458 Replacement - when is first European delivery and is it just a facelift?

you will have to wait till geneva 2015 march to find out but yes its a turbo, yes its a facelift like 360 to 430, pricing nothing yet.

uk deliveries will be in 2016

 

Turbo
will be show in Geneve in March
Europe demo cars mid June
first customer car july-august as California t

 

thats the speciale spider for paris

 

Nobody would know what it will look like. But it will definitely look good.
With turbocharged engine, it won'T sound good at all. Just check the California T review. And the throttle response won't be as good as NA engine. But it will be lighting fast though.

 

It will be a 360 to 430 change not a 430 to 458 change.

 

i wouldnt call a 360 to 430 change a "facelift"

id say 360 to 430 is just as dramatic as 430 to 458.

 

As I said it is a 360 to 430 upgrade not a 430 to 458. It's a 5 year upgrade not 10 year new car. Just as with 348 to 355 5 year evolution not revolution. It has been discussed in countless other threads.

 

It was not. For heavens sake the 430 engine is a modified version of the powerplant in the Maserati 4200. The 458 was a completely new car. New chassis, new gearbox, new engine, new greenhouse etc. The 430 is considered an M car.

As mentioned in the multitude of other 458M based threads; The 458 successor is an M - modificata. Not an entirely new chassis, nor a new greenhouse. Gearbox etc stays the same but some changes to the design both exterior and interior (carplay etc.) inc. vents for the new turbo engine (based on California T powerplant). (It should be mentioned before drawing conclusions that the TT engine in the CaliT is a very mild variant of that powerplant. Rumors say all the prototypes ran with >600hp and the engine is good for 750 hp in production trim.) HP for the 458M will be ~670.

 

If you are using that logic the 458 engine would also fall into that family of engines. the maserati 4200 and others as well as the F430 and 458 use various versions of the F136 engines developed by ferrari and used jointly with maserati ... However internally they are different engines all together with different displacements and cross plane design vs flat plane design ..so they are not really the same at all they just share similar block design... etc...

 

I was not only using that logic. It was just an example. The F430 is technically considered an M on paper. But that's not what we're discussing here....

 

So in 10 years ferrari's baby will have 1000 hp. And maybe 1900kg.

Where will all these going to go to?

 

For the past few years cars have been getting lighter, not heavier.

 

I'd say it will more likely be 1300 kg and 700'ish hp. 10 years is not that long away. In 10 years, we are looking at the M model of the 458 successor, which is what, 4-5 years away?

 

458 weights less than the 430? or less than 360? less than 355? don't think so.

 

Cars are getting heavier with more electronics and gadgetry which is used to conceal the added weight as best as can be done.

 

The F12 is lighter than the 599 and I guess the 458 replacement will be a tad lighter also. Even the LaFerrari with its heavy hybrid system weighs the same as an Enzo!

 

Most likely. The Cali T is also lighter than the Cali. It's a general trend that cars are now getting lighter. Mercedes SL, S, C, SLK, BMW Z4, BMW 3 and 4 series and a lot of other cars are getting lighter. Lighter materials has become more available, and all the emissions rules makes it necessary as well.

 

I spoke with a US dealer today on the 458 replacement and they told me they are still pretty much in the dark on when it will be available, but hopefully getting some more concrete info early 2015.

 

IF they use F1 technology on the turbo which is what the McClaren uses an electric motor on the turbo. The electric motor will keep the turbo spinning at speed so there is no turbo lag. THis was described in one of Jay Leno's videos.

 

so the only issue is sound

 

He was wrong. The P1's electric motor fills in the torque deficit untill the turbos spool up. That's because it is a hybrid and can do so. None hybrid Maccas don't have such a system and nor will the new 458.

 

My dealer basically told me that we are not seeing the coupe till mid or late 2016 in Canada. So I am not sure what the details are around this car but we are a ways out still. With the Speciale editions just released I think we still have a solid year remaining of no new product releases for mid engine prancing horse.