how to value a car where the owner did the major themself

No, the back yard meaning inside the pool. This way when you unbolt the cradle the engine floats to the surface. (And gets a free degreasing)

 

I think there's a big difference in doing a major service Dyi and doing the annual fluid changes as a Dyi.

I personally have learned to do the fluid changes as well as anybody. For a engine drop belt change, I send it to a professional.

The fluid changes are really about the same as any car. I have six toy cars and the process on each, Ferrari, Porsche, Alfa Romeo are all basically the same.

Once your talking about timing belts with interference motors, the risk increases exponentially and I don't kid myself concerning my abilities. It's all about knowing your limitations and being realistic about them.

My personal reasons for doing the fluid changes are enjoyment, saves a lot of money, I know it's done correctly, and my car will not come back with any damage, ie scratches.
No one will treat my car as well as I do and any future owners will benefit from that

 

I agree with you, its important to know your limitations, however this in no way reflects on the many DIY's who have the skills and confidence to perform timing belt services, not only on a Ferrari (which is a rather simple/basic design technology wise) but on any car.
Its not rocket science, after all Its just a car.

 

Exactly this....

 

" ferrari north america diy tech hotline , how may i help you ? "

" ive got a tick in my motor and i dont know what to do about it. "

" well a tick is usually associated with improper valve adjustment "

" no , i'm doing a major in my backyard and a tick jumped out of the grass and into the motor , will it hurt anything ? "

" click "


1994 ferrari 348 spider , third owner purchased may 2013 w/ 27804 miles

 

I think the key thing is "would you provide a 12 month warranty on your work"? This is what you get when you pay the premium of a dealer doing the major service. Without a warranty on the work a DIY service does have much less value.
I didn't read all 200+ replies, so this may have been pointed out earlier

 

A fresh DIY major would scare me as a buyer (PS. I plan to do my own). Yet one done 2 years ago wouldn't, as that suggests there weren't any huge ommissions...

 

There is some inherent conflict, or hypocrisy in that sentence...

 

You have been here since 2011. I hope you didn't just now notice that.

 

putting a bunch of miles on it afterwards is the Quality Control Check. Chances are if something got messed up it will manifest itself in short order.

 

It may or may not have been but there is far more than a warranty that defines the difference.

Some here refer to fluid changes and feeling comfortable doing them at home. In close to 40 years I have yet to perform a fluid change. It would be a service of some level and would involve a great deal more that just replacing fluids.

 

Seems pretty clear to me, if you plan to sell your car in the next 2 years and it's due for a major at some point in that time span, pony up for a pro major as it will net you $2000 or so more. Otherwise if you don't plan to sell, why give it a second thought?

That said, those that say they'd never touch a DIY car are silly. They're the type that care more about odometer readings and stacks of paper than the actual car - ie the type that we don't want owning these cars anyway. They're the ones that rub it with a diaper, take it on a stately drive once a month and then tell everyone what a paper tiger it is.

You want the best car, buy the best car. Hint: the paperwork and odometer won't tell you which one it is. It might give some clues, but actually looking it over, driving it and taking it to an expert (if you're not comfortable) for evaluation will tell you which is better, not some numbers and papers.

 

I suspect a lot of the opinions here are colored by whether or not you have access nearby to qualified independent technicians...

If you do, and the costs are reasonable (all relative), most would use the service if available.

If you don't, then DIY is more attractive...

 

12 month warranty? For real No. The reason is I do not run an officially licensed repair facility in the state of Michigan.

 

Actually no.....there are Ferrari dealers and plenty of garage mechanics around the country.
There is a question however ....if some garage mechanics should be trusted however....as not all are created equal.
I can afford to have the best service for my car at the local Ferrari dealer however I choose to do ALL the services/repairs myself because I have the ability to service any car.

Its just a car after all.....nothing magical here

Lets not make this more than it is folks.

 

I've been saying the same thing since 2011.

 

If the work is done by a reputable and known shop / indy, i would value it higher as long as the owner acknowledged what issues to take care of. If done by a diyer, it better be someone reputable on this board or I will have to set aside some extra emergency cash. Another $10-15k. Maybe more if F1 .

 

Been thinking about this one for a long time...here's my best answer:
Buy a car from a guy who loves his car. If a coupla grand either way is gonna make or break the deal, you're buying for the wrong reason anyway. Some guys love their car by taking it to the best service facility available. Some guys love their car by being involved in the turning of each nut and bolt, enjoying the elegance of Ferrari's design and workmanship-and their own. Both guys are going to pass on excellent cars. Talk to the guy and find out what kind of owner he is, either way. Pass on the posers. The rest is just paperwork.

 

good people are getting harder to find, "qualified" people are dime a dozen...

 

The silver Berlinetta F1 owner that has been trying to sell his car forever stated publicly here that he doesn't like anything about the car... And would rather drive all 6 other masterpieces that no one believes he actually has. So prime example there.

Pick the way you enjoy the service process the most. Everyone will be happy. I would hope that we can all respect the differences. I agree that you should buy from a very knowledgeable owner who loves the cars...

But don't ignore pricing realities. You are lying to yourself if you discredit what real world buyers go for or will pay MORE for.

I have some rock chips, hit really long road trips, and have never held a diaper to wipe it, but it looks as good today, and performs better than the day delivered new in Boston. And I like the history and full records. They go along well with the smells of leather and oil...

All types. We are all tifosi. I like all you guys, your cars, and your choices.

Robb

 

Robb, you like the history and paperwork, but it seems you like finding the history and paperwork just as much. It wouldn't have been nearly as entertaining and,I imagine,as much fun if your cars came complete with the history instead of you having to track a lot of it down.

My point was more that while history is good, it's not the main point of the car. The main point of the car, is the car. I would buy the better car every time, regardless of the history or paperwork. If it's a tie, yes then I buy the car with a better history (which could include who did the maintenance), but that is rarely, if ever, the case.

It also depends on what you're after. If what you want is the nicest, fully documented 355 you can find, you can worry about things like who did the maintenance etc. If you're very specific on the options you want, that kind of thing falls to the bottom of the priority list because they're just aren't enough out there (unless you're after a red spider, then they're plentiful).

I had such a tough time finding a gtb 6 speed in yellow that didn't have issues that who did the major was less of a concern than how well the car ran and it's current condition. If I had dithered, I'd probably still be on the outside looking in, and I certainly wouldn't have the exact car I wanted ('95 yellow/black gtb with challenge grill). My car had a recent major by a decent indy when I got it, but if it had been owner done or dealer done, it wouldn't have had much effect on my purchase decision. I cared that it was a 6 speed, yellow and a gtb with bonus that it was a '95 with a challenge grill.

 

It's just a car, you make it seem like it's a Toyota or a Honda.

 

No, they are probably better, but I will never own one in the states, I had both when I lived in Japan.

I couldn't find any Ferrari's to buy on Okinawa.

 

Pete! All good. I wasn't retorting, I promise. You have good points and a great car. And the good news is - LOT of winners here that got to pull the trigger where many are too scared to go.

I agree. The trump card will always be the car. They are fantastic.

And for those out there that have never bought an F-car before or are not mechanically blessed - they can only go by someone they trust to help them. Even finding someone to do a PPI can be daunting to the new buyer. So a combination of all the things that have been covered can help them along with those of us that can try to point the way.

Robb

 

I think he is trying to say that in a physical / mechanical / realist sense it is just a car. Many can't take the emotional side away from a Ferrari.

When you peel back the mystique and decades of propaganda you'll probably see a car; internal combustion engine, gear box, 4 wheels, etc. Being run by 20 year old tech.

Today's Toyota or Honda can be much more complicated to work on then a 355.

I know it's hard to take the emotion out these cars and even harder to see through the fog of propaganda pushed by Ferrari. A company trying to keep it's dealerships alive on small volumes of cars they had to say the car required their care or they would have went bankrupt. But I promise, no magic wands or pixie dust is needed to do competent work on these things.