... revisionist sentiment flourishes @ McLaren ~

McCheatin F1 team and Ron D are so toxic that everything and everyone they touch is corrupted. There is a reason why Hammi and Alonshole left. Fred has now returned to the scene of the crime for $40 million big ones. Now that's integrity ...gangnam McCheatin style. It surprises nobody who has been paying some attention.

I feel sorry for Button. He seems to be a good guy. Guess he really really needs a ride. Sigh.

 

you feel sorry for button driving for McLaren? that's weird.

 

No Steve no Steve get a grip... do not......It's cold here Pete..

 

Don't see it either. Never really felt sorry for a guy that gets to drive F1 cars every other weekend, let alone one that gets paid 8m to do so.

 

There are obviously a tremendous number of posters here that missed their calling as team managers and drivers that, in working closely with God almighty, would have never made a mistake or a poor decision in those racing roles. So I am assuming that they all have perfect records in their 'chosen' professions, and their children are all successful perfect citizens and do what they are told.. 8>)

 

I'm pretty sure Ron held him there. It was reported at the time, iirc. Some folks wouldn't hear it though. I'm pretty sure this is one of the mistakes Dennis is talking about.

Exactly.

 

Memory fades, but wasn't it Alonso's engineer holding Alonso and it was infact Ron who was shouting angrily on the radio that Alonso should go?

 

What I recall was that Lewis refused team orders to let Alonso past to set a flying lap for qualifying. When they came into the pits Alonso deliberately staying in the pits (after the lollypop was lifted) to not leave Lewis enough time to change tires and get back out to sent another timed lap. Ron was really pissed and ran down to someone from Alonso's side and told him to take off his cans and go.

 

Yup.

 

Button and hamilton get along amicably now. Hell, hamilton even thought button was trying to let him through in a race this year and they collided.

Of course any top tier driver will have disagreements with their team mate if they are competitive. It's the lower tier drivers like raikkonnen/massa/vettel (this season at least) that roll over and take a pounding from their team mate/ give up when their car isn't competitive that are the ones who get on better with team mates. If you don't care about being second fiddle or not winning all the time the you won't have disagreements.

Look at all the good drivers; Schumacher, senna etc. alonso hamilton too.

Point is; huge difference between having disagreements because you want to win and being destructive to the team. Senna is the quintessential example of this. Some of alonsos actions have also been destructive. Jenson won't take anyone's **** most of the time but is always a gentleman. He sometimes concedes slightly too much though but better than some of the others

Are you referring to hamilton saying nico isn't german? Be specific...

If so then that was long after Monaco. Nico set their disagreements in motion by his actions in qualy. Nor was he particularly apologetic about lewis not getting his lap in. He just acted like an arrogant tosser

 

Pot kettle black.

 

Are you trying to call me an arrogant tosser in a way that keeps the mods happy? Might as well just go out and say it. Doesn't bother me. In fact I prefer directness

 

lol

 

From the person that proclaimed ''I am always right'', I'm sure you know the answer to this.

 

Reminds me of the one about the lady that went to see a doctor who told her she was "overweight". She reacted badly and demanded a second opinion. The doctors colleague came in and told her she was fat and ugly

 

Well, getting away from Rodney Dangerfield jokes and back to the OP, Ron may be right about Hamilton's immaturity level of the past, but I don't think it was all LH for discord between McLaren and Alonso.

 

Top and bottom of it, Alonso was not prepared to have a teammate that was allowed to race him. RD let him race him, and that's besides the fact he could match him, in pace.

Alonso himself has stated as much, that Hamilton is the one he rates the best.

 

Here's what BBC Sports top F1 correspondent has written:

"On the day of the row in Hungary, McLaren's then managing director Martin Whitmarsh tried to persuade Dennis to sack Alonso immediately - before that weekend's race. Yet, some years later, Whitmarsh admitted he did not at that point have all the relevant information and when he did, he was more understanding - if not forgiving - of Alonso's actions. The issue at the heart of the problems within McLaren all that year was Alonso's demand for the team to focus their title challenge on him, rather than split their efforts by giving team-mate Lewis Hamilton equal status. That was true to McLaren's long-stated ethos. But Whitmarsh later discovered that when Dennis signed Alonso he had indeed promised him priority status, only to go back on his word."

This seems to me quite consistent with Dennis' comments today.

 

There's rarely ever one person to blame when any rift occurs. Think of how we all were in our late teens and early 20s, then add in being a top level race car driver entering F1.

It's extremely petty for Ron Dennis to even discuss this at this point. Don't point your finger unless you're standing in front of a mirror.

 

Dennis is doing the best he could do (of course not "pour le sport" but for his team): blaming a scapegoat who no longer is around there.

 

Agree, but very important points need to recorded:
1. The in public fight was started because Lewis broke the qualifying TEAM rules. This resulted in the go swivel comment to Ron. Alonso's reacted to this initial move by Lewis because LH had completely unfairly screwed Alonso's qualifying.

There is no denying that this was 100% caused by Lewis.

2. Alonso had signed a contract with McLaren for number 1 status. Whether your team mate is as fast as you, or even faster, it does not matter the contract has been signed.

Now if Ron wanted to reneg on this contract he should have talked with Alonso and sorted it.

Conclusion: Ron really handled this poorly. He should have immediately got on the radio to Alonso at Hungoraring and said leave this with me, we will change a gearbox on Lewis's car to punish him or something. Sorry the team is mightier than the driver.

And if he wanted to change his mind on Alonso's contract he should have officially sorted it.
Pete

 

+1

 

And that is why personally, I'am not a fan of team orders.

 

LOL - I think this section should be modless, personally.

Maybe f1 will turn into football....
ala Richard Sherman
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7UPXzHShpc

 

actually, it's one reason why they're essential and need to be obeyed!!

You'd be howling like a baby with gastro if Nico hadn't obeyed team orders this year.