Time running out at McLaren?

Boullier admits time is running out for McLaren

Boullier admits time is running out for McLaren | FORMULA 1 news | Motorsport.com

McLaren racing director Eric Boullier has admitted that his team cannot wait much longer for Honda to deliver a turnaround if its brand is not going to get damaged by continued poor results.

 

What if, till the end of the season, they continue to produce results like this? How will that affect next year?

IMO Ron is regretting his 'comeback'

 

Had Honda performed like this last year, the beginning of the new formula, they would have been dead last as well. I think that they have been given some slack because they are a year behind. But, in reality, they have been pathetic, regardless what year it is.

 

Anyone expecting an upcoming turnaround anytime soon is fooling themselves. They (Honda) didn't pull out of F-1 several years ago because they were winning, but rather due to poor results which have continued in 2015. If they came back a year early, then whose fault is that other than Honda?

 

I think we should all remember that last year with Merc Power, Mac was never a contender. They were always mid pack and the last of the Merc cars on the grid.

There's something wrong on both sides of the planet. Sure, Honda is a major issue but you have to question why Mac couldn't compete last year while it had clearly the best motor on the grid.

 

Even more reason for Alonso to leave a sinking ship!

 

I think Ron Dennis is seeing how hard it is to build a car business and run a show biz sports team...

its hard to get the eye back on the ball. Honda's reputation from the 80's is completely destroyed by its own failure as a team in the early Noughts.

i remember when they came in to F-1 in 83 - they were a laughable ... it took till 85 for people to take them seriously. sadly Since Mr. Honda's death I dont think they have anyone powerful enough to keep it on track.

 

The problem at Honda is their mentality.

They consider F1 as an extention of their R & D department, more than a racing business.
Usually young engineers have to do a stint in the F1 laboratory and show their talent there, before being promoted in the road car side, having nothing to do with F1 later in their career.

Also, most of the decisions are made collectively, which slows down any change and stifles any personal initiative. But in the long term, that allow spectacular progress. Loosing one or two years doesn't seem to bother them, just like pulling out to regroup from time to time; they do with in F1 like in MotoGP.

 

Well, that should make Ron and Fernando feel better!?!?!?!?

 

I don't know what other options Ron Dennis or Alonso had.

The divorce between McLaren and Mercedes was consumed when McLaren refused to be taken over by Mercedes after it launched its road car production. Remember that both cooperated for the SLR before McLaren pulled the plug to revive its own sportcar ambition.
That's how McLaren lost the supply of Mercedes engines, but being just a "customer" didn't fit with Ron Dennis' plans anyway.
What engines were available? Renault? Ferrari? I think not.
So, a Honda return must have been welcomed.
Nobody knew that the gestation would be so lengthy and painful though ...

As for Alonso, after burning his bridges at Ferrari, he fancied a seat at Mercedes apparently, but unable to get one had to accept one at McLaren. Probably he never expected such troubles. Maybe now he keeps quiet and just wait for another opportunity, who knows?

 

I think Fred is pretty much done. His options are super limited. It's probably Red Bull, but they aren't doing too well either.

 

I am also rather pessimistic about his chances to relaunch his career at this moment.
Whilst Button's career is inevitably tailing off, Alonso still had a few years to go.
Between Ron Dennis, Eric Boulliez, Fernando Alonso, and even Jenson Button, I can see the frustration building up; this could end up in an acrymonious mess.
Honda has better achieve something spectacular and draw something out of the bag soon before the relation deteriorates.

 

Honda are a bag of **** and aren't going anywhere anytime soon. I like both Jensen and Fernando as drivers. Don't like Mclaren though.

I think Mclaren and Marussia will occupy the back of the grid for the rest of the season. The Mclaren car started to come good end of last year so maybe the aero isn't all that bad - especially, as a big team, they would have developed a lot over the break.

Renault have been trying for ages to fix their PU so I don't think Honda will be able to either.

 

I always said it would end in tears......

 

I thought it was the other way round. that Mercedes did not what to absorb McLaren? for the price Ron and Mansour wanted.

regardless they have a long way to recover. its a bit sad.
the absolute Irony is that Alonso - the $100M man is back with McLaren and they are not doing well. that is a smack of Karma if I've ever seen any.

 

Mclaren p1 never lived up to the hype and the F1 team is a complete farce. Ron needs to go ASAP. His best days are clearly behind him.

 

If ever someone deserved a Karma smack it's Alonso....

 

Serious question: How can Honda improve their PU if no testing is allowed? Is there much engine development by the engine suppliers once the season starts?

-F

 

Their entire season is now just one big test session! They can of course also run the thing on the dyno - Not as good as in the car, but right now I reckon that's the least of their worries......

As for development, this year at least they can due to the "homologation loophole" - They've all got a bunch of tokens left to spend on development. Hopefully, that'll continue to be the case next year too.

Further, I read somewhere recently that Charlie is being very "lenient" with reliability upgrades which don't count against the token spend. IIRC, many tens of reliability upgrades have already been granted without any objections from the others - "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" maybe?

Cheers,
Ian
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Mercedes had up to 40% shares in Mclaren and intended to absorb it to make it, among other things, its special vehicles dept. McLaren and Mercedes collaborated for the McLaren-Mercedes SLR. It's when McLaren announced that it wanted to launch its own road cars production that the relation soured. Mercedes soon sold its interest in McLaren to some Bahrainis, I think, canned the SLR successor, looked for another F1 team to buy (Brawn) and gave notice about ending the engine supply.

I think that Dennis and Ojhe always thought that the Mclaren Group should divert and enter the sports car market to capitalise on their F1 success, and also as a second string if one day F1 falters ...Even Williams had developed other activities parallel to F1. Frank Williams himself resisted a buy-out from his associate BMW, and prefered to stay independent.

I cannot say I blame them for resisting the temptation.

 

I expected this year to be a "throwaway" year where all track time would go to testing. McLaren/Honda is actually showing slightly better than I expected.

I'm not sure how anyone could realistically expect more than what they are showing. Current regulations have the cards stacked so against a new engine manufacturer, so much so that I am surprised any of them would even make an attempt to get into F1.

 

Time is literally running out in the sense that we are now halfway through a season and they only have five championship points. If they finish the season in 9th place they will be out a tremendous amount of money.

If they can turn the season around and generate a series of respectable finishes near the end of the season, even if only in 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th place, they will save a little face, but more importantly, climb above Toro Rosso, Sauber, Lotus, and Force India to claim a substantially larger share of the cash.

No matter how poor their performance might appear, with a reasonably reliable car they have what it takes to secure points over the second half of the season and move themselves up tremendously in the standings, salvaging what has been so far a disaster.

 

Let's face it, if Mclaren were facing a change of partner in the PU area, they were not going to spend vast amount of money developing a car just for one year.
I wouldn't be surprised if their 2014 chassis was mostly carried over from the 2013 one.
That's why they fell behind the competition probably.
They expected starting afresh with Honda and must have kept their powder dry waiting to do so.
Just a guess...

 

McLaren get $34 million in premium payment for just participating. That's if they finish 1st or last in the Championship (same as Mercedes). They do stand to lose some money if they finish at the bottom of the Constructor Championship, though. They got an additional $63 million for finishing 5th last year, versus Sauber's $44 million for finishing 10th. So, McLaren only stand to lose $20 million for coming-in dead-last. This probably doesn't effect them much, maybe 5-10% of their annual budget.

 

From where they stand now, and even with a huge improvement, it seems very
improbable to catch Lotus and Force India; they'll improve too. Perhaps Toro Rosso and
Sauber can be catched since they don't appear to be gaining as much and their drivers
are starting to show more rookie behaviour, which in a way is not so unexpected.

More worrisome for McLaren is that the longer it takes to make real strides this year,
the more impact will be on 2016 season. So it's not only writing down this year, but
next and all the negative publicity and lack of sponsors due to that will have more
implications financially. And remember having Alonso's salary (and Jenson's, 'cause it
isn't in rookies' terms) with these returns may not fair well with both McLaren and Honda.
For how long will they be able to keep him? And that's if he wants to stay.