The unthinkable just happend

Thank you Daniel. I heard your implosion was worse than mine but at least maybe some folks will take notice now.

 

Link did not work for me

 

here you are the pictures of Magspider belt damage

ciao
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I am no pro, but that belt does not look brand new (could be the quality of the picture too)

 

I don't know, but if the belt broke down, means it didn't work correctly so it's weared more than an old belt

ciao

 

maybe installed with a too high tension?

 

Any fresh markings like this on the belt? Should still be there after a 100km. They don't disappear that quickly in my experience. It takes something serious to snap a cam belt especially when new.
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Thanks for posting that pic up Alberto.

From my 20 years experience fixing cars, for a belt to break like that...........something let go inside the timing cover causing either the cam/s or engine to lock up causing that sudden break of the timing belt.

Or you engine has locked up in the bottom end, but I don't think so.

Perhaps timing belt tension was EXTREMELY excessive, which could be possible as the owner did say he heard an odd noise before the belt broke. I haven't seen too many fail because of this personally, but it has happened in the past.

I am also sure the mechanic is very good according to the OP, so he would know exactly how to tension the 348 cam belt correctly. That or he let the Apprentice do it without double checking his work.

I am leaning more towards something let go or was left loose in the timing cover area causing the engine to lock up and break this cam belt.

 

Excellent info, look at the 'tensile failure' pic.

That is exactly what your belt looks like which again leads me to believe that something let go inside the timing cover mate.

Time will tell what happened here.

 

Possibly mate. It would have to be something like that that locked that engine or cams up for that belt to break.

Water pump might have been fine on the day, but can seize the very next time you start your car.

Unlikely, but it can happen.

Normally you can hear bearing noises before the pump seizes, but they are very hard to hear water pump or tensioner bearing noises in the 348 engine because the pump and tensioners are hidden behind the timing covers and there 348 has other mechanical sounds going on all the time when the engine is running. If the bearing noise is loud enough, then you can definitely hear it of course.

I am still thinking something was left loose when the cam belt was changed man. Again, time will tell and make sure you are there 100% when the engine is dropped and the covers removed.

It will only take a pro 2-3 hrs going steady to take that engine out. So be sure to ask him when he starts to remove the engine that you give yourself plenty of time to get to the workshop to see him drop the engine out and remove those covers. It doesn't take long to remove those covers to inspect the problem.

 

Correct mate. You would have definitely heard something like that if this was the case.

 

or this: just a very high temperature could erase the writings on the belts in such a low mileage: I bet on a too high tension that generated very high temperatures on the belt

ciao
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Both tensioner pullies and the water pump are run by the backside/ non toothed side of the belt. By the look of the belt one of those stopped turning because the smooth side looks horribly woren through.

I'm sure the tensioner bearings were new so it was likely the water pump. He mentioned hearing something and it don't take long at all to smoke a belt. We have also seen the guides set too close and making contact with the belt but he probably would have heard that right away if they were that tight and not only just before the failure. My vote.. Water pump.

 

Old and new belt (and tensioners) during a big service on my wife time capsule 348 with just 2000 km.

Almost no writings on the new belt, but you are right: it's the smotth side of the belt that drives the waterpump and touches the tensioners.

The belt is very long and single: a small error or an extra load and it's gone

ciao
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Just how many Ferraris do you own Alberto???

I was wondering why you were hanging around in the 348 section.

Never knew you owned a 348 also, that is great to see.

 

I never had a 348: my wife had it and the car was sold just after that service (the car was unstarded since 21 years). I just cleaned that car!

It was (and still is) one of the best 348 in the world

ciao
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

That is wonderful and amazing to hear! Thanks for sharing my friend.

 

Belt does look like it may have been over heated and over tension. Really hard to tell out of perspective just looking at the belt. So many other components need inspection connected to the belt.

I have been workign with Gates Engineers for the past 15 years on some projects they are the best.
It may not be possible for Gates but another company, Dayco may be able to look at it under a microscope to see how the rubber separated and get you a report to go with the other findings.

They do very through destructive tests on everything

Good luck

 

I would say it's easy to learn what happened, if you can inspect the engine: you just have to check if the water pump turns and if the tensioners turn. If the water pump turns, the shop is 100% responsible of the disaster. If the tensioners don't turn, the shop installed bad (or badly) tensioners and the shop is 100% responsible of the disaster. If the water pump doesn't turn, the shop is at least 50% responsible of the disaster, as the shop said the waterpump was ok. If both tensioners and waterpump turn, they overtensioned the belt (or did some other installing mistake), and the shop is 100% responsible of the disaster.

ciao

 

Corretta Alberto.