Will there be a F12 "HGTE" Announced at Frankfurt in September?

We need an engine expert here to explain to us the future prospect of the Tipo F140 V12.

Pure speculation: it hasn't maxed out yet in terms of horsepower, but for the torque, unless Ferrari increases the displacement of the V12 by quite a bit, the figure won't surpass the TTV8 in the 488.

 

Thanks fellas.

Briefing journalists- that was the old story. They always reserve the right to change their game plan.

Sound. Agreed. Tim has said time and again that sound = energy and I think especially for a street car you want that energy. Its a big part of it for many of us, myself very much included.

We should look to the 488 and see how the turbo is received. It seems like initial reports are positive and the market is reacting to the 488 pretty much in line as one would expect for the 458 successor.

This is why I say I *think* the F12 VS will be a really important car: the last limited extreme NA V12 model from the marque that is linked most strongly to front engine NA V12 cars....

Btw- I think the FF update likely will use a slightly revised version of the current motor so it will be NA but the replacement to the FF will go turbo too...

Very funny about how people will complain whenever there is a change. I agree- I got a good laugh at that. As enthusiasts we look backwards. The car makers have to look forwards. I have no idea how, but I'm sure Ferrari will bring something new to the game- only Ferrari does this consistently. So I'm not saying the sky is falling- just that this is a very very important car.

 

Can't answer that. He died when I was 12 years old, now nearly a half century ago. When the house was sold shortly after his death we found the repair manuals in the attic among his belongings along with pictures from the war and some uniforms.

 

I'm sorry to read your father died when you were so young. I'm sure he's looking down on you with pride.

 

Forgive me for my lack of insight, but I don't understand the genesis of the sound regulations. I get emissions, but not sound. Is this an endemic problem in Europe with super cars buzzing around at 100db frightening local villagers and causing livestock to go astray?

If so, please ease up when driving through Forte di Marmi, please, you guys are killing us! ��

Mario

 

I look forward to the 427 cu in (7 liter) V12 "big block" Ferrari. 800 hp at 8500 RPM. Who needs more than that?

 

I'll be happy with 780 bhp at 9,000 rpm red line because that is what it will have It will scream and wake up the entire city!!

 

I believe the next V12 will be smaller with a huge load of electric power (160 at first ''LaFerrari electric engine'', then upwards from there). Emissions and all that.

 

Seen this monster on track a few times it does sound epic. it is still the largest engine Ferrari have ever put in a car?

Sport Prototype 712 Can Am: debuted at Imola Interserie race in 1971.

 

@tmario: It s a real problem for Ferrari,because European authority will be prohibeted intake exhaust valves for a result to 68 db max for sport cars and 63 db for normal cars !
All European states are concerned (july 2016 for new car types & january 2020 for all cars at the end of the assembly lines).
That s the main reason Ferrari has launched now the 488 spider and F12 GTO...
And after ???

 

I've searched the internet but can't find anything on this. Sounds like BS to me (hence I searched the internet looking for proof!). Do you have a link? Or do you mean exhaust noise can't be above 68db?

I have my doubts on how manufactures can implement valveless engines in such a short time...

 

is that engine Sound comes from the Audio System, outside quiet inside what ever you want; v12 in v8 Ferrari or LAF sound in the Fiat 500 thats the reality in 2-5 years no other way for carsound in europe, thats the reason the carnuts buying older cars now and in the future more with higher prices

 

My money is on V10 twin turbo

 

Nuisances : le Parlement européen veut réduire le bruit des voitures

Les eurodéputés réduisent les émissions sonores des voitures

Automobile: Les pots d'échappement devront mettre une sourdine - Auto - tdg.ch

.....

 

They've already stated future V12 plans as Hybrid

 

Thank you for posting, the theme here is laws to reduce engine sound - ugh

 

Thx 4 posting

Manufacturers have indeed been able to use a loophole in European law. During the final exam, the vehicle onboard computer "recognizes" the situation and closes the valves to limit the noise. And as soon as a vehicle is approved, the driver can not be held responsible as soon as he activates the sport mode.

The Ordinance Nr. 540/2014 will end this gap. "Will therefore prohibited all systems whose purpose was simply to change the noise limit in specific driving situations, such as exhaust valves," confirmed Guido Bielmann, spokesman for FEDRO. And in Switzerland and in the European Union.

Not for existing vehicles

The Association Transport and Environment (ATE) is already glad. "We are already continuously exposed to noise, which stresses us and makes us sick. And this is especially road traffic which is one of main sources of noise according to the Federal Office for the Environment, "says his spokesman Gerhard Tubandt.

However, the order will only apply to vehicles sold from 1 July 2016. Existing models already on the road and have nothing to fear.

Other systems exist

Auto-Switzerland , the association official car importers in the country, do not think that the ban will be a big influence on sales of sports cars.

Especially since the alternatives are not lacking, as pointed Rudolf Blessing, technical manager of the association. "There is a long history of inward directed systems, such as canals, which are capable of increasing the noise in the cockpit or the electronic noise generators."

(Newsnet)

 

Electronic noise generators ...It s the end of a line...They want to kill sport cars in Europe,it s not politically correct for bureaucrats !!!
Could you imagine the F12 replacment with the level sound of a Fiat 500 & with an electronic noise generator...This is the worst for a purist.
Actually in France, one F12 gto allocation for five demands !

 

I feel like we are missing something here. Why would the Europeans do something that hurts their manufacturers? (Granted governments do silly things all the time!)

So I did some looking around and here is what I find...

MEPs back law to curb harmful traffic noise

So it seems the 2016 limits apply to "new vehicle types"- what does that mean?

My guess is we'd have heard even more about this if this was going to clamp down on all vehicles next year. I bet the limits on cars like Ferraris won't be in effect until that 2026 date.

But your point is well taken- we are moving into a new era, and moving into it quickly.

Heres a few others I found- they really just say the same thing and that first link is official.

? European Parliament Approves Law to Curb Vehicle Noise | ENS

European Parliament Approves New Vehicle Noise Limits - Law360

 

2016 only concern new vehicles types,consequently not 488 gtb & spider,not FF ,F12 and GTO version.
However, 488 Speciale, FF & F12 Modificata will be judge as new types ??

 

Ferrari history says no...the V12 is part of the DNA.

And even if Ferrari goes all out on turbo power; you really don't need a V10, a V8 can deliver plenty.

A V10 is out of the question.

 

I wonder if they can squeeze out the f12m before the deadline?

 

Don't disagree but have to tell you, the number of dickheads who cruise through central in London never out of first gear and in RACE mode, in their Lambos and Ferraris, generating stupid amounts of noise and making ordinary people hate the cars hasn't help persuade law makers to focus on more important matters.

A guy in a 430 Spider pulled up alongside me once in traffic. I was in my X5 diesel. His roof was down and he was accelerating from stop to stop, revving the engine going nowhere etc. My window was down and all I did was roll my eyes. He shouted at me I was just jealous because I would never own a Ferrari. What a dickhead.

So yes the laws are sometimes daft but quite a few seriously dumb supercar owners have done nothing to help.

 

We see this all to often here in the colonies as well, especially here in south Florida.