Official Countach Value Thread

THANK YOU. I mentioned the pause/cool off awhile ago. Totally agree and absolutely necessary for long term health.

 

but the black FI countach fetched good money or are you guys saying that sale was also soft?

 

Half full or half empty? 600k to 742k? 350k to 390k? 115k for a Urraco? 467k for a state trooper bumper QV?

If anything these numbers add more stability to the market.

 

So the U caught up. Specifically for the CT, if we were still appreciating at breakneck as before, that would have easily been a 500k bid car. No I would not call it soft, I would call it correct for what it is in this climate. At previous trajectory, Tahiti even with it's history should have been a sale no matter what, but it wasn't. Look at the macro factors, Euro buyers are pretty much out because the dollar appreciated so much against it, and a lot are getting smashed by oil. Even if your portfolio is ok, hasn't attitude shifted? I think so. Have all those anniversary cars moved at their asks? No. Again I'm not saying soft, I'm saying pause.

 

That was an extraordinarily low mile car.

 

Yes, that justifies at least a $150k hit....no!

The car should of netted the seller $700-$750K to be market correct IMO. I think it could of been sold for that many times in the last 4 months but the seller figured he'd score at auction and get more.

The other Tahiti car that every body loves that traded a while back was not perfect either when I saw it after it sold, so there is always some thing to pick on.

Geno

 

I think that was a good deal for the buyer. Condition and originality is everything on these cars and that one had them both. Where are you going to find a nicer more original QV if you wanted one ?

 

Pure speculation.

The fact remains that the car high-bid at a number that would have netted the seller @ $600k. The current market has spoken.

 

I'm not sure the "net to the seller" on an unsold car tells the whole story about the market. For the market to truly speak there needs to be a sale. And even then there are anomalies high and low. What we had was no willing seller and buyer meeting minds. What we know is that the most anyone in that room would have paid "all in" for this particular car, this night was about 700 plus (don't know the all in cost at that figure).

What we know for sure is the car didn't sell. If I was the buyer I would be calculating not just what the car cost all in at the auction but also what it would take to get the car right. (A lot) given this the high bidder is understandable. As a seller I think it would have dawned on me I made a mistake of sending the car to an auction and expecting a world record for an imperfect car. As such the high costs of an auction nets him less than maybe he could have otherwise.

In any event Im not sure there was anything dramatic in Scottsdale up or down, but rather more confirmation, across all marks. Lesson is buyers are picky and educated at current levels.

(That said two of my old cars sold at about a 500% increase since I sold them in 2009, and that makes me feel ****ty)

 

Peter,

Nobody bad-mouthed this car. Nobody poisoned it. That may be a subjective matter of opinion, but, it's not a fair or accurate one.

What people did is to speak the truth about its status and/or condition.

And, the market agreed. It got what the market was willing to bear.

That's all.

Perhaps there is a lot of denial to go around, and its time for a renewed value list.

 

I agree with Joe. Nor am I certain that 700-725k or whatever it was all in is the result of bad mouthing the car. I think the only point is if you want to push a million bucks for a CT other than an LP400 it better be close to dead on nails perfect.

 

I should also say, I respectfully see where Peter is coming from, after all, he is an S1 owner, and the biased emotional viewpoint of Countach owners in any Countach values discussion is obvious & undeniable.

But this also means that owners with vested interest cannot often be totally objective & unbiased as regards current market values & trends. This phenomenon has been part of the problem with values in the last year or two, hence my denial reference. I fully understand and expect that a Countach owner is going to see it the way they want to see it.

But the results are not a matter of opinion, they are a matter of fact.

 

At long last I have gone back through my old issues, and I found an issue late 89 where Prestige alone had 11. Through 89/90, just in that named publication, there were anywhere between 28 and 46 available in any given issue. So who knows what figure were available overseas not published in DuPont. Point is, there was a long period where there were FAR more advertised for sale than we see today, or what your memory serves. Hell, considering Prestige, Autoputer, Toy Store, Ft Laud Collection, Don L Leasing, etc, there were as many available JUST IN SOUTH FLORIDA, as there are available globally today. Snapped a bunch of pictures of the ads if people are interested. That memory vault must be full.

 

I'm a longtime countach owner and I wish the market reverses. The cars I have would be worth less but so would the cars I'd like to have. I'd prefer values to go back to where they were. As a car enthusiast as I see it I'd be better off. I paid Bobileff 12 years ago an amount that was three times the cars worth. For me personally I would prefer the market to tank and go back to when you could buy a lp400 for 150k, an SV for 220k and a 288 GTO for 350k. Now we are ten times the value and I hate it becuase to rebuild/ build the collection I want costs a genuine lot of money.

I'd prefer it no one liked these cars but me. And I find the recent market escalation to be awful, because I want the cars for myself. I'd prefer it if my tastes were unfashionable. And yes that viewpoint too is selfish.

 

+1, that's the point I defended so many times vs market escalation done by speculators & auction houses !

Yes I'm pointing auction houses too.

If you consider a normal commission of 3 to 5% for an agent offering you a house, why an auction house is authorised to to take 10 to 15% fee on seller + 10 up to 20% on buyer fee ? If you take Artcurial for instance it is 15% & 20% = 35% margin on each sales, is that not insane ????

Why is this tolerated or why is this not officially limited by a law/rule ?

 

yep.I think the euro guys are squeezed out and also the russian guys. the euro will further fall so it will be interesting to see what the oil debacle aftershocks will do to the auto market in 6 months. It is shaping up that the only man standing by then looks like the US buyers unless he is in the oil business..

 

I totally understand you! There is a car i wanted for a long time and I cant buy it because owners think it is worst gold and it is not even a highly thought of car. They expect you to show up with cash , buy now and just shut up about discussing the car. Their attitude: if you cant just buy it silently, I aint dealing with you..(the cheap b.st.rd label syndrom)

The key now is to find cars you like and are a temendous value. For that you have to move out of the 80s and before cars but they are out there. Some, wich have the hallmarks of future icons, are unbelievably cheap and 15 years from now everyone, like for the countach, will look at todays price with amazment.

 

+1.

Look, I absolutely can't complain: I have been able to pick up many great cars while I could and the ones that weren't right for my long term ownership I've sold to make room for others or are selling now at good prices. That said, I am bummed to have missed the 288 GTO boat, although I am not sure that I would give up any of my keepers to add one. At this point, I am paring down my collection to my four favorite cars and will try to add a few cars as the opportunity arises and there is definitely another Countach in that mix.

It is better for us car guys when prices were where you suggested. Think about this: 10 years ago for $1M you could have a garage with a 288, F40, LP5000S, and 2.7 Carrera RS. If only I had made the money I make now back then...

 

I believe it to be an auction world record price for a Quattrovalvole!

 

It's funny to see people complain when prices are low, but also when they are high and as a collector I can see and argue both sides. I say enjoy what we have and hope it never matters. It is interesting to follow, however.

FYI - The Tahiti Blue S1 is listed as sold on RMs website at $725K.

 

I am fairly sure the consigner yielded a minimum of $700k with the auction house settling on a $25k profit. Which is way more than what they make on certain tight deals and still get the deal done. I know this first hand.

Geno

 

Given the fact that there was still strong interest in the room at $625K bid, it sounds about right.

 

I work with my own current realistic price guide, which makes my life simple. I update it as the market goes along. If there was interest I would consider publishing it here for the sole purpose of helping anyone with a vested interest in the cars.

 

Huge interest...