Stradale or Scuderia

OK... I don't understand why some Scud owner insists that their OPINION is the right one. the scud being faster is not being contested. However, some folks like the overall feel of the CS more, for any number of reasons. They can buy the scud or CS and ended up buying the CS.
I have a Lexus. It is less expensive, slower, and less exciting than a Ferrari. I drive the Lexus a lot more than the Ferrari. That must means Lexus > Ferrari? My answer is they're are both better in different ways. I don't see Lexus drivers insist that F cars are inferior b/c Lexus are OBJECTIVELY better in almost all situations.
I don't understand why some folks insists that others' opinion is wrong and only theirs is right.

 

After about 10 years these limited production cars begin to settle into long term ownership with people who haven't financed the cars, don't need to sell them and as a result fewer and fewer good cars are available at any time. As result, prices rise - simple supply and demand. Same thing is happening with Ford GT, BMW Z8, etc. Likely to occur with Scud as well but my sense is there is still an active market of buyers who want to experience the cars and aren't necessarily long term holders.

 

For the same reason some CS owners insist their OPINION is the right one - We are all passionate about cars!

 

Well, after all we ended to my point from my first post. The CS is more rare car than the Scud and that is a fact. So if the buyer just needs an investment, then maybe the CS is the better choice. But if he needs performance entertainment - the Scud is the obvious choice.

About the Scud owners - of course their opinion will be right for them (us). After all - I think the Scud is the better car and that is why I have chosen to be a Scud owner

And of course I think my opinion is the right one, but I don't need to convince anyone. We are just making a chat. After all - this is what forums are for

 

Alwin, what CS in your neighborhood sold for $120's? Are you referring to Hiro's? I don't follow the Scud market, but I have to believe on "average" Scuds are selling for more than CS's as their "average" prices seem to be consistently higher. However, your statement, "There are rare unique extremes that a CS sold for over 160k" is incorrect. Sure, there are CS's that have recently sold for less than $160k, but there are also several cases in which CS's have sold for over $160k. Ask your buddy Brad about a customer of his that recently made a $160k+ offer for a CS. Don't you know the guy from SF that bought that black with aftermarket stripe from Ferrari of Seattle last month; I was told it sold for over $160k. The Canna di Fucile CS also sold last month for over $160k. And a well known yellow with factory applied stripe CS sold two months ago above $160k. Those are just the few that I can quickly recite without even looking at my notes. Not too mention, CNC just listed an 11k mile Rosso Scuderia CS with aftermarket stripe for $189k, which WILL sell for over $160k. F of New England also recently listed a Rosso Scuderia CS with a painted stripe for $169k that I suspect will sell for over $160k. Gooding & Co. just listed a Rosso Scuderia with factory applied stripe that they will auction off in January with no reserve starting at $200k.

2004 Used Ferrari 360 Modena Challenge Stradale at CNC Motors Inc. Serving Ontario, CA, IID 12942226

Used 2004 Ferrari Challenge Stradale For Sale | Norwood MA

2004 Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale | Gooding & Company

Now here indeed a few rare unique extremes... over this past spring and summer there were at least 3 CS's that sold for over $200k; all 3 owners are Fchatters.

 

I just bought a CS so maybe my read on the market has some relevance especially since I was considering a CS, Scud or Speciale.

I considered the merits of all the cars suggested and in the end I went with my HEART (design of the car and visceral nature of it) - something I suggested to the OP of this thread way back on page one. Buy what makes your heart happy. In my opinion the rest of the debate is not relevant.

A less than 15k miles, well serviced and clean CS non-factory-stripe is easily over $160k right now, and they are only going up and not just because of the overall lifting of the tide for sportscar values. The reality is:
- There will be no more naturally aspirated V8s - the future is turbo and regenerative hybrid. This helps CS and scuds.
- There is lots of speculation about the post Luca era - again, helps CS and scuds
- The CS was the pioneer of the streetable track car model versioning
- Driver skill needed versus the electronic helpers that are dampening that experience on anything 458 or newer

All of the above made me decide that I would regret not buying a CS if the right one came along, and i've had many chances to buy great CS's as low as 120k in the post financial meltdown of 2009. Whatever the price of a CS is next year, I knew I would still want one.

Ask any informed person about the CS market and they will tell you to act fast or miss out, and I agree 100%. I closed a conditional deal on my car in 10 minutes on the phone - if I hadn't I am certain that I would still be looking for a CS to call mine.

The upside about the rising prices is that it is helping great cars come unlocked that normally wouldn't. Maybe there is a chance that a CS bought today will be a good investment - who knows and who cares - I don't buy cars for investment, I buy them for that emotional impact you get every time you walk up to it with key in hand and no particular destination to drive to - that, as they say, is priceless.

Happy shopping.

 

Well I guess we know which one is better looking
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Good data.

I can tell you what my sales guy from Ferrari of San Fran said earlier this summer - Michael Deeb. He told me that they were seeing overlap between the scuds and CS in terms of market value for certain cars. In other words a desirable CS is going to overlap some with the low/mid end of the scud market. There are scuds moving a fair amount in the 150-180k range I believe; and that jives with an overlap in the 140-170k range.

 

He paid 149K for the nero Andrew.

Canne de Fucile sold for 155k last i checked? I could be wrong, but that's what I was told.

like I said 120-160 seems to be the typical range for CS, which is still lower than the 170-200 scud range. Just talking to someone else's point of how CS' are selling for higher than Scuds, which again is innaccurate....not debating if it's worth less or more, just highlighting the math.

As applies to the both, asking is not indicative of actual sale price, but is a good indication of demand / supply. Also, for whatever reason, some owners are not very forth telling of the actual price they paid...dealers r more straight up about it.

 

The only thing I have ever paid attention to is the price gap between the two cars. Initially the Scuderia was $100k plus over the Straddle. (Back in 2008/9). Both cars fairly quickly tracked down to a $50k gap and maintained that for several years (at least when I was watching the prices). Again this is "Average" to "Average" cars.

My guess is that the gap is still narrowing but by very little and of course as others have pointed out there is some overlap. My guess is that the gap is $30k to $40k ish?

 

Damn you auto correct. S T R A D A L E

 

if it is apples to apples, at least in terms on where the steering wheel is located, then in the UK for a RHD example, the RHD Stradale is valued more than a RHD Scud......
from how i see it, the price there valued/asking from the highest to the lowest is like this:
RHD CS>RHD Scud> LHD Scud>LHD CS

 

Keep in mind that the price gap between the normal 360 to CS is a lot bigger than a standard f430 to a SCUD..

Shows the CS is a much improved car over the standard version imo. They are going for a bigger premium than a scud.. It's holding value better.. The scud MSRP was in the 300k and CS was around 200k.. CS still retains 75-100% of its original MSRP whille sCUd has retained ~50%+. CS is a better investment so far but we'll see in the next few years..

 

CS base MSRP was 200.
Scud base MSRP was 260.

And technically, only "a better investment" if you bought it new at the MSRP.

 

I talked to the former owner of that black CS and being told it sold for over 160k. Also told the new owner took delivery then wanted to return it. LOL!! CdF sold for 165k last I checked; prior to that in the upper 140k's. I think the real avg for a CS is closer to 130-170k with a couple outliers in the 120k's and a few above 170k. Based on asking prices for Scuds I would think they're averaging more like 180-210k. And of course there are instances of price crossover between the two cars; low mileage CS vs high mileage Scud.

 

If u bought a "USED" Stradale in 2010 you just made a nice chunk of change.. I haven't seen scud prices do the same (yet). ( referring to USA pricing) .. Many will agree the CS have bottomed and are now increasing $$.. now waiting to see if the scud follows this trend.

 

149k new owner told me as such and he's close in the circle so i believe him.

CdF was at SF Sportscars, listed at 179 last year. sold for 150s (last time i heard of it), didn't realize it's up for sale again. I know because I bought the unobtainium oem Ferrari 4-pt harnesses from said owner and also witnessed them removing the aftermarket stripe and re-applying a new clear bra over the entire car before shipping it out to new owner.

again not sure why some folks aren't forthcoming about the actual prices, but it is what it is.

 

Ask owner of nero CS why he wanted to return it. LOL!

As for the CdF CS, you've been out of the loop, the 155k price you referenced was from May 2013 when Brad had it; I would know, it ended up in my garage. Then it was sold to CNC Motors and they've sold it twice since. CNC was asking 209k, then most recently 179k (in 2014). Here's a pic I posted back in 2013 when it arrived. And you're welcome for the 4-pt harnesses, I sold those to G.

So tell me about this 120k CS w/ aftermarket stripe that sold in 'your neighborhood'?
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where's jason1st?? he has made a chunk of change on his CS as he bought at the bottom of the market.

 

I bought my CS in October 2010 for $120K. It had 10,500 miles when I bought it. It now has 16K miles so it gets driven regularly by Ferrari standards.

I keep it parked in the bottom level of my high rise parking garage. About 30 feet under ground. Muahahaha!!!
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Prices for RHD CS & Scud in the UK are pretty level although top Scud is £220k and top CS is £200k.
6 months ago the CS was definitely above the Scud so the market has moved around recently.

 

Very beautiful. I haven't seen a CS in that colour and especially stripeless!

 

It's a really nice color (true one-off) on the CS and definitely better looking sans stripe. Non-red CS's look great.

 

I'm not surprised. Seems like there's a demand stateside for Scuds. Definitely think Scuds will also be collectible. One of the last of the naturally aspirated, Luca-era, raw as heck cars that is the real deal. Hope Scud prices stay afloat as it'll help CS prices as well.

 

Nice man! You ripped it. Glad to hear you're driving that whip. Is that yo' G-wagon?