Severe Wheel hop. What to do? Bushings? Tires?

Car has severe wheel hop. Researched and found out (on other cars) it most probably means bushings in rear suspension components are in need of replacing? Don't know which ones? Anyone changed anything that solved wheel hop?

My pzero tires at the moment are 7 years old with 10k km on them and scheduled to be replaced next week. I'm not convinced that old dated tires have anything to do with wheel hop though? Or am I wrong? For those that changed tires did it solve wheel hop?

This link explained everything very well:
mc²racing

With very low mileage on the car about 10k km is it possible that the bushing have gone bad this soon? By going bad does it mean cracked and broken or the rubber compound just got dried up?

Help.

 

Make sure you haven't lost an axle. Pull the lower panel and see if you have an open boot or grease sprayed on the undercarriage. It would look like the attached pic and the implications are a lot of noise that can be periodic based on the turn of the tire/axle.

Sounds a little early for a suspension or bushing issue, even on a 599/612.
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If tires (very plausible) don't solve it be prepared to open check book

The more powerful a car the more sensitive to tire age & degradation

 

Might be solved by going to HGTE springs and shock absorber ECU (if SN 156938 or later). Not something I have heard complained about on 599s, though. Are you taking her to a drag strip?

 

With my 599 it where just bad luck with The tires

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Were the tires badly out of balance when changed?

 

Trygve11, wheel hop only happens when accelerating spiritedly from a stand still starting from as low as 30%+ throttle and on the street. Otherwise it drives perfectly normal so I doubt axles are bad? Regardless, will definitely look at them soon. Thanks a lot for the picture!

Greyboxer, good to know old dated tires may be the case. Thanks for sharing.

Tazandjan, never dragged the car. Never used launch control. Don't plan on doing either.
But I would love to launch spiritedly on the road. I can't justify changing springs and shocks at such low mileage. If anything makes sense to change it would be lower control arms/bushings? I don't have any vibrations issues when driving at any speeds so I doubt balancing is badly off.

Elipinski, super! What kind of tires did you have and change to? Were they old dated tires or badly worn tires prior to changing? How severe was your wheel hop and did a new set of tires eliminate wheel hop completely? Please share some more details.

Has anyone gone full throttle from a stand still on their 599? Is it even possible to do so without wheel hop or without smoking the tires? What happens?!

 

Age has nothing to do with upgrading to HGTE springs and the HGTE shock ECU (there are no specific HGTE shocks). Those parts were made by Ferrari to tighten up the suspension/handling of the 599 and those changes have been made my numerous 599 owners.

 

Thanks. I do not disagree. However, I do not think every non-HGTE 599 faces severe wheel hop issues?

 

The picture I posted is from a 612 that I am currently working on in my shop for a customer. The car "howled" upon throttle. Only on acceleration. NOT on decel.

I saw the grease tracks and then removed the axle stubs from the tranny to check how the inner CV joints pivoted. One was extremely dry and tight. The axles were in fact the issue in this case.

Good luck in getting the issue identified and resolved. If the noise follows the rotation of the engine and is related to load, make sure you confirm axles are not the cause.

 

The car is powerful enough to smoke the tires all through 1st gear. Zero wheel hop though. Clean launch without any drama.

Don't get too carried away with launching from a stop unless you like replacing the clutch frequently.

 

Try driving on wet pavement and see if the issue continues without spirited acceleration.

I've just had diff mounts replaced on a car that had some sideways hopping under no acceleration when going over bumps in the road, under wet conditions. It definitely felt unsafe, and the new diff mounts sorted it.

 

7 year old PZero's on a 599? Yikes! Get those off ASAP!

I don't like PZero's in general, and one of the reasons is how they can flat spot and get out of round. Besides, I don't like that they sometimes start showing cracks and degeneration after only 1-2 years.

Why not go with MPSS? Which rims do you have on it?

 

John- Good thought on transaxle mounts. Only two front and two rear for the entire engine-torque-tube-transaxle assembly.

 

PROBLEM SOLVED!

Thanks for all the inputs guys!
Changed my tires and problem solved! 0 wheel hop.

Upon initial *quick* inspection of the older 2007 tires (while they were still on the car) they actually looked in a much better condition when compared to most of the ferraris at the service center! Look at the photo comparison to a *possibly tracked* 2012 tire on a Blue 599 that was at the dealer (If you can see a blue body panel thats the 2012 tire, the rest are all of the same 2007 tire). And by condition I mean, 80-90% less visual cracks, similar sidewall flex (as measured by my thumb force lol), and 50% more black in color / less dryness and not as whitish as the possibly tracked 2012s and I was comparing Pirellis to Pirellis (and to be fair my 2007 tires always had tire polish on them so lets disregard the blackness/dryness). So thats why I was thrown off and initially was not convinced that the older tires were the root cause of wheel hop. Also an important note, I have no idea if the 2012 tire-d 599 even had wheel hop. But...

When we removed the 2007 tires from the car they were lumpy (less severe than bubbling) at multiple different corners and impossible to see while installed on the car. Actually it was quite tricky to see even when uninstalled. But it is there for sure lol. Its one of those cases where you would feel it when wiping your hands on them (more than see them).

I have always used "Tire Cradle" to protect my tires from flat spots but I guess they can minimize flat spots (not solve flat spots forever lol).

Needless to say, I saw the tire shop guys having a hard time removing the tire from the wheel (it wasnt something dramatic but a one man task became a 2 man task lol) so that was a good gauge/confirmation that tires where in deed too hard and did not flex as they normally should. On a side note, my driver front wheel was slightly bent (got that fixed) but when it comes to my particular wheel hop it was from the rear not the front.

In conclusion:
Ultimately I would say my severe wheel hop issue was because of the old dated tires and the combination of not driving the car much caused irregular tire shape/flatness and tire hardness/reduced flexibility/reduced grip.

What a great excuse to drive the 599 much more often!
In the past 2 years I drove my car about 200km (was a busy time of my life but thats about to change).

Hope these facts helps.

*Note: the cracks shown in the last photo were not visible when installed on the car. They became visible after removing and stretching the tire off the wheel.
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This exact thing happened on my Pzeros (2007 year). Looked like elephant skin.

Changed them by MPSS, following the advice on this forum.