normally would be expected, there may be a unique feature affecting this rise in prices; an influx of cash from outside the market. But the money must be coming from somewhere to fuel these purchases ... look at this article revealing that Billionaires are able to move huge sums out of China beyond the alleged $50k limits "Secret Path Revealed for Chinese Billions Overseas" https://finance.yahoo.com/news/secret-path-revealed-chinese-billions-043538065.html Sold!
Cannot argue with a lot of points made in this article. Collector Car Market - The Beginning of the End?
Any realignment of the Ferrari market will be caused by changes (or perceived changes) in the economy. Stay tuned.
Well thanks ferraripete, I posted that 24th Feb, almost six months ago. Maybe you could grow a sense of humour?
Ferraris are different than all the rest. Enzo's legacy is in stone. The cars were made in limited numbers. If anything will not burst it would be Ferrari. They burst before because it coincided with the death of Enzo, which many people thought would be the end of Ferrari. When it was clear it was not the end prices plummeted. See the art market. Ferrari=Picasso or insert another famous artist. But nothing can go up in a straight line forever.
I have developed a passion for Ferrari cars back in the mid 70's (bought my first one in 1976) and still do have that passion today.. So I've been there, and done that thru all the ups and downs in the market.... ...I believe it's all in perceived value... Ferraris have always been built for the wealthy...those that could only afford them. (The millionaires .."in the day"). Today...there are a lot of millionaires out here... (at least by net worth standards...hell, my trash-man's retirement acct. is probable a million..) ... So who is stepping up in to today's market.... the billionaires of today (or lets' just say the 400 million"aire" + and up)... The millionaires of yesterday... are the "paupers" of today in this market... ...It just makes sense...Ferrari's where always the wealthy man's toys...today those wealthy men are now the billionaires of today.... ...I could go on and on...just my opinion, your thoughts?
The boom market of the late 1980s and early '90s did not deflate because of the death of Enzo Ferrari. It crashed because of the impact of external economic factors, which had analogous effects on nearly every asset class, from real estate to art to cars. And, when it happens again, it will be for similar reasons. Ferrari is no different from any asset. They go up, they go down. It isn't different this time, and thinking it is ignores the lessons of history. Michael
I agree that Ferraris are something special within the car market and I do feel that part of the runup is due to the larger market finally recognizing the specialness of these cars. That said, overheated markets are usually derailed by flippers disrupting the natural supply/demand balance. As we see more flipping that results in a relative glut of cars on the market, then it seems likely there will be a pullback. On the other hand, if Ferraris have transitioned to finally being recognized by the broader community on the same level as Picasso, for example, then the market may have the strength to absorb the additional cars. Only time (and the upcoming auctions in August) will tell.
It sounds like this guy in the UK is calling peak The ?Stradale? Collection | Salon Privé London - why else to liquidate....
I think he means the guy is selling his collection (Miura, F40/F50/ Daytonas). He owns Eagles Etype. Maybe he needs $$ for his business..Maybe he thinks prices are not gonna stay that high for much longer..
Or estate planning etc. Happens all the time. Probably a combination of things and the timing is just right for him.
I keep an eye on the daytona market and have seen supply more than quadruple in recent weeks. There could be an element of seasonality but while the supply increase doesn't necessarily indicate a turn or correction in prices, it does indicate IMHO a degree of nervousness out there. If they existed, it could be a good time to buy some put options on the classic ferrari price index.
I don't understand his logic, which if I diagram it, seems to distill to: Ferrari prices are rising very fast; Classic car prices are flat; therefore this is a bubble driven by speculators. Seems to me he's made a case for shifting tastes, but I don't see the rationale of his conclusion. If you are looking for bubbles, I think you are better off pondering the Porsche market vs. Ferraris. Garden variety, mass produced early 70's 911s have appreciated 100%+ in 24 mos. 3.0L 930s are now $200K cars. These are not 'rare' cars relative to Ferrari production numbers, where extreme scarcity clearly contributes to the extreme results...
While I agree that generational preferences and "shifting tastes" (a.k.a. fashion) has a lot to do with the seemingly disproportionate interest in the Ferraris (and, yes, Porsches) of the 1960s and '70s, I cannot accept the notion that 50-100% annual increases in price represent anything other than unsustainable speculation in the market. I'm sorry, but we have been here before, and memories are short. It is not different this time, and it isn't that the world finally realized that obsolete cars made by only one special manufacture are the best investment class in history (other than tulips, of course). The cars' values will go up until they don't anymore, and at that point the flippers, speculators and investors will reveal themselves as they head for the exists, simultaneously and with alarming speed. Please do not misunderstand; I am NOT calling a peak today, and I cannot predict when that will occur, but I can say with certainty that these price levels will not be sustained in the long run. And, before anybody asks, yes, I own some expensive cars too and I don't hope for a pullback, but I have been in this market (and many of the other collectible markets, like fine art) for a long time and I must be realistic. Michael
