Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

I'd concur with this.

 

It's safe to say that the Ferrari is the fastest and most exciting of the three and that's what really matters at the end of the day.

 

It's about 100-150 kg, depending on spec, heavier than LaF or P1(real world, not fantasy claimed by Ferrari or McLaren), which is an excellent achievement considering it has by far the biggest e-range, 2 electric engines, 4 wheel steering and a removable roof.

 

Nearly 2 'tonnes'? 3650lbs vs 3450lbs P1 vs 3375lbs LaF. Not too bad, considering. 918 Battery is 300lbs, LaF is 125lbs. That's most of the difference right there.

Real life, not propaganda.

 

Maybe you didn't get the memo but the rules of this thread mandate 20% fact vs 80% propaganda. Please adjust your future posts accordingly as you are throwing off the balance in favor of fact.

In an effort to attone for your transgressions I will add this "fact", future tests of these three monsters will reveal that R. Dennis was correct and the P1 is a game changer...by far the fastest of the 3(especially the P car, btw the P stands for pig.)

 

With a full gas tank a customer P1 weighed in at 3,411 lbs and a, also with a full tank of gas, a customer 918 weighed in at 3,775 lbs.

So your "real life" results somehow decreased the Porsche's weight by 125 pounds and increased the McLaren's weight by 39 pounds.

 

These photos were taken at the Boardwalk Ferrari dealership in Dallas (Plano) of a customer car. This same car showed up to Dallas Cars and Coffee this past Saturday.
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This Porsche 918 Spyder showed up at Dallas Cars & Coffee this past Saturday and looked stunning but got only a fraction of the attention the yellow LaFerrari (above) got... No P1 was present this time.
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Good grief! Cry. Depending on spec and particular car. There was a customer WP 918 that weighed 100lbs less than your example. Point is Jack, P1 is not the 500-600lbs lighter YOU ALL were certain it would be. Dreaming thinking P1 would come in 3000-3100lbs. And that would be the only way for P1 to outperform 918. Counted eggs before they were hatched. Reality and FACT is P1 not that much lighter where performance is greatly boosted over the 'fat pig'.

 

Sweet. Thanks for the pics.

 

Wow P1 is heavier than I thought. I would have guessed/ hoped full fluids it would be no more than 3,200 lbs.


Any thoughts on where LaFerrari's weight is?

 

Yes, the propaganda called for P1 and LaF to weigh between 3000-3100lbs when both parties were shouting from the mountain tops, and the fanatics reached the conclusion that the 'pig' would not stand a chance. Foregone conclusion based on just the weight alone! A few of us here had the response from the movie 'Super Troopers': "I'll believe that when me **** turns purple and smells like rainbow sherbet". Per Mac: 'we've built the best car in the world. without equal on road and especially track'. 'Throttle response as good or better than the best natural aspirated V12's in the world'. Etc, etc, etc, etc. Reality is quite a bit different. Awesome car, but not the 'game changer' or 'world beater' that was touted. Err..not quite.

 

Seriously? why? No way no how these cars were going to weigh that. Ben's LaF came in at over '1500kg'. really, a bit under 3400lbs. Depending on configuration, it weighs nearly same as P1. Even numbskulls like myself know better than to believe Ferrari's 'creative' interpretation of weight claims.

 

Have any customer 918s been weighed? So far the only customer cars I've seen weighed are two P1s which were just either side of 3400lbs.

 

Hey guys, does anyone know how much costs special colors like Ben's Giallo Tristrato and that mindblowing Nero DS Opaco? 50k? 100k?

 

What you say makes sense but the Trofeo's are an option on the P1 just like the Weissach Pack is an option on the 918. If you were purchasing a 918 and were going to track it regularly you would probably get the Weissach Pack. Similarly, if you were planning to track your P1 regularly you'd spec it with the Trofeos. Having said that, it looks like the 918 may have beaten the P1 at Laguna Seca even though the P1 was on Trofeos. If this is true then I would say it is checkmate to the 918.

I do agree that McLaren underestimated the importance of mechanical grip in developing the P1. Haven't heard a single cogent argument for why it is on such narrow tyres. Even the P1 gtr is slower than the gt3 car because it has narrower tyres.

 

I doubt anyone has spec'd the Trofeo's as standard equipment for the P1. They would have ordered them afterward for track days - they are definitely not daily drive tires like Corsas. The problem in comparing cars is that this type of substitution leads to a slippery slope - why not just put full racing slicks on both cars? When Christophe Tinseau set the production car lap record for Le Mans in the 918, he said that if he had racing slicks on the the car, he would have shaved 5 seconds off his time. But in my opinion, the new time would not mean anything.

Because these are not racing cars, this chicanary with tires takes away from true comparison testing. Since no one would ever race these cars against one another on a closed circuit, it makes little sense to compare them on racing tires. Put it another way, if new track tires come out for each of these cars does that mean they have to be retested? I would say no.

 

McLaren is a world class engineering company, AND with a long tradition of racing, I seriously doubt they actually underestimate the importance of mechanical grip.

The truth is probably closer to the fact that they have already maximized the mechanical grip on the 12C platform with the P1, but they knew it wasn't enough and they added a good chunk of aero grip on top, hoping that would be enough. And their back up plan is to certify the sticky Trofeo R tires as the optionals just so they can make up more of the mechanical grip deficit.

I actually admire the performance of the P1, it shows what a great engineering company McLaren really is. They have squeezed every last drop of performance out of the 12C platform and the results are spectacular, just about on par with the purpose built bespoke offering from Porsche, in certain parameter it actually exceeds the 918.

As for the comparison of the Trofeo R option vs the Weissach pack option, there are a higher percentage of buyers picking the Weissach pack than buyers picking the Trofeo R, so it's not really an apple to apple comparison.

Anyway, the number I heard whispering for the Laguna Seca H2H, the difference was around 0.8 seconds.

I know Ben, aka treynor, had said something different about the data before, but if the 0.8 second difference stands, I am grabbing my popcorn and enjoy the torrent of excuses that surely will be flowing for quite a while.

 

I completely agree. McLaren's engineering prowess is great, in fact, it is ranked only slightly behind their propaganda/excuse department in terms of competence.

 

Porsche's biggest advantages are 4ws and 4wd.

Aero grip is complete nonsense on road cars, even if they managed to achieve manufacturer's claims, tyres and drivers are the limiting factor.
Plus, with 1.5+ tonnes of weight, tyres will be destroyed extremely fast if you apply signigicant aero grip. Racing cars which largely rely on aero grip are at minimum 300 kg lighter snd use slicks..

 

Really? I'll have to tell our engineers that the 3G's of mechanical grip we pull in our race version is useless.

 

your car is much lighter and, in the race version, uses slicks.

I was speaking about road cars a'la P1 and 918.

 

Mechanical grip is very important for turns at speeds that are too low to bring on much aero grip.

Road tires are very good these days. P 4/5 C on road tires even with it's race car levels of mechanical and aero grip gets several track days and about 4K overall miles.

Our road version will be a good 1000 lb. lighter than any of these which as you say will make a difference.

 

I never said any such thing.

 

Mark, do you have both the Trofeo's and the Corsa's for your P1 or just the Trofeo's?