Just tuned my 488!

After an extremely positive experience tunning my Porsche TTS, AT LEAST SO FAR, it's very tempting to try and squeeze another 100hp out of my 488. Truth be told, I just couldn't do it for all the reasons you sight above. Ferrari's definitely a different animal when it comes to mods. I'm convinced they wouldnt pay no matter what it took. Nobody messes with the great Ferrari and their technology 😅

 

Ignorant to say you could remap your ecu and have a chance fighting a blown engine case....

Cracked turbo housing? Caused by increased boost and heat generated

Cracked block? Detonation from Too much timing advance and too much boost.

Piston ring? See above

Oil Leak? Probably has too much boost. Blew by the rings and pressurized the crank case.

Broke your transmission? Rear end? Output shafts? Too much power for the designed parts.

It's quite simple. Add 100 hp to any car and the factory has all it needs to deny any power train warranty claim. If they decide not to deny you, you're lucky and they're being nice. This is even if the issue was not caused by your tune! You've given them the way out.

The ruling you cite is just for unrelated mods. Put a new rear wing on the car, now your trunk lid won't open. They have to fix the trunk lid mechanism as its unrelated.

Tune your ecu-> blow the motor up? Good luck fighting that one.

One more point is this. It's not going to become their job to prove your mod damaged the car. It's your job to prove it did not.


With all the above said, I'm all for the tune. We're working some bugs out on my car and after all is proven I may go down this road too.

 

Who cares what this guy does.
It's his car his issues if he makes damage.

 

True. Only ferrari messes with ferrari (i.e. Faking stock performance for testing by mags). LoL

 

I would think a blown engine is not his utmost concern. He knows the risk and was willing to take it

 

You are right about hiring an attorney to fight. You will spend as much on the attorney as you would have on the repairs. The other FChatter who says his service center turns a blind eye on his mods, may have either a very good and unique relationship with the service manager or else more likely be doing 'mods' which aren't that invasive or potentially damaging.

However, if one is intent on pushing the envelope, one shouldn't be surprised if there are costs.

Let me ask some naive questions. After the initial tune, can one get some clues about impending doom by watching the gauges namely oil temp and water temp. If those readings rise dangerously, then one would cool off and re think things. Maybe get a larger water or oil radiator and fans or else back off the tune a bit --instead of 70 maybe settle for 35 more hp.

Is there a way to monitor the turbo temp to follow the effect of the tune?

 

Just get a 650s....dealers openly talk of modding them.

Both are somewhat boring turbo cars anyway

 

Man you guys are buzzkills.

The OP has aftermarket wheels, exhaust, and just had the car tuned. I'm pretty sure he knows the possibly risks involved.

OP enjoy the car, 100+ extra HP is nothing to sneeze at!

 

LOL right back.
I tuned my 458 and Ferrari knew about it and didn't void my warranty. What more do you want me to say?

I'm not fishing for an argument but what do you not understand about the tune needing to demonstrably cause the damage they won't warrant and the onus being on the manufacturer because law protects the consumer? If it has, then YES, i accept that i would lose my warranty on the engine. but they would have to show that. They cannot just say "no warranty." Anything could blow an engine, if the tune had done it, then fine. But it'd have to be the tune. That's my point. Otherwise it could be bloody oil starvation or a million other things and they'd get out of paying becuase of a "harmless tune". And I guarantee you that, if it wasn't the tune, then Ferrari wouldn't fight it beyond the first few steps. Why? Because I've seen how they react when challenged. I spoke to a company in the UK where some guy who had a tubi on a 430 and his manifolds cracked as usual like all 430's were. They blamed the tubi said no warranty replacement set. He put up a fuss and sent just one solicitors letter stating the law and saying "prove it" and Ferrari UK came back, agreed, replaced the manifolds for free and gave him 1 year extention for free as gesture of goodwill as long as he kept quiet. jeez, i've seen N-Largo owner who was getting warranty work done FFS!

I'm not saying fight your dealer, but don't spend $400,000 on a car and then have someone tell you how to own it. Maybe FNA are different? I don't know. I wouldn't blame them if you added some tune which stressed the engine to a billion HP. Would I put a turbocharger on my 430 Scuderia? No. Would I lift the rev limit? No. But this warranty void nonsense for simple stuff has no legal ground. I WOULD fight it as I've seen it wouldn't lose.

We'll agree to disagree.
Sorry for thread hi-jack. Sorry to be a killjoy.
I wish the OP every success and look forward to hearing more about his tune and his car. Drive in good health and safety.

 

You tuned your Ferrari and they didn't void your warranty. So what? No one is saying they will try and void your warranty for the hell of it. Try and stick them with a $30K engine repair warranty claim and see what happens. Of course Ferrari doesn't care if your tune it... until you try and make a large warranty claim possibly related to it.

What's also true is that if you show up at the dealer with errors and problems, and they see it's tuned, there is no guarantee they will cover the labor of figuring out what's wrong without at the very least re-flashing your car to stock. You can't expect to tune your car and then have Ferrari pay to diagnose issue afterward.

 

I suppose in order to convince anyone you'll have to say also that you cracked a piston with your tune in the car and you got your motor replaced.....

 

Why is everyone else here so concerned with what this guy is doing with HIS car. Amazing!

 

This is the internet where someone who doesn't know you believes they know better than you on what you do with your life. Hahaha

 

I don't think you're seeing that there are two conversations here. One about the tune and we for the most part and all are excited for theOP. Then there is a side convo where some guy is saying Ferrari cannot void your warranty on your engine if you blow it up with a tune because they'll have to prove it. Unfortunately that nonsense getting more attention than the op's topic.

 

Nobody is criticizing the original poster. We were having a discussion on the warranty aspect. That is all.

Shoot. I modify all of my cars. And with the influx of turbos, there will be so many more tuners. Most will just up the boost and say it's tuned.


Edit: sorry to the OP for the thread jack.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I have read and understand the complete thread, thanks for the play by play. I commented on part of the discussion......

 

Ferrari tuned the 488 the way they did specifically to hide the feeling of it being a turbo instead of NA which the buying public stated was going to be the car's biggest detractor. They, of course, were correct and many are still on the fence but undoubtedly the factory tune has satisfied many in hiding the turbo design of the car. It will be interesting to see an unbiased review of the impact of street tunes that don't add boost on that success. However, for me, there is no other interest in these small forced induction motors and the limitless HP numbers wars from street tunes.

As far as the general discussion of modifying the contents of the Engine Control Unit, the Internet is filled with rejections from OEMs when owners try to claim warrantee compensation when any damage of the engine occurs. All that has to be proved is that the code was modified outside of the control of the OEM. If its your code then its your engine and your problem. Still, the warrantee will be up in three years anyway.

When I extended the full warrantee on my F12, part of the approval process was to verify the code out of many ECMs. I read through the summary of the report from each ECM and I can tell you that any modifications would be detected. They would not likely extend the warrantee or at least hike the price substantially if there was any funny business detected. I don't think its the OEMs responsibility to evaluate every version of every street tune and develop an associated warrantee risk.

 

I suspect the original poster is aware of the potential liability and doesn't care.

 

So how w come the Z06's are stock?

 

The problem with turbos (or any FI system) is that most OEM tunes are pretty conservative and it's relatively easy to tune in another 20-30%. Typically, engineers design the engine parts and system with significant safety margins as well to accommodate for long term material fatigue and extreme operating conditions (poor fuel, high ambient temps, track use, etc), although large safety margins (50% plus) are more challenging on engines like the 488 which are on the higher end of the performance spectrum to start with as other design goals can conflict. So, another 100hp is probably well within the design limits of the engine as long as everything else is nominal (which it often times is not).
The real issue is that turbo hp is the equivalent of crack cocain, cheap and effective! The first 100 hp is a big deal, you'll feel it big time. But like a drug, you build a tolerance over time and need more. So it's back to the tuner for a higher dose. You want that same feel of that first extra 20%. But now it becomes a game of percentage. To get the same feel you now need to add 120hp, then 150hp! It's no wonder there's no lack of 1000hp turbocharged econo-boxes on the road today. And in most cases your engine will blow way sooner then you'll blow through your wallet. It takes great discipline to say "enough" when hp is so cheap and the car drives like stock while not boosted.
On the other hand, the cost of adding another 150 plus rear wheel hp to your 458 would cost tens of thousands and the power band would make normal driving much less enjoyable, so it's somewhat self limiting.

 

Nice to see another Vette aficionado here. Curious as to what software Powerhaus used to crack the Ferrari ECU so soon after its release?

Sanjay
'15 Z07/'07 Z06 track car/'04 C5 supercharged/'90 ZR-1 LPE stroker, etc...

 

Ferrari... and me

 

It picked up 10 whp with your tune, but that's not the same as it will do it in stock form.