Looking at a '78 Carb GTS in CA

There is a '78 GTS in my area that is for sale. I had a look at the car this weekend. Thankfully, it was on a sales rack outside the dealership which allowed me to look underneath. It wasn't exactly the cleanest undercarriage I have seen on a 308 and I'm not afraid to tackle sludge buildup.

This car comes with a records book going back almost 30 years, but one thing that really bugs me is that this carb car has had the cats replaced recently, perhaps with a Magnaflow or DEC brand. However, I could not see any CARB number stamps on them. I also didn't see any type of temperature probes or pipes branching out from the center of the cats. I assume that these are required to pass the visual on a carb car, or are these thermal sensors only related to the injected models 1980 onwards? I am aware that carbureted cars are VERY HARD to get to pass smog, hence my questions.


I'm quite serious about the car and will be shopping around for a good PPI locally. I may finally get my Ferrari after all these years.

 

I'm tagging along on your thread, Mongo. I have been wondering in carbureted 308's are technically legal in CA.

As for visual inspection, I think it's related to my question about carbureted cars being legal overall. If they are legal generally speaking, then I believe you can treat the car like any post 1975 car and take it to one of many known Ferrari mechanics who will work with you to get the car to pass muster, visually and with emissions. If they're not/weren't legal in CA, then i think you need to deal with BAR to get the coveted BAR sticker, which is where the real misery seems to reside.

 

I have a QV so cannot answer your questions about FI vs carbs, but I have experience with the California title transfer vis a vis SMOG.

There is no additional inspection after the title of the car has been transfered. The seller of the car, by California Law, is responsible for the car passing SMOG before Vehicle Registration can be transfered. Before the sale can occur, the seller must present you with a fresh (less than 90 days) SMOG certificate showing that the car passed. This should provide most of the assurances you are looking for.

You can also look up the serial number on the DMV website and see the SMOG test history for the car. (You can still technically buy a car that does not pass SMOG, but you can't register it with the DMV as a licensed vehicle.)

The gotcha that got me was that there are different SMOG categories in California. I did not know this. My car was previously registered in Monterey County which has more lenient SMOG standards than the Bay Area. My car did not pass in the Bay Area SMOG test (fortunately for me it simply was running too rich) (which is a set-and-forget adjustment for a FI car).

If you are worried, you should pay for an independent SMOG test. This will also confirm that there was no monkey business by the seller.

 

I know what you mean about the BAR. I almost and I do mean ALMOST had to take my 87 928 to the BAR Ref up in Santa Rosa since I had replaced my cats with non-CARB stamped Magnaflows before the 2008 law kicked in. I was pissed to find out that no one would pass it visually without that stupid carb stamp. There is absolutely no difference between Cal-Cats and the other 49 state ones other than the scribing on the body. Luckily I found a set of used OEs to get it to pass.

I don't think I'll be modding anything on this car exhaust wise if the wifey says yes (which so far seems like she is giving her buy-in) ....

..okay that's a lie, maybe some cat bypass pipes so I don't burn them out.

If anyone else has any tips on carbed cars please let me know. My knowledge on carbureted cars is very limited (only to GM SBCs and BBCs of the 1970s). CIS and LH Jetronic I have become an SME.

 

I have a '78 GTS that I am replacing the cats on with Hyperflows. I should be able to answer any questions from firsthand experience soon.

 

Hyperflow cats are CARB legal now???

 

I can't comment specifically, but when I had to get the cat replaced on a different car (1991 BMW 318i), the owner of the Licensed SMOG Repair Joint made a passing comment that today's cats are constructed much better than those of just 5 years ago. He said availability is much better now too.

My car is starting to sound like one of my cats is trying to cough up a hairball and I still worry about finding cats which fit and have both the air injection and thermocouple ports. ... I know which side to test, but I shall see next SMOG test if I need to replace the cat(s). Gulp.

 

They aren't CARB as far as I know. Of course, since the 308 was made before CARB was required, as long as the cats weren't replaced, they should be legal for the car... My guess is with the diaper on, the car will pass visual without problems.

 

That makes sense. What you can't see, can't hurt you

You guys are getting me excited here for this car!

 

eVry few CATS are BAR Certified labeled, so trouble there.

There should be thermocouples in them (or in exhaust adjacent) as from 1978 onwards, the SLOW DOWN light appears in the dash to indicate malfunction.

The combination of carbs and CATS is the most explosive of all the years IMO.

A single bank ignition failure, if not turned off immediately, flashes off as fire in the engine bay.
Within the CAT certainly, but the glow will start to melt adjacent stuff immediately.

If not in California I would advise new cams and "Offroad Only" type of ownership..

 

Cali wants "all systems in place and working" matching the Model year.

That said, I have heard of electric air injection systems, which is certainly better than the cam driven OEM pumps.

That might work.

It's the CATs themselves and the BAR labeling that gets sticky, legally.
And the carbs and timing have to be on the razor's edge.

My NON CAT car "made the numbers" when driven right from shop and tested Full Temp 210 degrees hot.
Have to know that method.

Then, at 25 years, Texas quit caring...

 

Curious to ask, but when switching to non-factory cats, I assume there are power gains due to the incorporation of modern technology in emissions?

 

Does anyone know a good independent in Marin County?

This sucker needs a major and a new clutch. The dealer is talking five figures. I'm ready to walk away from this one.

 

Deal fell through, back to looking.

 

Call Larry Buskirk in Novato if you get a car. 415-883-8875. Should be less than dealer but nothing on these cars are cheap.

 

Mind giving me a contact number? I'm looking for one too, located Bay Area and have my own shop.

 

It would be great to have a few more 308 owners in the SF area.

 

Workin' on it...

Someone just has to sell me their car for the right price.