Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

off topic but pointed. i'm also looking forward to the 991 RS, should be another stormer...nevermind the cost factor. it will be exceptional even when 'value' is not considered.

 

we are over 800 pages and counting. many of us have been posting in this thread since day one...and it has NEVER been this bad as far as 'explaining' is concerned. This really is the last and mother of all defense when it comes to P1 losing a battle. Even when 918 once again proved to be quicker car, great pains and even greater lengths are gone to to 'prove' the 918 is the lesser car. Simply staggering endeavor by our latest troll.

"yes, 918 lapped quicker...BUT look at the telemetry...it is a useless one lap wonder, t is slower by the third lap, it has stickier tires which explains the 'slow' speed grip (but really no credit is given to inherent superior chassis design and packaging of weight), it has a more familiar driver, it has fairy dust pushing it along, it has , it has, it has, ..." FFS!!!

Ron and co massively massively massively underestimated Porsche...and much of that belief...errr...'attitude' dyed within ye faithful, and was similarly taken by Ben into the comparo. He really really believed P1 would lap quicker than the Porker even with him behind the wheel. Must have been some kind of wake up call when things didn't work out that way. Been looking for reasons ever since.

 

I am not sure they underestimated Porsche, but rather, Ron just shot his mouth off, which is the crux of the problem. McLaren marketing is also very unclever by half.

I know Ben and he is no apologist for McLaren, let alone any other brand. He is very data driven.

And, he is a top tier Ferrari owner re-defining what the 1% means (of Ferrari owners)

 

I love that Ben tracks his cars, and drives them as they were meant to be. I just took exception to his 'conclusion' that MPSC2's are as sticky or stickier than Trofeo R's rather than even hinting at the fact that 918 makes better use of its setup., particularly 'non aero' sections of the track. It has a lot more mechanical grip built in vs. P1 (918 CoG and packaging of parts weighing more than 100lbs is exceptional...all down very very low and in between the axles).

Reminds me a lot of the latest MT track battle between Nismo GTR vs. Z06. All the Z06 fanboys are irate that it got beat so comprehensively on track, despite having the stickier tires vs GTR's tires and GTR being much heavier, less power, older chassis, etc. Belief was that there is no way GTR would be quicker like that. The car simply does more with what it has. Part of the reason GTR lapped quicker was its ability to launch so much harder and sooner coming out of corners. Lots of little things added up (such as ZO6 aero drag at high speed vs downforce it needed), but that was a biggie. Very interesting track battle. In the end ZO6 was deemed much more enjoyable to drive despite being slower. Not surprising.

 

I see, I missed a lot of action earlier!? LOL

Nonetheless, keep the Hits and Popcorn coming!!

 

Wow.

This is just embarrassing for all the members of this board.
I have a proposal for all the people who respect their time here - every next post of this person and his other personalities TO BE QUOTED WITH "IGNORE".

 

And now...

After all the bashing and leaked DATA regarding depleting batteries of the 918 and mainly after reading that Laguna Seca is slow for the P1, bla bla... I decided to look back at a track, which even Mycroft/LMFAO/Emo, etc. preferred for the P1 - Big Willow.

Same driver, same magazine, probably same car.
BW is 1.23m track, LS is 1.29m track and fast enough for the P1 (Emo The Great said this ).

So... three screen shots from the hot lap:

Pic.1: just before the start/finish line - 88% battery charge.

Pic. 2: let's see what happens in the middle of the lap - 72%

Pic. 3: finish line - 65%. Wow!!!

So, without being mathematician like some others:

88-65=23% loss per one HL.
OR MORE THEN 4 (FOUR) HOT LAPS WITHOUT CHANGING MODES AND IN THE HANDS OF A PRO!

Good luck to Lmfao, Treynor and all the DATA carriers, who believe, that 918 will deplete in a single lap.

That's what a call real life TELEMETRY
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The thing is that the P1 would loose charge as well after a few laps pushing and go into a slower, more recharging mode automatically. It's like it's always in hot lap mode even if its one might last a little longer.

 

Just out of curiosity, how can you tell what mode he's in for the BW test? Isn't the mode indicator on the right screen that's blocked by the steering wheel?

 

Its ok Scud, at least the 918 is a very fast car for one lap

 

In all fairness, this record lap is a combination of RH and HL mode, as it should be. But good example for all, who think that HL is a given and on/off switch.

This car is designed to use different modes on different sectors of different tracks.

 

Mate,
he posts to himself and answer's his own questions.....

 

Can the car be in auto in a any mode? It doesn't look like her ever pulls the paddle.

 

All the cultists keep silence, so I will give another strike

Let's move back to LS and put all these people to shame:

First attempt of Randy at LS and another record. Just in relevance with the times at their second h2h with Treynor's P1- 1.29.xx/1.30.xx.

1st pic: before start/finish line - 81%;

2nd pic: somwhere before the middle - 71%;

3rd pic: finish line - 57%

So, 81-57=24% loss in 100% hot lap mode (Treynor stated that at the second test Porsche insisted on HL only, so we have to believe him

23% at Willow, 24% at Laguna? Anyone want to use the word "consistent" once again?
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600kg at 156mph.

Max. load per tyre on the P1 is 1,819lb rear and 1,433lb front for PZCS and 1,874lb per tyre for Trofeo R rear.

Car weighs ~3,300lb + 1,322lb downforce = 4,622lb. Max. weight supported by tyres is 2,866lb front and 3,748lb rear = 6,614lb.

More half-cocked bollox from you it would seem.

Pirelli*P Zero Corsa System

Pirelli*P Zero Trofeo R

 

Dear me.

It depends where on the straight you look at the charge. Even in the 3rd lap at LS, the battery will be charged at start of the straight but it is running out of charge halfway down the straight, hence why the curves start to trail off around 105mph. So your photos prove nothing, only the telemetry does.

You need to look at the lowest charge points on the lap. If the lowest charge point on lap 1 is 10% and you lose 24% over a lap starting from 100%, then charge will bottom out on the second lap part way down a straight. Try to understand things before jumping to conclusions and posting.

This theory has been proven wrong infinity times over. P1 did 15 laps at LS with only 0.3s variance. Another owner lapped Spa and battery charge lasted longer than the tank of fuel did.

 

This has to be the most over analyzed and nerdiest thread on FerrariChat...

 

Its totally insane. First we were talking about three hypercars, and now it is about tires. Each manufacturer put on the stock tires that were best for their cars (two chose Pirelli Corsa, one chose comparable Michelin PSC2) and now someone is whining about their favourite car's tire selection. They should get over it.

 

Do you understand my chart ?
Do you undrestand the vertical size loading is almost equal for both cars ?
What a nerd.
Below the chart complete with transfer load due to lateral acceleration.
If really the P1 turn a 2g (press release) needing all the 600 Kg of downforce, its CoG height have to be at 0,16 m from the ground, or rather more than 50% lower than one's of 918 Spyder.
If not the tires will be overloaded.
Lol 0,16 m from the ground !!! the right heigh in race mode is 0,08 mm
Do you smell the real BS right now ?
Have a good evening my dear, pop-corn waiting for me
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Not really no. You seem to be talking a combination of gibberish and bollox.

At low speed a P1 can turn at say ~1.4g with Trofeo with vehicle weight on the ground. increase weight by 40% due to downforce and because Friction = uN and N=mg, you can make 40% more.

Why wouldn't CoG be lower than the 918? Race Mode lowers car, car is lower in height. Besides that there's a whole ****-load of things you're not considering here, assuming we're even talking about the same thing. 75% total load on outside and 25% on other whilst corner. Basically you're putting numbers into a program you don't understand.

Please write out the calculation you think doesn't work longhand, otherwise it's difficult to see where you think there's an issue. You're essentially trying to prove the P1 can't do what it's already done, go!

The real BS is Porsche kidding everyone that there car is fast with 2 minute stints.

 

Wow.
Welcome to your own trap, buddy!

Which straight you want, buddy?
Truth is, you was used from Treynor as a napkin and soon is the time to understand this in the hard way....

So, which straight you want?

 

The telemetry tells you all you need to know anyway. You can see the acceleration tailing off. Have your debate with Treynor, it's his telemetry. We can debate all day about charge and how it works but at the end of it, the result is those 3 traces. It may well be that the lowest charge limit in HL isn't what you think it is. There may even be other factors at play but the traces are what they are. Go accuse Treynor of lying if you wish.

 

Tomorrow is your day, Treynor's spokesman
Better things to do now...

 

Lamefao,
Please don't EDIT your opinion 10 times after your first post. This just show how desperate you are...

 

What I did notice is that charge is falling off faster as charge levels get lower. Lower voltage, more current needed for same power, faster depletion. I notice 54% at 1:02:42.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg1fY1fVYNk

Here you go:

Li-Ion BMS - White Paper - Estimating the State Of Charge of Li-Ion batteries

So P = VI. When charge is near full, voltage is high, near 430V, and less current is required, as it discharges voltage falls rapidly at first and much more current is needed, so discharge rate increases for same power. After about 40% charge is reached, voltage drop off is exponential and discharge is very fast. By about 20% charge, minumum voltage (285V) is reached and recharging is needed. So basically it'll use charge much faster on the second lap, depending on exact voltage-charge profile.
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