F1 gearboxes:white elephant of the future?

Most will get the car that they really want soon. One that drives itself so they can take selfies and play with their goofy little phone while travelling to their destination. A manual transmission takes skill that when perfected brings enjoyment that a car that a women can drive wearing high heels will not not.

 

I see the value of manuals rising with all super/exotic cars since they: 1. are not being made (exception: GT4) and 2. nostalgia. Depending on your age .... people like to revisit a younger time in their lives. Many of those memories are cars with manuals. For fun .... remember the Three on the Tree. Four on the Floor. Muncie rock crusher trannies.

 

Flappy paddles take no skill to operate. A properly timed, perfectly executed heel-and-toe in a 3 pedal car takes actual skill that very few drivers have, even many seasoned track junkies. I am more involved in the driving experience when I'm working 3 pedals, and that experience is more rewarding. If the Kia Rio is the last 3 pedal car offered on Earth, I will be driving one.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, "I doubt any man here is smitten with the idea that his wife is well-pleasured, if another man is doing the work.".

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

Yes f1 style single clutch transmissions are headed.to dust bin similar to sportmatic and valeos. They are clunky on auto mode, wear out quickly, and are expensive. Dct is the way to go. Great at al tasks. Stick shift is niche item like turntables. Std torque converters are the problem. Driven all the best new 8 speeds and all suck when using paddle mode. They need to go away with sct

 

To me, the F1 superfast in my Scud and the rawness/feel it brings to the car will never be outdone by any Manual or DCT transmission.. period. Some may feel that the manual is something special in a Ferrari.. but you can buy lots of manual gearbox sports cars. F1 superfast shifts? Euphoric and unique, and worth the future price of maintenance IMO.

 

Totally disagree.

DCT's are boring in a Ferrari and while give the fastest shifting option, they totally remove you as a driver from the feel of the car.

I don't feel that the F1 is a bad thing in the Scud- Have you ever driven or been a passenger in one at wide-open throttle when it shifts? Between the sounds and the hard-hitting shift, it FEELS like a race car. Worth the price of the car IMO.

As far as F1 reliability, the only issues are when someone doesn't know what they are doing. My Scud is 6-7 years old, original clutch, and it has 88% life left. And I can tell you, I don't granny it.

Enjoy your smooth, sterile DCT shifts, I'm keeping my Scud for life.

 

+1 That swift kick on shifts is just phenomenal. They got it just right with the Scuderia, and it still commands respectable performance even by contemporary standards.

It'll never be the fastest thing on the road or circuit, but it's fast enough and it just boils down to the driver and tires.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3GUma-IppU[/ame]

And lets not forget the sound...w a naughty exhaust the car sounds exactly like an F1 car:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3qfmJXnTLc[/ame]

 

I agree with you!!!

 

Guys, noone of you know the problems of new DTC on Ferrari that the dealer need to solve ... ..... you wait some years ....
DTC to repair is more more expensive .... but is good like that !

 

Not just the 430: try to find a 599-3 pedals or even a 612-3 pedals and the price premium will make your eyes water.

 

Way to go Dave (without the clutch I mean)
I am with you all the way

 

Terrible analogy. Life is not on the line, and almost none of us are truly racing where we need the few tenths that an F1 gearbox provides on each shift.

It's been two decades since I was an 18 year old speed junkie. Now I drive for the enjoyment of it, not to be the very fastest I can be.

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/general-automotive-discussion/356281-manual-transmissions-rant-i-vent.html

 

Exactly. 99% of these cars aren't daily drivers, they are for fun on the weekend etc., almost none of the folks who own them ever actually raced in a competitive series, so pretending to be a racer is more of an image deal. These car are for going out to have fun go quickly (not stupidly though), hang out with friends. They are not racers: too slow and not equipped for the track without some work.

Art

 

Most posters negative to the F1 are assuming they are more prone to failures, that parts are difficult to get and that they are much more expensive to service and repair.
Do we have any mechanics with extensive experience with the F1 to refute or confirm these?

The experience as a driver between the F1 and Manual is very subjective, that we can discuss and fight over ad infinitum!

 

I have a 575M F1. I could have bought a slightly older 550 with manual box for the same money but after trying both it was obvious that the F1 box suited a large V12 engine far better than a manual.

Yes, compared with a modern 911 with PDK box, the change is very slow and ponderous but under acceleration and braking the F1 system will still change faster than you could ever do in a full manual.

Each to his own but I would not pay £20,000 / $30,000 extra for a manual 575M.

However, if I were buying a 360 I might well go for a manual but not on a V12.

 

Unfortunately this is EXACTLY what Ferrari is trying to do with their car line -- turn their cars into daily drivers that would replace your Mercedes sedan.

IMO -- a mistake.

 

The California is one that I'll never own. It's a poor excuse for a Mercedes, and way over priced. Might get one for the wife, maybe, but not one for me.

Art

 

F1 gear boxes are indeed a liability. Actuators. Valve bodies. Accumulators. Many multiple points of failure. Lots of thing to go wrong more than just a clutch like the 3 pedals cars.

 

You must be a Ford model T fan?
What I mean is that any modern car is hugely complicated, and every component increases the risk for failure, but that does nit stop us from buying them.
Compare a MB with a simple Daihatsu. Huge difference in complexity and technology, yet we buy MB....

The difference between a manual 550 and a F1 550 in extra parts is just a few %.

 

Amazing any of them make it out of the showroom..........................

Good job the same gearbox can't possibly go wrong in a 3 pedal car, nor have any hydraulic issues..................

 

Spot on. The first units produced ( of anything) will have a higher failure rate. Also any complex mechanical, electronic or mixed device will show problems due to failed components early on in the life span. Then the next bulk of failures will happen at the end of the designed life.
In between - the odd failure.
Each component is made within certain specified tolerances. The assembly manufacturer designs and assembles. The actual manufacture of the component is given to somebody that can produce the part to the design and within the given tolerances, for the cheapest cost.
Mostly the assembler specifies that a certain % of the units have a tolerance of, say, 98% +- 0.01mm.
Manufacturers like to stretch the tolerances, as it is cheaper for them to manufacture. But the assembler does spot checks of a certain % of the components, and if a higher percent than specified falls outside the specification, the manufacturer is either not paid, paid less or the whole batch returned, depending on the intended end use.

I know this because my father-in-law used to be the head Engineer at the Marine Division of AlfaLaval, Sweden, ( The division that make pumps and valves for (amongst others) the Swedish Navy submarines) when he explained why my AR Spider -91 had far more unexplained problems than my -89 SAAB 900 Turbo.

 

Certainly I'm no paddle fan but I think worries about parts availability in the future are overblown. They made enough of these cars such that aftermarket suppliers will be able to step in even if Ferrari does not. Modern technology has also made it easier to copy/manufacturer parts in smaller quantities profitably. This trend will only accelerate.

Dave