Whats with Ferrari and bogus HP numbers?

Thank You sir for your awesome recap.

Not James, Henry.

Thanks again exoticcardreamer, btw, your IG is amazing....and we *did* go on a drive one time, I remember now one of the cars you had posted on IG. My good friend was driving the white sypder, we were behind the orange Huracan (damn that car can move)

Hope to see you again soon, I wish you the best.

Cheers
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yeah; rolling starts have the most room for error. One has to keep doing trial and error or have someone who knows what they are doing to assist you.

 

Ahh henry. He keeps posting his aventador beating f12 on his facebook and it drives James crazy. Very funny watching the two go back and forth.

Cars and Croissants (100 oct) is organizing an event at mojave mile on 10/01/2016. I won't be there but many of the exotic car owners from bay area are going to that event (maximum 25 cars). If anyone is interested then contact Benoit through facebook.

Thx for the compliment about the I/G -

 

as a person who has done a large amount of drag racing... There are far more variables in the standing start.

But... yes... still variables with rolling start.

 

I've received two photographs from 04g a few minutes ago.

The first photograph shows the title for the 2004 Gallardo and it is to the same name as on the DL presented and the rear of the Gallardo is in view and the actual license plate and printed title license plate match.

The second photograph shows a more recent insurance card from Progressive (the previous one expired 7/31/2016; this one begins 7/31/2016). There are 4 cars listed: 2005 Toyota 4 Runner, 2004 Lambo Gallardo, 2008 Porsche Carrera (which has been determined to be a Turbo), and a 2012 458.

The "named insured" field shows the same name as on the DL and the Porsche and Gallardo titles.

04g states that the 458 is in another state and he doesn't have access to the title paperwork.

I believe that ownership has been reasonably proven of the 2004 Gallardo and 2008 Porsche Turbo, but I'm much less certain that being a "named insured" for a 2012 Ferrari 458 meets the same standard of proof of ownership.

According to the Progressive website

https://www.progressive.com/glossary/#NamedInsured

a Named Insured is

It seems to me that means the insurance policy is issued to and that person is likely paying the premium, but is that equivalent to proof of ownership? In most cases it probably is. But in a few cases, I can imagine a parent buying and holding title, while letting a son use it as long as they agree to pay for the insurance. Anyone familiar with how Progressive uses this field in different situations?

 

Thanks ylshih,

I think that's fair proof for me. The fact that 04g is insured is at the very least proof that he drives the car. If he owns it or somebody else - I don't care.

Go ahead and give him the $500 he's done more then enough to prove himself. At least to me.

04g, my apologies for doubting you ownership and experience with these cars. I echo other sentiments here that this thread is at the very least shameful, and I had a lot to do with it. I retract everything I said and presented. If you don't accept my apology I understand.

I wish you the best 04g, and I do mean that sincerely.

Cheers

 

I have been away from FChat for the last couple of days so I apologize for being gone.

I don't know how Progressive interprets the named insured, but will go on record that its enough for me that he claim ownership. Having proven the others I see no reasonable reason to doubt the claims now.

Therefore, as I stated earlier in the thread I owe an apology to 04G. He has proven, to my knowledge, that he owns the cars he stated.

I do hope that in all of this dustup that he can recover and join us as a positive member of FChat.


PDG

 

Just watching how the cars launched and listening to the engine note it sounded like the P1 had trouble getting the power down. It seemed like the 650 was able to launch harder and go full throttle much earlier.

 

haha, you're a class act '04g'....a class act.

How about Make-A-Wish?

..and I do sincerely hope to apologize in person one day. Perhaps a Shift S3ctor event?

I wish your next drive is the best one.

Cheers

 

There is so much power to the rear wheels when using launch control that you will always get wheel spin from a standing start. You will see that I am even having a hard time controlling the car as it starts sliding a little bit after launch.

this is why the 918 is so good from launch (AWD) is such a big advantage.

Here's a good vid of a rolling start against the veyron. I believe we took it to 50 mph and once we passed the cones we let it fly. In this video I was manually using the hybrid power (IPAS). I find that if I manually use it then the wheels catch the pavement a lot better. If it's in auto boost and I floor it anywhere upto 60 mph it seems that I will get wheel spin.

Note: the last part of the video is the best part as it shows the two cars side by side as we go down the air strip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnsCZAypYSw

 

I have just started to read this and haven't been able to read every post, but aren't we comparing apples to oranges?

Someone stated the F12 was "slow", but the F12 is a front engine RWD Grand Tourer. I would compare it to a Bentley Supersport or the Mercedes AMG S65 Coupe or Aston DB 9/11. You can't compare it to the Aventador. The Aventador is a rear engine V12, a comparable Ferrari would be the LaFerrari. A suitable comparison to the Huracan would be the 488, etc.

 

Donation for $500 made to Make-a-Wish (National). Receipt attached.
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Completely unrelated to the topic of this thread... I love the orange accents on the P1

 

Thx. Not entirely original but I think it was annoying the other black p1 in my area in that people were always confusing us two. The accents took away the confusion -

 

Yes and no. The stats I was trying to analyze could be useful in a controlled environment otherwise you're right, they can easily be used to draw the wrong conclusions. If you would like to have me look at any data, please feel free to throw it my way

 

I think there was a couple of themes;
1) why is f12 so slow relatively to lesser horse powered cars. OP stated that a dyno showed that f12 was less then 700 horsepower

2) The relative lack of participation of ferrari owners in these types of events. Relatively speaking there are more modern ferrari's compared to mclarens, lamborghini's.

There are a few videos circulating around youtube that shows a 488 vs mclaren 12c and they both go back and forth in who wins in straight line speed. (they are pretty evenly matched but 12c comes out ahead more often). As we all know a 12c came out in 2011/2012.

 

I think you'll get some good data from the guys who are going to the mojave mile event on 10/1.

I'll make sure they keep their time slips.

 

MT had a relevant review on the F12 from a couple years ago:

2014 Ferrari F12 Berlinetta Exclusive First Test - Motor Trend

 

Comparing dyno numbers is really pointless, there are way to many correction factors and parameters that there is no useful way to compare mulitple vehicles on different dynomometers for any meaningful metric that will answer as to why 'X' vehicle is faster down the tarmac.

Real world runs down the road are far superior in being a useful metric -period-. As I mentioned in the previous post, you need to look at the gear ratios, vehicle weight and one more 'un-sprung weight' that last one is particularly critical. Heavy wheel/tire brake combo will most assuredly affect acceleration rates. I don't really think the Cd, rolling friction etc have enough delta between them to be a factor to point to in modern exotics, they all more or less are roughly the same. But I could be wrong, at top speed air resistance is HUGE!

 

Thinking about it a bit more there may be some very telling info in the Cd and downforce produced by each of the vehicles. The overall drag is more then just the Cd, one of the variables in the equation is the reference area, that can be simply the front envelope or the entire surface area of the vehicle. Ferrari increased the down force dramatically on the F12, that increase will come at a penalty cost of drag but is given up because on a track with say turns and sweeps it's a benefit to have more traction vs being slippery without it.

Devils in the details they say...