I need your opinion. lower mileage f430 or high mileage Scuderia

There really are so many variables that it's difficult to be too much help to you except to say that the most fun I've had with cars has always been with higher mileage, less perfect ones that I haven't invested tons of time, money and energy into. You could buy the Scuderia and truly enjoy it, without a care for miles, safe in the knowledge that no matter what, it's still a genuine Scuderia. For that reason as time goes on it will probably always be worth spending money on to bring it back up to perfect condition if the need or desire took you. Having said that the caveats are: It needs to be a great example, still, and you need to get it at a proper discount (I don't know the market so can't advise numbers but it needs to be *a lot* less than a 10k mile car).

To be honest I've seen enough in my short time playing with Ferrari's to know that outward condition and mileage are not enough of an indicator as to true mechanical condition - and neither is service history, unfortunately, either. My own 360 had a series of lovely stamps from all sorts of marvellous sounding places. It should have been a great car but looking at it in pieces in the garage here quite honestly the only maintenance it has seen has been of the "service book stamp" type, probably where the previous owners have started the conversation something like "what is the best price for a cam belt" or "whats the cheapest you can do a fluid change" etc...

So for that reason I personally would say that in my own opinion, as an engineer rather than a numbers guy, I prefer to buy Ferrari's off other engineers - Ferrari workshops who also sell some cars and work on the stock in quieter times. That suits me much more than "flash" dealers who buy a car, polish it a lot and then stick $20k on the price to cover a warranty "just in case" something falls off. The guy with oily hands in his specialist Ferrari servicing facility will tell you that he is restricted to selling only a few cars a year not because of the market, but just because the decent cars out there are just are so few that they can't BUY the stock to get it in to "prep"!

Hope that helps a bit - your 50k Scud might just be an amazing but overlooked car. Or it might be a nail - just get to the core of the car to find out.... Best of luck. J

 

If the Scuderia checks out, has been well maintained, and is clean I would take it in a heartbeat. Drive it and enjoy it.

 

Initially these are my thoughts as well - because they just look cool. However, I have never driven a Scud and don't know if the lack of insulation and hard CF interior panels would get tiresome on longer drives. Performance-wise I never felt my regular F430 lacking so the extra 20 HP that the Scud has is a non-factor. So for me I'd need to check them both out, in the driver's seat, before I could make an educated decision.

 

The scud is very comfortable and the hard CF interior panels are fine as you're not sitting on them. As for performance, if you think that the main difference between the F430 and scud is 20 bhp, you're really missing the point of the scud.

OP: The link doesn't work. Personally, I wouldn't buy a scud just because you couldn't find an F430 in the right color. Not sure what the price difference is between the cars, but paying a hefty premium for the scud doesn't make sense unless you want the performance benefits that the scud provides. On the other hand, if you can get into a scud for about the same price and want the additional performance, and assuming the car is okay, then go for it. 50,000 miles is a lot for Ferraris, not because they can't do that many miles but because it hurts resale too much to do that many miles. You just need to make a high-miles car has been well cared for and is well sorted. Anyway, the bottom line for which of two cars to buy (assuming similar condition/cost) always is: drive both and see what you think.

 

If a thorough PPI checks out on the Scud, then there's no comparison IMHO. I'd have "pause" getting an all red interior as well but that's just me. I was in a similar situation last year looking at whether to get a 430 spider vs a Scud. My thinking at that time was: the Scud had much more performance and would hold value while the spider would continue to depreciate.

 

Where does this bias against a redish interior come from?

My 360 has the ox blood interior, and although I was initially concerned about this color, I have grown to love it. Moreover, in soliciting opinions from family regarding the car before I purchased it, the universal opinion from the female half of the family was they LOVED the ox blood interior. The male half of the family, not so much?! I ignored them, and bought the vehicle. There has been no regrets and no looking back.

 

Good info... so then other than looking cool and having 20 more HP, what is the "point of the scud"?

 

OP - have you driven a Scud (and 430)?

I ask because some of us love the "hard(er) core version" (CS, Scud) by there have been many posts here by owners that sold their scud because it was too loud/raw/wifey didn't like, etc etc. OTOH, to use one example, I won't own a regular 430 (despite it being a fantastic car) because I want more drama in my weekend sports car.

I'm hoping not to start that discussion again - I'm simply saying its a real phenomenon that illustrates that the cars are different enough in character that some owners didn't like one or the other. So, drive them and you will know if you lust after the scud or if the regular 430 suits your needs.

 

I was in the same boat as you about a month ago. I passed on that Scud and bought a "regular" F430 instead. When I spoke to them about that car, they didn't have all the records, maybe they do now. I would have loved a Scud, but in my case a lower mileage F430 was a better choice.

 

Here's the correct link btw:
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/ferraris/529316-2008-ferrari-scuderia-black-black-50k-miles.html

 

If it passes PPI and compression test, it should be fine.

 

The Scud is a "track" version of the 430 and is lighter, more purposeful holding the corners and is much quicker than the base 430 model. Check out the thread of Scud drag races where the scud goes up against various cars. The shifts are harder, faster and the car is "always" on. Never soft, never docile...it wants to be on a track or driven hard on the street. See if you can arrange a test drive of a 430 spider and a scud at a local dealer or broker and you'll see the difference. There are various "pumps", F1, air conditioning, front control arm bushings and other relays (others much more wise in these areas than I) that will wear out and need replacing by 50,000 miles....hence the comprehensive PPI to let you know what needs replacing.

 

Thanks Rod - I have an F430 and I find that it is a beast when it needs to be and very comfortable well... always. As much as I'd like to think I'm going to take it to the track and play Ricky Racer, the reality is that it just never happens. Bottom line it's a great car for me.

Same thing for my Porsche 911, I keep thinking that I'll get a GT3 so I run down to the dealer but when I look at it, and in a (brief) moment of clarity, I realize that I'd just use it for the street anyway. Getting in and out of those seats gets old - quick. The more-civilized Turbo stays.

 

**** the miles get a scud

 

I'll echo what Rod said and add that the driver experience as a whole is really different. As Clarkson said, there are a lot of little tweaks made on the scud that individually don't sound like much but, in the aggregate, make a huge difference in the way the car drives. That said, if I had to chose one aspect that really separates the cars, it wouldn't be the power difference, it would be the different gearboxes. The Superfast 2 gearbox of the scud to me really defines the driver experience of the scud. When you're on it, the car really feels like a race car: edgy, angry, and goading you into faster and faster speeds. If you ever have the opportunity to do so, you should really drive a scud. I think you'll see what all of us scud owners carry on about here pretty quickly.

 

Looks great and they have service docs all the way from 5000 miles to present. If anyone wanted to get a scud on the "cheap," this would be the way to do it.

 

High miles SCUD.

 

Well, if you have seen how long that GEM has had that car, it goes without saying that it is a very difficult car to sell, because of the mileage. You can kind of make the argument that you won't have that much depreciation but if you put 15k on a 10k mile car it will be a very sellable and desirable car, even if you lose some money. If you put 15k on a 51k car, can you say the same thing?

 

A Scud is a Scud.

The car is just a tad bit above 50k miles. I would find out if it can still qualify for the Ferrari Power Warranty, which is at 50k mi or less. If it checks out and actually passes, I would pay the extra $4k for the one year warranty and drive the **** out of it to work out any kinks.

If this was a track car, rental, etc.. I would be worried. You need to make sure it checks out.

 

The other thing too is this is one of those questions where how much money you have becomes important. If nothing is wrong with the Scud (and a ppi will help determine that but nothing is guaranteed), it's still going to need a much higher amount of new parts than one with half the miles just because of wear and tear. I have never been afraid of a higher mileage car but at the same time I know that going above and beyond with the check book to dial it in is an inevitability, not a possibility.

Yes, you can buy it for the same price as a lower mile F430 but if budget is your concern, I think that you need to factor playing it safe into your equation. Even if the the Scud ends up being a super nice car, I would think that deep pockets would still be a requirement. You might pay $150k for that car but it still thinks it's a $340k plus high strung track oriented car and it won't be cheap to maintain with those miles on it.

That said, it would be a wonderful car to be enjoyed and cared for properly.

 

I would like to advise the Scud. Just have the car really well inspected, aside from the usual suspect of motor and clutch wear, you should check the rotors and pads. Replacing a set of those CCM rotors can be pricy. If its never had track use, it should be OK, but if its been on the track, you would be surprised how quickly you can go through pads and rotors.

Everything everyone has said about the Scud is true. The F430s personality is very much a sports car, by no means is it soft. But the Scud brings another level of focus.