The great cockpit debate; 'discussion' this Friday....

Agreed. It's in our DNA.

Plus, there are more stakeholders in motorsports than ever before. So the trends certainly don't support this.

Maybe closer to a 1000 years ; )

 

Driverless cars seem to be the future of individual transport, as far as I can see.
Major car manufacturers are investing lots of money in that technology.
Once the technology is well established, less and less people will bother to learn to drive.

With driverless cars taking hold, I can see the time where insurance companies will refuse to cover drivers controlling their vehicle themselves. The human factor will be seen as a fly in the ointment.

Driving as an everyday skill will disappear within a few generations, and with them the poll of potential racers.

There will still be competition of some sort, but probably with some form of radio controlled electric cars. The future belongs to unrestrained technology, and racers will be designed and controlled from off track by computer boffins. And that may be very boring to watch !!!

Present days F1 will be in museums, and seen like the Roman chariots of the age of the combustion engine. I don't think they will stir much emotion in 100 years time.

In any case, I won't see that ...

 

Interesting poll:

RACER Poll Results - Poll Results: Driverless racecars

Ultimately, motorsports is just as much (more?) a business as a sport. So if there is no interest in driverless races, then it doesn't make business sense.

As someone who spent an entire career in software/hardware/tech - the thought is, and always will be terrifying to me. Software ALWAYS breaks - always. There is no flawless software. The more complicated the problem, the more complicated the software solution. I'm really curious to know what will happen after the first rash of self-driving car related fatalities - which absolutely will happen. Just like we will see autonomous robot assistants malfunction and kill people in the not-too-distant future. It's the whole reason for organizations like: FLI - Future of Life Institute

Hand over control to the cars, the robots, and the drones and we won't be around much longer after that.

Eh - I dunno. I mean the thing that helps this endure is that most people in racing come from some background where they were introduced to it at a young age. In general, it's a very affluent sport - really an understatement. I do think it will change however. For instance, I think we are probably one generation out of potentially seeing someone reach F1 that might not have ever driven a "real" manual transmission. The latest driving school in the US (Lucas) has paddle shift cars as an example.

But if it is boring, then no one will really care; if no one cares, then there is no way to make money on it.

Quite possible - I just think you need to add another zero to the prediction on time : )

 

I suppose you don't have much faith in autopilots on aircraft then?

In London, the underground network will be entirely driverless before long. The whole tube system will be computerised and the trains will have no drivers.
Already, the DLR is a driverless transport system in East London.

The future is with driverless vehicles, that you like it or not.

If you talk about risks, what about human errors, fatigue, lapse of attention, erratic behaviour, distraction, lack of concentration, failing eyesight, bad visibility, the effects of drug, medication, intoxication, without talking about the death wish drivers have to out perform each others, which is the cause of most accidents?

Let's face it, a driverless vehicle would be far safer!!

 

These Orwellian visions of the future are getting depressing! Mind you I'm not saying they are wrong ... surely hope so!

 

I think you've hit the most salient point for me. We can go on forever trying to remove every possible skerrick of potential danger. But in the end, it needs to be sensible - and that includes providing a return for the effort and some proof that it would help and likewise proof that there would be no danger added.

There is other "lower hanging fruit" to be plucked to improve driver safety.

 

You obviously have no, or little, experience in IT.

I agree with your future view, but singletrack is right on the money. There is a reason the steering wheel will stay as a backup, ie: so the human can be blamed for any mistake, and there will be many.

Look at how many failures you get with your PC, Windows programs, etc. Turning your car's computer off and on again when it is driving at a cliff, or a classroom of young children, is NOT an option. Look at the "start button" issues with Toyota's ... and they appear to refuse to install a kill or off button as a sensible solution and instead added code to back off the throttle if the brake pedal is touched. Crazy IMO ...
Pete

 

The present, or future, racing will probably be who can process data faster ... I believe the future is not about our physical abilities but our intellect.
Pete

 

Horse racing is still around and popular despite the fact that we no longer use them for transportation. Same goes for yacht racing and I bet some gearheads will keep combustion engines racing when everbody glides around in Prius and other electric crap

 

But the autopilots don't land or take-off. I'm not an aviator, but they are used primarily to maintain a current course between beacons if I'm not mistaken. You also aren't flying with other planes in close proximity unless something has gone wrong, or you are landing or taking off, at which point it isn't involved either. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Again very different though because the course that vehicle is following is closed. It's on a track. Sure you can still have issues, but it's a ton different than a 6-lane wide highway in the US.

I'm a mediocre programmer, but I can envision the algorithm to control trains in a subway autonomously. The algorithms, sensors, fail-safes, failure scenarios required for driverless cars makes me want to throw up.

I think there is a lot of investment in it, and it will have a place, but I'm not convinced it will be the only way or required. Americans, just as one example, love their cars and the freedom to go wherever they like whenever they want. I can get in my car right now and drive 4k miles across states without having to speak to or answer to anyone. I don't think Americans will be quick to surrender that right. Obviously if you are sitting in gridlock traffic on the 405, then who cares if a computer is controlling you as you sputter along at 5-10mph for 2 hours.

Speaking of which - how will driverless cars handle lane-splitting? Ugh...motorcycles are allowed to ride the lines in between cars in CA. I'd hate to write the software to handle that.

Those same people write the software though. Here's the main thing. Yes, people are outraged when a drunk person kills someone else with a car. Want to know what will make them crazier? When a computer does it.

Again, not convinced. Even if the stats support it, I don't believe people will want to entrust their safety at 65mph to a computer program. I sure don't.

 

Sorry! : ) ...but I think they are accurate : (

We submit to naked body searches in the US more or less with the scanners at the airport now. If you have tracking services enabled on your phone, someone motivated can basically figure out where you are going or have been at any time. The US government flies freakin' airplanes over major cities masquerading as cell towers so they can intercept cellular data and collect information. It's all real unfortunately and trending in the wrong direction.

Exactly.

Exactly! Here's one - how about real driver education in the US!!!! My driving exam was a total joke and, big surprise, had a major accident within a year of getting my license.

Unfortunately all true. I've worked with some of the best minds in development. I've seen IEEE lifetime award winners make such simple mistakes in code that they walked away from my desk with their head down, apologizing and kicking themselves they were so embarrassed. It happens despite great minds, great quality control, etc.

Definitely agree.

Interesting sidebar. Wayne Gretzky, widely considered the best or one of the best 3-5 players of all time in hockey, was a tremendous passer and not a particularly "model" physical specimen. He accumulated insane amounts of assists over his life. At one point, they did a study on him and actually proved that the neurons in his brain fired far faster than the average person. What does that mean in practical terms? He could actually see the play developing before anyone else on the ice; he could process the information faster.

 

Did not know that - thanks. What about when evasive action must be taken during approach? Say another aircraft too close. Can the computer handle that or does it require the pilot?

 

I had to pull along a curb within 12". Then do a 3 point turn. Then drive around a course - not even on the street; between some lines in an asphalt lot. It took 5 mins. The written exam was twenty questions multiple choice. There were only 60 questions in the pool at the time I believe, so you could essentially memorize them even if you didn't understand them. They were available through driver ed's schools. Ridiculous. Even at 15, I remember thinking, "this is insanely easy and dangerous". LOL

I did take some driver's ed classes, but my father paid for those on his own and they were not required by law.

 

When I was 16 I visited California and just for the fun of I took the driving test and of course passed it as it was simple as yours. So I went home with a valid driver's license, which was null and void in Europe. Then I spent some endless hours with my Swiss driving instructor preparing me for the real test.

On the day of my exam it actually snowed so we mounted the chains. I did pass the test, which lasted a full hour. The only thing they dinged me on was "you passed that other car pretty fast given that you were driving on chains". Oh well. I took that in stride and went on to my next test driving a truck with a non synchronized gear.

 

Allmendinger: I’ll never race an open-cockpit IndyCar after Wilson’s death



Allmendinger: I?ll never race an open-cockpit IndyCar after Wilson?s death

 

Oh that is too funny. So I bought my X5 from a dealer in California and had it delivered to the performance center in SC. It was in December that I was going to pick it up. So I ask him - "hmmmm, well I might hit snow on the way back to PA and it gets really bad sometimes in WV; how do I get all seasons or snow tires mounted?" His answer: "Oh it has AWD, you are fine; I take mine to Tahoe with the summer tires on." LOL