Is Hamilton one of the GOAT F1 drivers?

Can you tell us when was that, because I don't recall Moss ever handing his car to Fangio.
Maybe my memory is failing me.

When they were team mates at Ferrari, Peter Collins gave his car to Fangio who went on to win the title.

But Moss won the title on the track in 1958, only to lose it officially when he testified in favour of his main rival Hawthorn who having been disqualified was later reinstated and declared WDC that year!!

Now, that was a example of sportsmanship which did more to Stirling reputation than any title!!!

 

Keke Rosberg won because he was consistent and gathered points at almost every GP that year.

He was racing an atmospheric engine against turbo cars, and made judicious use of its reliability. I don't think he stole his title.

Nobody say multiple WDCs are the product of luck; they invariably come by having a superior car in a team that dominates.

 

No, I won't listen to you, and yes I can see what's going on, on the track!!

I don't know who are Hobbs and Matchet either, who cares.

Hamilton is not dominating Rosberg; in most of their confrontations, he has to resort to unsporting behaviour, bully tactics and downright dirty tactics to gain advantage. His lap speed is hardly better than Rosberg's. He often goes outside the track limits too !!!

 

Hobbs is a former British F1 driver and Matchett a former Benetton mechanic who wrote two great books about F1. Both are now F1 commentators on US TV. And to answer your question: I do and I love them. Talked to them in person just a few weeks ago. They are great guys and know F1 very well.

Hamilton is dominating Rosberg. Lewis has racecraft and speed. Nico has only speed, in qualifying.

 

If Lewis should end up in a Ferrari one day (2019?) then goes on to win another couple of WDC, there will still be people on here in denial....

He already is ONE of the greatest, whether he becomes THE greatest is a completely different question of course.

Enjoy the summer break boys and girls, be it in London,Edmonton,Waikiki,Istanbul or even Stevenage!

Lewis seems to be having a good time!:

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/576327/Hamilton_partying_hard_during_F1_summer_holiday/

 

Yeah, I now recall David Hobbs the endurance driver; I don't remember him in F1 though.

We will aqree to disagree re. Hamilton and Rosberg.

 

Hobbs was late sixties.

Shouldn't you be sleeping by now?

 

+3

 

Or:

Rosberg is not dominating Hamilton;in most of their confrontations,he has to resort to unsporting behaviour,bully tactics and downright dirty tactics to gain advantage.His lap
speed is hardly better than Hamilton's.he often goes out side the track limits too!!!

 

And he won't fare any better than Fred or Seb unless Ferrari have the best car.

 

So how should that work today? How can someone like Alonso built a team around him to make the McLaren fly? As Alonso is a multiple WDC he must be able to do so according to you. Or what can Vettel do other than leaving Ferrari right at the moment to get a WDC in near future?

Yes, you are right. But how can Hamilton (or Vettel) influence whether their car is good for 1,2 or even 4 successive WDC years before a competitor builts a better one? Why is Hamilton a better driver than Alonso just because the winning series of Mercedes lasts longer than the one with Renault. Does it make Alonso a worse driver because he did not get along with Ron? Just looking at the stats you would say so...Again: stats alone do not paint the picture.
And as someone mentioned above: it is easier to win a lot of races and poles in a time of 20 GP a years and very reliable cars. How can someone like Clark get the same stats when there were less GPs a year, the cars fell apart and his career ended early?

 

Seb is streets ahead of Rosberg of course..would love to see Seb and Lewis in the same team ,awesome!

 

Alonso chose Ferrari and McLaren-Honda when they did not have their act together. As I pointed out with Alesi: Great talent isn't everything you also need to know when to pick the right team.

PS: I am a huge Alonso fan and not a Hami fan but Lewis clearly made better career choices. Alonso is likely the better driver but will end up with less WDCs.

 

Interesting thought. I think Seb would win but I am not sure.

 

Yes tough to call, fireworks guaranteed.

 

Ronnie was one of the greats, incredible natural ability and car control. He was loved as a friend and admired as a driver by Mario. The tragic irony was that Mario clinched the WDC at the Italian GP at Monza where Ronnie lost his life.

 

Hamilton owns Rosberg mentally. It's so bad you can see it on his face like a child who can't play poker. Vettel also totally has Rosberg's number. I would also say Max is far stronger mentally at his very young age.

Nico is fast; but he isn't mentally strong enough to be a WDC IMHO. This season is his opportunity to prove me and others wrong; he won't get a better chance.

 

+ another.

 

I remember Hobbs driving in endurance for Lotus, Lola, Triumph, JWAE, Penske, etc...

His footprint in F1 must have been very minimal.

 

I don't consider Peterson a great driver, a fast driver yes. Sure he has a lot of car control and was very brave and spectacular, but it takes usually more to be a great driver.

For a start, Peterson was a lousy tester and someone who didn't know how to dial a car. His feedback to his team was absolutely appalling, according to Chapman.

The mechanics at Lotus often ended copying the settings from Andretti's car, and Ronnie went faster on them!! Peterson went around his car's faults; Mario worked at eliminating them - that's the difference.

I don't think he had the consistency to be WDC. Mario Andretti was a talented and thinking driver; he became a champion by working with Lotus in improving his car.
Peterson was just about exceptional car control because he was an instinctive driver with limited technical understanding. .

 

Agree, Mario was a much more complete driver, But Ronnie was faster then him..he had more natural ability (wich makes him one of the most talented drivers ever IMO)...but of course, he was totaly clueless how to set up and develop a car....wich is why he never won a World championship, Mario on the other hand was a bit slower but very good at setting an developing cars, and still fast enough to beat most of the other guys...

 

You may be subject to a curfew where you live, but I am not.

 

LH fits that bill vs Nico above.

Nico lacks the raw speed. LH has min technical ability. Given zero in season testing overall, LH does not need to worry about being too technically adept.

Again no race driver is perfect and no one driver is the greatest and none are hero's. Ever. They are just drivers. Hero worship is for 5 yr old children.

 

Andretti was in the same mould as Stewart before him and Prost later on.
Their secret was to spend time understanding their car and set it up for the race.
But testing was unlimited then.

 

How can one say that a driver who often gets pole position, climbs on the podium at most races and has regular wins "lacks raw speed" ?