Ric to Ferrari ... hmmmm...

Disclosure... I like Ric... I like Red Bull... but I'm also a realist and choose to see things as they are instead of how I want them to be. Sure Ric is a 3 time winner... but clearly each of those wins came at Merc's losing, i.e., crash, breakdowns, etc. I certainly realize attrition is part of F1 and a win is a win is a win... I get all that.

I think it's just a bit premature to elevate him as this megastar driver. He's done some incredible driving.. sure.. but so has Pastor at times and I don't see anyone clamoring to steal him a way. Oddly... I think it's Ric who seems to be talking about more than anyone. I don't know... I like him a lot... but I sometimes think he's got a bit too much belief in his own hype. He's subtle about it at least and he seems like a very likable guy.

He hasn't done crap this year and Kyvat has taken him to task on a pretty regular basis. I just think he has some more to prove.

 

Ricci to me was by far the best driver out there, he was far more impressive than both the mec boys....true this year he hasn't shown much but just as Seb last year, that doesn't say much to me...i don't rate Kvyat very high, and i believe that in a good car Rkicci would simply blow him away, right now they have to many problems to show anything...

 

MB braking down gets mentioned a lot because this guy embarrassed Vettel. Vettel fans get all excited when Kvyat gets in front of Ricci not realizing that it will make Vettel look even worse if DK beats DR this year. Last I checked Ricci was ahead of Kvyat in both points and qualy. Not sure where this Kvyat is beating Ricci is coming from except from disgruntled Vettel fanboys.
Truth is that Vet and Ricci drove identical cars and had identical opportunities. If Vet was ahead of Ricci then he would have benefited from MB's reliability issues.
People also seem to forget that Ricci did some spectacular passing last year, so it wasn't just MB's reliability that made him look good.

 

Well Fanboy is not something I've ever been accused of and to say that Seb didn't have significantly more woes than Ric last year is quite a bit off. I'm not saying the Ric isn't a great driver. I'm saying I find his hype a bit off-putting. He hasn't done enough yet in my mind.

 

We are all entitled to our opinions. However, you can't deny the fact that people keep bringing up these "lucky" wins and that they are imagining Kvyat beating Ricci. He might beat him this year, but he is definitely not beating him now.

 

By my count, DR qualified better for the first four races and Kvyat better for the subsequent five. Ricciardo has 33% more race points than Kvyat (the difference would be even greater if his mad dash at the end of Monaco had been more successful). DR isn't shining this year, but he's hardly being shown up by his teamate.

 

He has been shown up in the last 5 races. Hard to tell - last year in every race he got unbelievable luck. Every strategy and pit call always paid off wonderfully and his car was very reliable. That perhaps made him look a little better than he is.

That said, he also drove incredible last season. Greats aren't made over 1 season and he needs to show consistency. He dominated kvyat in the first 4 races but now he's been comprehensively beaten in the last 5 which will start to look embarrassing.

But if kvyat beats him all that will show is that Vettel isn't all that great and that kimi is downright terrible. With Hamilton and alonso in the ferraris the championship would be a lot closer

 

I think Ricci was a lot more motivated last year to prove himself against a 4x champ.
I know that should never be an excuse for any driver. He should be 100% against anyone.

Hopefully he stays ahead for the rest of the season.

 

Bubble bubble TOIL and trouble. That last statement is totally beyond any proof and has zero credibility. Alonso is great simply because everyone keeps saying so. To claim that Seb was just lucky to win four WDCs because he sat in the right car is no different then others claiming the same of Hamilton.

And I beg you...can we not turn this into yet another Louis is the Best thread? I was just voicing my opinion on Ric after reading several stories about him and him commenting on the Ferrari thing.

 

Ric would probably be better than Kimi at this point.

 

Again, "shown up in the last 5 races" is a bit of a stretch...

Spain: Qualy: DK 8; DR 10 - Race: DK 10; DR 7 ---> I give that weekend to DR

Monaco: Qualy: DK 5; DR 4 - Race: DK 4; DR 5 ---> Pretty much a draw, esp. considering DR had the pace at the end of the race to attempt a challenge while DK had nothing left

Canada: Qualy: DK 8; DR 9 - Race: DK 9; DR 13 ---> Weekend goes to DK

Austria: Qualy: DK 8; DR 14 - Race: DK 12; DR 10 ---> Nice qualy performance, but DR gets the weekend

Great Britain: Qualy: DK 7; DR 10 - Race: DK 6; DR DNF (electrical problem) ---> weekend goes to DK.

So...out of five weekends, two go solidly to DR on performance...one goes to DK on solid performance...one goes to DK due to an issue beyond DR's control...the fourth weekend is a draw...

Even with these bland numbers in black and white, neither one is heads and shoulders above the other...but, DR is well ahead on points. If one considers the on-track performance at the end of Monaco and a DNF due to an electrical problems, I'm going to give the lean to DR. Now consider the whole season, instead of just the last five races, and DR is still rightfully considered the team leader.

 

Without looking at the results, ricciardo has had a poor year so far with many mistakes... Kvyat is more or less matching him but seems to make fewer mistakes.

Anyone can have an off year however, and we know how spectacular he can be.

I doubt he'll be at Ferrari with Vettel, though....

 

I agree. Vettel needs to be protected from another embarrassment.

 

This...Kimi needs to go.

On a side note even though I doubt the cans would let him go if love to see if Ric can whoop Seb again.

 

Vettel has been driving the wheels off the S15T for the most part, and there's no way he was embarrassed last year. Ferrari was always his plan, Schumacher instilled it in him and we wants to win the next WDC in Red. To think there was any other plan is a bit foolish. The Cans car last year was suited better to Ricci, and by your logic DK is embarrassing Ricci, which I highly doubt is the case.

 

If you don't think Alonso is great by now you are one of two things: a hater or an idiot, pick one

 

DR and DK have a lot more in common than Ric and Vet. Plus DR is still ahead of DK this year.
Vettel is a 4x champ and should have never allowed someone with ZERO wins to come into his house and beat him the way he did.
I already heard all 1-100 excuses of why Vettel lost to a NOBODY, so you don't really need to repeat them.

 

Ignoring the better suited argument (I have no comment on it), Vettel was only 75 points behind Ricci last year, I say only because his car had so many issues over the season it was laughable.

Not denying the fantastic year Ricciardo had in any case, can't be bothered to do the math now but I think between them points would be very close if Vettel had normal reliability (IMO this is praise to Ricciardo's talent!).

+1

Whilst I never really denied Alonso's talent, last year really became an eye opener. Even if Kimi was focused on the 2015 car for the most part, Alonso was undeniably much faster. IMO Alonso is in the top 5 fastest ever F1 drivers.

 

Strong words. I'm pretty clear on both of us.

 

Full credit to you since I know you are far from an Alonso fan. But true fans of F1 can recognize greatness.

 

It's a pretty tough pill to swallow .

 

What makes fred so great he won a championship in a french factory car with Michelin tires and a last minute rule change to not allow tire changes in race . In 06 ldm didn't want someone to win another championship and leave with 1 plate . Fred has look just average sense he beat massa and kimi he never looked good in the wet . So mark me down as I'm a idiot uncle Ron the hater

 

Never looked good in the wet? What?

Hungary 06 (made up something like 15 spots in 3 laps and even passed MS on the outside, I will never forget that. Was an incredible move) Germany 07, Brazil 08, Korea 10, Malaysia 12 (Plus poles at Germany and Silverstone that year in torrential conditions), Brazil 12, Hungary 14

Alonso is one of the best in the rain and severely underrated in that department

 

So what was the excuse Hamilton was beaten by Button again? He should be 100% against anyone, especially when one thinks he is the best ever Button should not be a challenge...But as you might fail again to explain that it might be easier to have the next on the list you can talk down: Vettel....
So basically everyone winning more WDC than Hamilton (two so far) was crap for one or the other reason...What was the one for Prost? I might have forgot that but you and toil will certainly tell us soon. Senna...Check, Clark....Check, Schumacher....Check..., Stewart...Check...Fangio...Check....
Keep it coming, it is funny though....Keeps us entertained.

 

It's only in your world that Hamilton got beaten by Button. In the real world it was 2 season over 1. It was more wins, more poles, and a lot more DNFs for Hamilton. Keep telling us how Button won over Hamilton it's very entertaining.
By the way, I said motivation should never be an excuse. I did not say that they are all 100% motivated all the time.