Euro vs USA F40 in the States

While there are exceptions to every rule I would say the euro F40 typically has more miles (kilometers) on it than a USA market version. Price is often driven by the mileage especially on the USA model F40.
Maybe Joe can comment if USA F40 prices have softened in the past few months as the 288 GTO by comparison continues to climb. There was never a USA version of the 288 GTO built but there were more of them built than the USA version F40. More GTO's available but at a much higher price now than the original 125k USD. The F40 in the USA sold for a million dollars or more as people tried to get one new in the resale market.
There is also the question of a 1990 1991 or 1992 version USA F40 having a further effect on the value. Some like the last year of production better even if there is no valid reason for that choice.

 

I think serious US buyers will always pay a premium for vintage US Ferraris. Little things like speedo in km, missing safety equipment, wrong lights, wrong muffler etc take away from the nostalgic enjoyment and could be missing points at shows. iMHO this is more important than having a faster and lighter car. Of course if the car was only available in Europe this would not apply.

 

Historically the USA has been the major market. Since there are typically fewer usa spec cars and the cost to federalize a euro is high a premium usually exists for usa spec versions.

As the model gets older and the requirements for import expire the prices for euros and USA spec cars begin to converge. In the case of the f40, they converge to the upper bound. In the next 3 years the remaining 1000 or so euro specs will be over 25 yrs old and I have wondered how much of an effect it will have on values.

Is a USA car more desirable than a euro spec? It will depend on the buyer. Personally I prefer the euros. They have a little more power, a little less weight, they have regular seat belts instead of the horrible mouse rails, they have the proper carbon race seats and they don't have the extra third brake light, reflectors, and extended chin. If you find a really early one they have the sliding windows as well which I think is cool. A euro is the purest form of the design. It is as Ferrari intended.

If you get in on a euro early there is also a bit more upside potential as well.

The downsides are mileage and the fuel bladders. Personally I prefer higher mileage cars since I use them regularly and they tend to be a bit healthier with regular use. Condition tends to be good as well for many cars of this class so I tend not to use mileage as a proxy for condition. Fuel bladders need to be replaced but there are shops that can reproduce the USA spec tanks so that is not an ongoing issue either.

 

In addition, there are different types of Euro F40s. There are the "light" ones with the sliding lexan windows and hollow doors. There were only 50 made like this and are the most desirable as they do not have catalytic converters nor the trick suspension. I have such an example and the car weighs just 1100 kgs

There are the "cat" cars and the "cat" and trick suspension cars (least desirable ones over here)

Yes you have to change the fuel cells every 10 years, but that is not a huge deal.

As to mileage, a 25 year old car should have miles on it. The more you use it, the less trouble it will give you. I would never buy a low mileage 25 year old car and especially not an F40!!

I have seen F40s with more than 100,000 Kms and still going strong. Mine has 35,000 kms and still the original turbos.

 

So many questions, yet to be determined in time in an ever-evolving market.

I tend to take things on a car-by-car basis in terms of provenance, condition, miles etc, whether they are Euro/ROW or USA cars.

I recently sold a very special USA car to a USA resident based in California. A California-based buyer can only buy a USA car if he wants to use it on the road, for example. The rest have the option of Euro/ROW or USA spec.

There are also clients who have a collection of USA cars (F50, Enzo, La Ferrari etc) and want a USA F40 to compliment the set.

It all depends on the buyer's location & preferences.

 

All things being equal (condition, mileage), I don't see why Euro cars get dinged here in the US just for being Euro. I'd rather have a Ferrari made the way it was intended to if it stayed in its hometown in Maranello and not some added on bits to meet some non-Italian governments regs. I think the Euro bumpers and lack of side and third brake lights look better anyway on the F40 and F50 for that matter...just imo.

 

Generally agreed, but I think Peter's point is valid in today's market, the 50 or so Lightweight cars with sliding Lexan windows with no catalytic converters or adjustable suspension, are very desirable. Ive been asked by several people just to be on the lookout for those, and that's a good measure of interest. Yes anything can be modified, but the market always prizes pure originals, and there is an endless list of makes & models that underscores this notion.

 

I agree.

The F40 was not made by Enzo with the idea of having mickey mouse seat belts, side marker lights, and the black rubber bumpers.

I was living in Germany during the debut of the F40 into the European market and after having seen the Euro F40s for years upon returning to the USA saw a US spec car and thought what an ugly bastardized version of an otherwise perfect car. Personally I would buy a Euro car over a US car any day.

 

Anything can be done to any car! All you have to do is look at some of the atrocities that pop up occasionally on this forum (cf the wide bodied 458 for the Gumball)!!!

However, the chassis number will reflect exactly how the car was produced and without being "materialistic" this is a material issue especially in a car whose value is so strong,

As others have pointed out, the original had no cats, no trick suspension, full harness and racing fuel tanks - that is the original. Can't change it!!!!

 

This is exactly the point, it is a material issue.

As values have become stronger, it has become more important to F40 buyers to find one that remains as it left Maranello. Their thinking is that they don't want to mess with greatness, and they'd like to receive a car just as the original artisans built it, and keep it that way as a nod of respect to them. I see this more & more, and it seems to correspond with higher values.

 

You started a thread asking questions stating that you are "Interested to know thoughts".

People are giving their thoughts.

Mine are based on my day-to-day experiences as a professional who specializes in these cars full-time. I am not biased one way or another as I'm happy to deal with USA or ROW/Eu cars of any variant, I'm simply reporting what I'm experiencing in recent times.

It is a market fact that as values have become stronger, it has become more important to F40 buyers to find one that remains as it left Maranello, and it is true that the 50 or so Lightweight cars with sliding Lexan windows with no catalytic converters or adjustable suspension, are very desirable, and therefore more valuable. The fact that Ive been asked by several people just to be on the lookout for those, is a good measure of interest in my book.

Without advocating one variant or another, its interesting to see what buyers are wanting, and I'm simply sharing those thoughts.

The market is often illogical, and people often want the 'pure original', even if it has less 'bells & whistles' than a later variant.

For example, in the Lamborghini world, why do people pay 2 or 3 times as much for the pure original LP400? I can't answer that question, but I know they consistently do.

The same is true in the Ferrari & Porsche world.

 

Again, we are all just responding to a thread you started asking for input, so if this is something out of nothing, why bother starting the thread?

As far as production F40s go, there are several different variants: Eu/ROW with sliding plexi-windows & hollow doors/no cats/no lift kits, widely accepted as the "Lightweight" version, then there are the solid-door & glass-window/cats/lift kit F40s, then there are the USA-spec F40s, so there are really 3 different variants, not counting those sent off to become LMs. All F40s did not leave Maranello the same.

My point with the Countach is an easy one to reconcile and is seen over & over in the sports car market - early pure cars are often the most valuable.

 

I'd take any F40 -- all beautiful, BUT... I think the original marketed version was the one with the sliding plexi windows, and early journalist reviews definitely flagged the difference in weight between the euro cars and US cars, and the roll-up vs. sliding plexi variants.

One question... I know from a review ('90 or '91 R&T, I think) there was speculation that the US variant cars had more HP, despite the emissions systems. The number I recall from memory quoted was 515 vs. 478 bhp... Any truth to this?

Also, how many Euro cars were spec'd with the evoluzione engine option (I think there was an option to get 600+bhp from factory)...

 

I think you're absolutely right.

But I will never, ever understand it!

FWIW I've got a US car in Europe, with all the US (and some of the European) junk thrown in a skip somewhere! hehe

 

Agreement.

 

True, its not speculation.

John Amette, the West Coast USA Ferrari Classiche director who was part of the Ferrari North America team working on the Homologation process for the USA version F40 circa 1988-89 has confirmed this several times, and will still do so today.

 

They do.

Here are the differences:

1. USA production spanned from early 1990 to late 1992. Chassis numbers to follow (European production started late 1987).

2. USA F40s weigh in at 2878 lbs dry. Actual USA F40s weighed by FNA with all fluids and half-a-tank of gas weighed in at 2969 lbs (European cars are stated at 2717 lbs dry).

3. USA F40s have aluminum gas tanks with twin fuel pumps mounted within the tanks (European cars have rubber fuel cells which require replacement each 7 years with externally located fuel pumps ).

4. USA F40s have twist-off gas caps (European cars have the locking items).

5. USA F40s were all supplied with the variable ride height system deleted (some European cars were thus supplied).

6. USA F40s have 2-peice seats with reclining backs and a passive restraint system (European cars have single-peice seats with 3-point seat belts).

7. USA F40s have their tow-hook attachment mounted directly into the chassis (European cars attach to the front body).

8. USA F40s have a final drive ratio of 10-29 (European cars are rated at 11-30).

9. USA F40s acheive maximum torque of 58.8 kgm/427 ft lbs at 4300 rpm (European cars acheive this same torque at 4000 rpm).

10. USA F40s are rated "at or above 500 bhp" @ 7000 rpm (European cars are rated at 478 bhp at same rpm).

11. USA F40s were the first car to utilize metallic (titanium) based catalysts to allow faster warm up and greater resilience.

12. USA F40s have a 'secondary air injection' for emissions that can be heard at each start up.

13. USA F40s had to pass DOT front, rear & side impact tests. These include the 2.5 mph front and rear tests. Accordingly the bodywork is strengthened.

14. USA F40s have a drag co-efficient of 0.34CX including the rear wing (European F40s are rated the same).

With respect to the gear ratios, please note the following differences:

First gear - 1:10.707 (USA), 1:10.069 (Euro)
Second gear - 1:6.628 (USA), 1:6.262 (Euro)
Third gear - 1:4.745 (USA), 1:4.463 (Euro)
Fourth gear - 1:3.724 (USA), 1:3.501 (Euro)
Fifth gear - 1:2.965 (USA), 1:2.787 (Euro)