360 Challenge Stradale, F430 Scuderia, 458 Speciale, F355 "???"

The Challenge Stradale, Scuderia, and the Speciale were race-themed street-mannered versions of their standard, tamed, and more "sophisticated" counterparts. If Ferrari began this series of race-themed street cars with the F355 instead of the 360, knowing what we know now, can we speculate on what it will look like, feel like, sound like? What exterior features, interior features, performance features would it have had? What features would you like to see? Possible renderings? Specs? What would it be called? And how good would it be compared to its successors? Your thoughts ?

 

F355 Challenge
In 1995 Ferrari introduced a race ready F355 Challenge model for use specifically in the Ferrari Challenge.[4] The Ferrari F355 Challenge model was created by starting with a standard Ferrari F355 Berlinetta model and modifying it with a $30,000 factory-to-dealer supplied kit. The initial 1996 cars came with cage mounts factory fitted and carpets removed, each year the cars arrived with more and more race parts factory fitted, culminating in the 1998 full evolution cars which were supplied as virtually complete race cars though parts such as the rear wing still needed to be fitted.

The kit initially was more substantial than the 348 and the engine, gearbox and shock-absorbers were sealed with special tags to prevent unauthorised modifications. The kit included the following components/modifications:[5]

Competition steering wheel
Loud and quiet lightweight exhausts
Rollcage
Racing seats
Safety harnesses
Fire extinguisher
Engine cutoff switch
Manual radiator fan control, upgraded fans
Upgraded 14" Brembo brakes (F40 type)
18" Speedline magnesium wheels
Pirelli racing slicks
Solid suspension bushings and competition springs
Front and Rear brake cooling ducts
Challenge black rear grille (halfway through the 1995 season to get extra air through the engine-bay)
Lightened front bumper
Front and rear tow hooks
In 1996 a rear wing was added, and a competition clutch was made available. [6]

The F355 Challenge shares the same engine performance and physical dimension specifications as the original. 108 were produced, all with the 6-speed transmission (except for 1 that was equipped with a F1 gear box for a handicapped client). There were 18 RHD cars imported by Ferrari UK and modified by MHT. Some of these rare cars have now been converted to be street legal. Each F355 Challenge has an emblem on the rear that specifically denotes 'F355 Challenge'.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbmGiyxEMXA#t=15

 

The challenge is an extreme race version like 360, F430, and 458 challenges. That's different than a Challenge Stradale, Scuderia, and Speciale, which are street-mannered variations.

 

They kinda did with the fiorano.

 

The Serie Fiorano gave us some hints as to some of the interior accessories we could've seen such as carbon door sills, and carbon instrument surrounds. Suspension spring rates were beefed up a little, but I do not know the exact rates. It wasn't much as far as I can tell. A race-themed version would need more than that. The Fiorano didn't even have sports seats. Still a tame car imho and probably doesn't outperform the standard 355 by much if any.

I would like a discussion on what spring rates Ferrari wouldve chosen. Perhaps some middle ground between the standard (180lbs) spring rate and the Challenge (1700 & 2200 lbs) spring rate.

 

It would probably be similar to the sport suspension package offered by Rob at Deltavee which is what I have on my car. Revalved shocks and hyperco springs. That plus more aggressive alignment settings and new suspension bushings has transformed how my car handles. Highly recommended.

 

I believe the inspiration for his sport suspension package was Serie Fiorano damper and spring specs?

Did you get brand new oem bushings or after-market bushings?

 

Wow! If you drove that on the street, your dentist would have to recalibrate your fillings.

 

It actually wasn't very extreme at all other than spring rates, but they made street springs for them and they were the last of the challenge cars that were street legal (able).

 

Yes although his sport suspension package is not a one size fits all. He customizes the damper & spring specs based upon what you are trying to accomplish. I went with a set up that is a bit more aggressive than stock. Since the vast majority of my driving is on the street I didn't want to compromise ride quality. Firm but comfortable, handles fantastic. I can't remember the exact spring rates but my set up is as follows:

Ride height -134mm front, 140mm rear measured at chassis
Camber - -0.8 front, -2.8 rear.
Toe - +0.5 front, +2.3 rear (each wheel so total toe is 1.0 and 4.6).
Corner weights -763 left front + 911 right rear = 1674, 698 right front + 971 left rear = 1669

I went with the Superperformance bushings.

 

I like to think of my 348 Serie Speciale as part of that club. It was one of the converted Challenge cars combining both of the rare editions in to one very pleasurable 348 to drive. I have been tempted to strip in back down to a race car but can't bring myself to do it. I think it is near perfect as is.

A mix of the Fiorano and Challenge would be equally great for the 355.. With sport seats of course.

 

I don't know too much about the 348 Serie Speciale to comment. Perhaps that was Ferraris first attempt at a race-themed version, but they decided to skip on the F355? I also agree it would be some hybrid between the Fiorano and the Challenge.

What i meant by extreme (most likely relative) is certain track-mannered features that might be over the top when trying to build a sophisticated race-themed street-mannered car. Knowing what we know now, Ferrari did not put roll cages, GT wings, pure race bucket seats, and aggressive front add on splitters to the CS, Scuderia, or the Speciale. What we know they did do to improve downforce over the standard models is redesign lower profile, edgier front and rear bumpers with bigger air flow openings. They slightly modified sides and added a more profound rear diffuser. I just thought it would be a cool idea to discuss what this might have looked like. Perhaps some fun renderings posted. It's sometimes nice to imagine what could've been.

Some CS models were equipped with Lexan windows. I thought that was pretty neat. I'm not sure if any of the windows/winshields on the Scuderia or Speciale are lexan, but the 355 challenge didn't come with any lexan.

Will it be F1 or Manual? I assume since they chose manual for challenge cars, they would've chose it for the race-themed road car.

Would the front and rear brakes specs have been identical to the Challenge at 355x32 front and rear or would they have chosen a less aggressive spec? Perhaps 330x32 front and rear?

We still don't have a name for this car .

 

The serie special was basically just an appearance package. The 348 gtc is the hot ticket in the vein of the cs, scud and Speciale.

The name you're looking for is 355 challenge . Just leave out the roll cage, though the cs was available with one in europe,so not out of character. The original 355 challenge had no wing,it was added later on in the series ('97 maybe? ).

 

I didn't realized they added a wing that late in the game. Almost every 355 challenge ive seen has a GT wing. Leave out the roll cage and GT wing and we've got a standard 355 with cloth bucket seats, a big brake kit, and one hellava bumpy ride . What weight did a fully equipped Challenge clock in as btw?

 

A GTC would have been great if offered in the USA.

Most of the 114 SS came with carbon sport seats. All should have had the tail light upgrade, front lip, wider track wheels and the better gearing of the spider. They should have installed the Challenge springs, bushings and steering wheel at minimum.

I think Serie Speciale and Serie Fiorono are fine names. Even though they should have been equipped with more.

 

I think they were around 2850lbs, race minimum weight was 3050 with driver iirc, hopefully somebody with the challenge documentation will chime in with the exact numbers. That would put them around 200lbs lighter than a standard gtb.

I haven't seen too many that are in challenge spec any more, even the cars racing in the ccr appear to have further modification than what they were originally allowed. I think Barry's 355C is very close to original challenge spec, though in the later winged configuration.

I believe ferrari also had street springs for the 355c, so those would be the springs to use. That or fiorano springs.

Fwiw, the '95 355 challenge is the last Ferrari you could buy and both race and drive on the street legally, at least in the us. Europe may have been more lenient as they didn't mandate obd2 in '96.

 

I agree the 95 355 is very special because of that loophole feature. I was looking for one for a long time. i almost cut a deal with Gatorgreg for his black one, but he changed his mind last minute. I don't blame him. I do view the challenge car (at least his) as more of a track car than a street car even though it could be driven on the street. I would've had to make alot of changes to get it to a level i would be comfortable taking a girl out on a date, going to a restaurant, or a weekend heading towards Vegas etc... Ferrari certainly capitalized on this trend towards more sophisticated race-themed street cars and if they had the opportunity to do that to a 355, how would they have approached it was what I was getting at.

i have a buddy who lives in San Francisco who also has a yellow road legal 355 challenge. Doesn't really drive it on the street. A lucky few here who do seem to have one, dont seem to enjoy driving it in the streets.

A side question. My buddy claims his outer door panel is made of a composite material on his challenge car. Did challenge cars come with a light weight composite outer door panel? I couldnt find any solid info on that. Im assuming his is after-market.

 

yep started with the 348...not 360 CS

 

I inquired about gatorgreg's car as well, but his had modifications over the original Challenge configuration. I ended up getting a 95 car that is close to 98 spec but not beyond (steel doors, not aftermarket composite). Though I intend to take it to the track in 2015 and eventually race in a vintage class, I've only driven it on the street so far. It does fine for me with its well-damped suspension, but may be too stiff for most street drivers.

For your street version speculation, I think the items that would have to be retrofitted to my car are: AC, lightweight adjustable seats, airbag, street seat belts, headlights and slightly softer springs. Of course, the front part of the roll cage needs to be removed.

 

I have those high rate 355 Challenge springs available if anyone's interested

 

That's right, Pete. My car has all the standard Challenge parts with the exception of the transmission oil cooler upgrade. The headlights were reinstalled as were the interior door panels and heater core. The A/C was never reinstalled but the HVAC control unit remains and comes in handy to operate the vent fans on a hot day when I'm waiting for the corner worker to signal me onto the track.

It has the upgraded 2200 lb front and 900 lb rear springs and the front shock mount reinforcement finally done in 2013.

How are your repairs holding up?

Barry

 

My 95 Challenge car was raced in 96 and 97 (2nd place overall in 96), then was prepped for 98 (added rear wing and gearbox cooler) but not necessarily raced. Input from subsequent former owners indicate that the car was used only for practice and track days afterwards. As a result, the car seems to have not been modified since its 98 prep. Our ongoing engine out service plus some other things seem to collaborate the car's state. So it can be more usable, we are also adding back the headlights and hooking up the HVAC blower.

 

Repairs are holding up perfectly so far, but I don't have as stiff springs, mine are H&R progressive rate springs. The car seems to have good body control even with dot-r's, so not sure what the reasoning was for the challenge cars to have such stiff springs unless it was to give the drivers better feel.

 

I'm happy to hear that, Pete. That was some piece of welding you did that day. It's amazing how thin the sheet metal is up there on 1995 cars.

What Pete and I are talking about are the thin, weak front shock mounts on 1995 cars. The 2200 lb springs and Challenge shocks cracked the mounts. Ferrari corrected this in MY1996 and used thicker sheet metal in those areas. Ferrari made bolster cages for the 1995 Challenge cars. Mine never got that update whch resulted in cracks appearing on the driver's side shock mount. Classic Coach fabricated the parts and welded them in as per the 1996 Challenge manual...
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