Trust me been faster is not always the joy. Took few years off exotics and went to try car modifications well yes my modified cars can beat almost all cars out there n a straight line but definitely they not replacing the Ferrari experience no matter how fast you or the others can go. For track my Viper ACR's a blast to drive but my Scud w/ Tubi titanium exhaust always a fun to drive too, hard to complain since every car comes with its own enjoyment. Mbn
A brisk drive in the twisties (under 65mph) can be a LOT more fun and exciting in my 2013 Italia than 130mph in a straight line. Road twisties are largely the domain of NA engines, rather than turbocharged engines. I think the folks at Ferrari know this, but fleet mileage and emissions requirements are forcing the change to turbocharging. It is to be seen how well Ferrari will deal with the sound and throttle response challenges. I'm optimistic -- I told my dealer that I would like one of the 458 replacements.
If you look the reviews about new California T, it looks like Ferrari is in the same league with those Zonda to Huayra, BMW M5 V10 NA to V8 Turbo, AMG turbo and Porsche 911 turbo. Means Ferrari cannot beat the physics of turbo. MPG, polar bear, hugging tree, blah blah blah is just an excuse. Turbocharged SUVs that can do 0-62 in 6 seconds still produce more emission than NA Ferrari. The real thing about turbocharged is $$$. Imagine you don't need to pour money for engine development. Just use the same engine, shared between few models, add some boost or max get a new turbo and intercooler and call it ALL NEW. Guys in local modification stores have been doing this for years.
Indeed we will see. It is a tough challenge to reproduce the response and overall experience of the NA engine, as created by Ferrari. The California T is not a good indicator of what the "458M" will be like, given that it is really for a different market. But my guess is that max horsepower at 7500 RPM is not going to cut it in the 458M. I have not expressed interest in a 458M. I want to wait and see what it brings. If it doesn't make the grade I will probably wander over to the F12 side of the house (whose prices may shoot up further).
I doubt very much if the F12 prices go up My bet is the waiting line vanishes and maybe after a short while some discounts might appear.There are performance cars coming down the pike that will effect F12 sales - IMO
I think that Ferrari will farther hone the sense of occasion/fun of driving the car, especially at slower speeds. I was able to drive a 650S in Monterey last month and while it is undeniably fast, at slow speed it felt like driving an F Sport Lexus. And remember we drive this cars in city streets any day and only a few days a months on a track...
There have been some used cars available pretty near MSRP already, so most of the premium has already disappeared. Used one will be well under MSRP by the time a the new 458 is out.
I've read this thread off and on, it's getting really long, so I might have missed if somebody already chimed in with this. Do you really think Ferrari will screw up the sound? Here are the words straight from the man: Image Unavailable, Please Login
I have no doubt that they are aware of what makes their cars exciting... and ultimately profitable. Whether they can deliver on the promise of keeping the faith in a TT sports car is up for grabs.
100% agree. See, we are not comparing California T to 458, but to California 30. So basically the new car sounds worse than the car it replaced. This is not Ferrari's tradition. The 458 T or M, whatever; Will be compared to current 458 and Speciale which sound very good, screaming high. Based on every turbocharged successor, like Pagani Zonda to Huayra, BMW M5 V10 NA to V8 Turbo, 911 GT3 and 911 turbo (same engine), and worst of all in the history of machine kind : 2014's F1; I don't think the 458's successor with turbocharged engine will sound good. And the engine is actually the same with the Cali T. When that being launched, the first thing to happen is that there will be long long waiting list for V12, and used Ferrari especially 360CS and 599GTO will retain it's value.
Yep sound contributes a lot to the fun factor and makes these cars stand out from the rest. Cali T sounds lame in my opinion. Never replaced my M6 V10 with the new model because I miss the screaming sound of the V10. Thank God I have the GTO best sounding car I ever had and judging by what's to come it will keep that title for a while.
From the same man who said there will not be a track version of 458. Right. It might very well be the best sounding turbo engine, but not comparable to a screaming NA Sent from my HTC Desire 816 dual sim using Tapatalk 2
Do you think that GTO version of F12 will have such great loud sound like 599 GTO or maybe there are some new stupid regulation about noise level?
The F12 sounds better than the standard 599 So if they were able to make a big leap in sound from 599 to GTO Then I believe they can do very well with the F12GTO - IMO
Wasn't everyone saying that there will never be GTO version of the F12? People who attended the 458T event mentioned that the F12 will soon get a facelift, ~780hp, V12 (no hybrid)....etc. But everyone always agreed that we won't see the equivalent of a GTO version for the F12.
I agree we will see some kind of ultimate F12. It most likely won't be called "GTO" though. They always do this. It's just part of their game plan. As to the LaF and F12 sounding incredible- they do. But simple physics says when you put a fan in line with the exhaust you will muffle it and this is exactly how the California T sounds. I think its fine for a GT but for a supercar like the 458 and its successor, its really not what we've come to expect from Ferrari. So either we need to alter our expectations- whether by choice or by Ferrari marketing/ or Ferrari needs to achieve some technical breakthrough that really reduces the muffling effect of the turbos. I suspect it will be a mix of both. We will have to wait and see. The one thing I can guarantee you is it won't be the same and thats why I got my 458 because I love it and I didn't want to miss the boat on the greatest supercar I could ever own.
this is good sound for Mercedes but not enough good for Ferrari https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4Xjtrv8VKs
